Being sued, becoming a PI and money

Tommy: It's the Daily Talk Show, everyone. Episode 54.

Josh: 54.

Tommy: It's, it's confusing because we started, uh, on a random day.

Josh: If we just started one day earlier, it would have—

Tommy: yeah, I think one day later—

Josh: no, one day earlier, it would have been Monday, Tuesday, when Friday would be 55. Anyway, that's, uh, what did you look at on your watch?

Tommy: I wasn't, I wasn't looking at my watch, I was looking at my bike.

Josh: It is, uh, reflecting on the good old times. It's a fucking good-looking bike. Specialized. It's like a cross between almost a mountain bike— there's no suspension— and a road bike.

Tommy: It's a cyclocross, they call it. They call it cyclocross.

Josh: Cyclocross.

Tommy: Yes, cyclocross. Cyclocross. Yeah, it's, um, you see on the side, I think it says CRLX or something.

Josh: Oh yeah.

Tommy: Anyway, yeah, I bought that, uh, off Hamish Blake, uh, 2 years ago. 2 years ago.

Josh: Is that the comedian guy?

Tommy: Comedian guy, but he, um, and, uh, and my mate, and he basically— when we, uh, I was asking him what bike to buy on over text message, and he said— I was sending him a few links, and I just wanted something real basic that I could just ride around.

Josh: He's a cycling guy, but did you know he might have had a spare bike? Everything that—

Tommy: I didn't think it at all. I was literally like, man, what should I get? I'm a bit stuck. And he was like, man, I can't allow you to be riding any of those shit bikes. And he's like, I've got a bike that I've only, uh, only bought recently. But basically he got like a, a deal where Giant were giving him bikes, so he didn't need the Specialized one anymore. So he gave me a sick deal, basically like half price than what he paid.

Josh: How much? What is Stinger?

Tommy: It was, uh, $1,100.

Josh: That's a good price.

Tommy: Uh, no, yeah, $1,100 maybe. Yeah, and I think it was $2,500 new.

Josh: Do you own Lycra?

Tommy: Yeah, I spent, uh, over $400 on Lycra.

Josh: Have you worn said Lycra?

Tommy: I've worn it one, uh, I've taken more photos of me in the Lycra than I've actually gone on rides with it. Yeah, because when I was getting— I was like, oh, I felt like—

Josh: hang on, wait, where do these go?

Tommy: I put one on Instagram. It's a pretty—

Josh: was it crutch? Was that involved?

Tommy: A little bit. But basically the reason I was looking at it is I'm trying to work out what to do because it's a fucking good bike, and Bree's like, it's a great bike, don't, don't sell it.

Josh: The thing with it though, for me, as a, as a— the kind of bike riding I'd want to do See, I want to thrash that a lot more. You can't thrash that bike. It's quite rigid, so it's like still hard wheels. So going up, you know, gutters and shit, I'd buckle the wheel. So don't lend it to me when you go on a road—

Tommy: it's not like a road bike, it's like a hybrid.

Josh: Yeah, but still, you'd fuck that.

Tommy: But I'm trying to work out whether to sell it or not.

Josh: Good resale, I think. Yeah, you'll get for that. Get rid of it.

Tommy: I may ask him, like, mate, do you mind just fucking signing on this thing and sell it as a bit of memorabilia? I don't think I rode it enough. I think I I could pass it off as—

Josh: see, he's sponsored by Giant, or what, he's got a deal with them, but inadvertently he's actually done an ad for Specialized through our podcast, through you.

Tommy: It's very true. But no, he— I mean, there's a reason why he got Giant, because this is—

Josh: he was thinking about what we wanted to talk about before, and I, I just kept coming back to being sued, getting sued, or suing somebody. Yeah, I think it's a very interesting topic.

Tommy: Do you—

Josh: have you been sued? Have you— do you know anyone who's been sued?

Tommy: No, I've, uh, I've got, uh, friends who have, uh, in different processes of being sued.

Josh: They've been sued?

Tommy: Yeah.

Josh: What's the storey about Matt D'Avella? Yeah, Matt, he's got another plug. He's got a great podcast, by the way.

Tommy: Yeah, no, Matt D'Avella did a, uh— he's, uh, the guy who directed Minimalism, the documentary, but Beyond that, he's done a bunch of, uh, cool shit, including the InVision doco, um, Design Disruptors. But, uh, he, when he was like in college, did a, a, uh, I think it was like a music video parody of a supermarket. And it's like them in the supermarket, and they had the logos and shit in there and all that sort of thing. So it's like the equivalent of going into a Woolworths.

Josh: Yeah.

Tommy: And, uh, yeah, he, um, sexually provocative movement. I think they're like pretending to spit in the food or whatever. Anyway, um, yeah, they got a call from the journalists, a journalist being like, hey, just at the courthouse, like, this company is suing you for like $5 million.

Josh: The thing about being sued is it's not a quick process. No, it drags on. And I could just imagine the weight you'd feel.

Tommy: So you've never been sued?

Josh: No. I'll get to a fun storey about my uncle. No, I've never been sued. Nothing's come up yet. Um, but like, imagine the time frame from the moment you get a letter, we get served, or you get notified. Because it's not like the cops come and arrest you, you know, it's clear, like, you're fucked. Yeah, you've been arrested, you're going— it's like, it's the start of a battle. Yeah, it's a battle, a slow battle. My uncle owns a sports center.

Tommy: Yeah.

Josh: Um, and They do netball, indoor soccer. It's had a few years. I started working there when I was 13. I worked, um, on Saturday mornings when the netball was on, and I would, uh—

Tommy: Why'd you pick netball? It just happened?

Josh: No, it's just, it was where the Grand Prix is held in Melbourne. There's a big, uh, where the cars pull in.

Tommy: Okay.

Josh: And so there was this—

Tommy: Just imagine sleazy young Tommy Jacket with all the netballers.

Josh: Go off, mate. What did you—

Tommy: what was your role?

Josh: This was back, and I was thinking, I think about this also, food handling. We would put the, you know, the red hot dogs into a big vat of water. Yeah, cook them up and serve them. I didn't have a food handling thing. Yeah, so it was back probably when you didn't have to have this. Yeah, then we did like sausage rolls, frozen ones, would whack in, get them going. Pies, um, Killer Pythons.

Tommy: Fuck, I love any food at a canteen.

Josh: Oh, this was back also when milk drinks were around, so like these weird kind of like—

Tommy: not fucking refrigerated.

Josh: No, no, they're refrigerated, but my point is they, they, they're not in a great deal of venues anymore, like funky sugary milks, whereas they've moved to more protein shakes and maybe a few nippies. Yeah, remember nippies? Do you forget the nippies?

Tommy: Are they— you mean like beer?

Josh: No, iced coffees, iced chocolates.

Tommy: Oh yeah, of course. Yes, yes, yes. What am I thinking of?

Josh: Nobbies? Nuts?

Tommy: No, no.

Josh: He's nuts. Anyway, so I worked in this. I was folding bibs and, you know, running, doing run sheets for the games and taking payment. It was good. It's pretty much where I learned how to count, like, as much as I did in school, as in count money. Like, I'd have to do the till.

Tommy: Oh, that's cool.

Josh: I fucking got really good at it. Yeah, it's a good skill to have.

Tommy: Like, 14?

Josh: I would have— no, I still would have been 13 then. It's like, as soon as you could start working, he gave me a job there.

Tommy: Great.

Josh: $13 an hour.

Tommy: That's good.

Josh: Anyway, so it's the sports centre and, um, you know, there's balls flying everywhere as, as, as there is at sports centres that require balls to play the sport. A guy sued him, yeah, for being hit by a soccer ball.

Tommy: Oh, get fucked.

Josh: Fuck off. Here's the thing though, backstory. This bloke had also sued a bunch of other people for stupid shit. So the court system knew of him, right? Yeah. And so the thing is, insurance companies— so his insurance company actually have to fight the lawsuit.

Tommy: Yeah.

Josh: And so it's like, oh, hey Greg, uh, what is it this week?

Tommy: Well, bloody soccer ball hit me in the face. It's a bit of that vibe, isn't it? Oh, hey Greg, what's up? Oh, just Fucking had McDonald's hot chips and they were too hot. Yeah, burn me fucking lip. It was scorching. Fuck, that's outrageous. Yeah, go on.

Josh: And so the insurance— so basically, in short, the insurance company will determine whether or not they'll fight it based on a bunch of stuff.

Tommy: Just be clear though, the insurance would come from— so you pay, uh, but that would be your uncle's insurance.

Josh: Yeah, so the company that he has, it'd be like a liability, public liability or something.

Tommy: I'm thinking QBE or Aon or like an insurance company, but he's— because as people, I guess we don't have insurance. So, okay, so he's called— so he's basically when they sue someone, then it goes through.

Josh: Yeah, so they sue for whatever damages, loss of work, inability to function, you know, normally, whatever. Um, and, and so yeah, they decide whether or not they'll pursue it, because if there's a case, they hold it to a stronger case, they'd have a legal department internally. But they decided to go after this guy and, um, and like, I don't know if they countersued him, but they fight the charges. I actually don't know what happened. I know that my uncle, nothing happened. Yeah, beyond just them, this guy actioning a lawsuit. But fuck me, it's like the people that slip out, you know, go to sleep over in fucking, um, what do you call it?

Tommy: Yeah, you know, um, Jo, who we hung out with a bit today, her dad is a doctor for insurance stuff. So he'll be in the process, he'll basically, you know, people doing dodgy fucking claims and stuff like WorkCover claims. He deals with all of that sort of stuff. So he'll have to go in and work out, and you'll— they do full investigations of people. So they'll, um, you know, people will be fucking limping or whatever, and then they, they have footage of them being fucking normal.

Josh: They're the best on ACA, just like the dude cruising in, get a fucking hot dog. It's always like he's doing something really normal. So it's like, it's not even like he's trying to fucking do a backflip over a fence. No, but it's just like they catch him the moment he got Milk for that.

Tommy: I mean, that's where they're— it's that, uh, because they're fucking suing because they apparently they can't do these normal things. Yeah, yeah, right.

Josh: Have you— oh, that's right. Yeah, so it's just fucking— we're catching this bloke out. Yeah, says you can't go to the shops, get a Slurpee.

Tommy: I would fuck— I would, uh, I don't know if we've spoken about it before, but the, uh, the PI thing really interests me.

Josh: I think you'd be a fucking awesome PI.

Tommy: I would get like just the process of like, I'll tell you why. Imagine you're the job interviewer.

Josh: Yeah.

Tommy: And you're from a recruitment company, you're asking. I mean, some of the things that I would say, like I like the reason why I'd be great PI, love fucking sitting. You know I love sitting. The idea of sitting in a car, you know I love traffic.

Josh: I've got a storey for you.

Tommy: Okay, great.

Josh: No, I've got a storey for you about a PI. Fuck, I can't believe that.

Tommy: Anyway, so anyway, the— yeah, so getting to sit around, I like the idea of that being work. Like, I like the idea of just being like— say if we— it'd be good to do it with someone else. So say if you and I were being PIs where it's like, man, got work, got to be up at 5 o'clock to see this person go and see if they're like injured or whatever. Let's go to McCafé beforehand, get a little fucking hash brown, little coffee from McCafé, just fucking sit. It's like winter or whatever, got the fucking heater on, fucking Fifi, Fev and Byron on the fucking radio, just like this, or listen a bit of fucking Joe Rogan or some shit.

Josh: You've talked everything other than the work at this point.

Tommy: Well, no, this is the work. That's what's fucking— it's true.

Josh: It's because it's not work you like.

Tommy: Yeah, no, I like the idea of just like— I wouldn't hire you if I was No, because all you've got to do is be fucking stealth and be able to like use cameras and shit. So we would be like sitting around and just, you got to make sure the fucking windows don't fog up because you need to be able to see through them.

Josh: But see, here's the thing, that like the good ones are probably hard cunts. Yeah, like a stealth, just rough. No, well then, yeah, they've been around. So this guy that I had coffee with, I don't want to say his name or any attachments to it because he, um he'll probably hear this somehow. It's probably got fucking filters out. He was an ex-person from like high up in the military.

Tommy: Yeah, it's Craig Harper, everyone.

Josh: No, no, no, he was not in the military, although he wears cargo pants.

Tommy: He does have— I just thought he didn't have legs.

Josh: Anyway, this guy was telling me at coffee that he was a PI and then he was doing a job for a socialite Melbourne woman who was trying to see their ex-husband or something.

Tommy: Yeah.

Josh: And he was telling me about how he legitimately fucking crawls under cars, puts GPS systems onto the car, and he goes to hotel rooms.

Tommy: Yeah.

Josh: And he puts into the, um, the power sockets.

Tommy: Yeah. Putting cameras and shit.

Josh: Correct. Audio devices.

Tommy: And he's making it sound like it's real fucking like clever. I don't like crawling under cars. No, can't. Oh, you're literally putting your arm under, like, yeah, it's— he's, he's got— getting into it because he likes the sell of the story. And I get it, I would do the same thing.

Josh: I think he's— he acquired a set of skills that were good for taking down people.

Tommy: He went to ispy.com and bought a couple of fucking gadgets. No, but seriously, right? The other gadget which would be sick, and I played with one of these at the NAB, the National Association a broadcaster's expo that happens. It's actually happening in like a month's time in Vegas. Yeah, I was there last year and there's, um, a company that do long-range audio. So it's used commonly, you'll see it used in sporting events and shit. So just detailed stuff where if you've got fucking like ball sports and stuff and you want to pick up those sounds, you have these and it's like a dish sort of looks like it's like a, um, yeah, like a cone.

Josh: A satellite dish.

Tommy: Yeah, and you point it and it's like really targeted. So someone could be 50 metres away, you point it, and then you point it and you can hear it. It's really, it's really tinny, so you need to like post-process it to make it sound better. Yeah, but, um, yeah, you can use that. And they were— they created a product which was a smaller version. So imagine like a satellite-looking thing and it's aimed at, um, people doing talks. So rather than having them use a lav mic, you basically just have this satellite thing, and because you're panning towards where they are, you always get their audio, which I think is a bit of a shit.

Josh: The early days of inventions are always a bit fucking weird. Yeah, because right, right there, like, imagine being that dude down or at an event filming and you put this bit—

Tommy: yeah, well, it's like my EasyRig. I mean, not that that's like a weird looking, but that's that fucking thing that I get so many people talking. It's a talking point. It's like a— How would you describe it? What does it look like?

Josh: So, imagine if you put a backpack on, you cut the actual backpack off. So, now you've just got the straps holding the bag on in the back of the back— the backpack. And then they put on like this pole that runs up your spine and then curves over. Yeah. And so it's like the fishing rod that you call it a fish.

Tommy: Yeah, that you would like dangle over you to, um, with a carrot or something.

Josh: Yeah, so the way the idea of it is that it takes the weight of the camera away from your arms and supports it by holding it above by this dangling rope.

Tommy: Yeah, it basically hangs my camera at my face level and then I can do whatever I want with it. I can pull it down and Um, but yeah, I get a lot of people talking about that sort of thing. Have you ever been an early adopter? Have you seen early stages of stuff?

Josh: Early to drones, quite early. Not really, not really drone in terms of, um, consumer, not prosumer.

Tommy: So like, you got the Mavic as soon as it came out, which was good investment, the first, the first drone in its class, really the first like super simple drone.

Josh: They had all those DJI—

Tommy: well, they had the Phantom 3, Phantom 3, you know, like the big—

Josh: yeah, I, I was— I could be a cowboy and take it everywhere. Yeah, but fuck me, that, that did wonders for me.

Tommy: Yeah, so you've gone off the drone, so you've gone off drones. I remember like 2 years ago, uh, when we were, uh, sort of early stages of our business businesses, that was your bread and butter. You were the drone guy.

Josh: I've made money from using a drone once or twice. Yeah, I make money from using a drone on the other side as a marketing tool. Yeah, and I never thought about it like that. But also the— I kind of had a break. There was like a period where I wasn't really making my own videos, and this was like when Bodhi was being born. I think around that time.

Tommy: What, during the birth? You're—

Josh: you're during the birth? Yeah, I missed it. I was out flying the drone. No, but before, I don't know, I was just— I, I was feeling this stress at this one point. I just was flying my drone a lot and, um, and making drone videos. Yeah, I think they were great. They're visually great, and, and I'll still continue to use it, but I now enjoy— I think I like making stuff that's not just visual. It's like the storey to it too.

Tommy: Well, it's a novel thing, right? You were just like playing. You were toying around with your craft. And then once you've done that, it's like, okay, now what? But the other thing too is you were, um, you were doing it when there wasn't the sort of spotlight around regulations. Yeah, yeah. So like, I remember flying it with you and we're like near the city and like, ah, do you reckon we can fly here? It's like, oh yeah, should be fine. Whereas like, there's no using that as an excuse anymore.

Josh: Yeah, there's not, because all the apps now telling you where you can fly or not. And I, I definitely feel that there's fucking idiots on the internet just coming down on people with their footage. Yeah, and just, it's just purely because they don't have the balls.

Tommy: Well, we've done it, we've done a whole, uh, we did a whole episode on the sheriffs. It feels like such a long time ago, doesn't it, that episode?

Josh: We did one talking about just these different Facebook pages. They're like bitchy Facebook pages that, um, of people who follow the drone rules very strictly and will come down on you hard if you, if you break those rules. There was another Facebook page I've um, interestingly heard about recently, and it was like a feminist's Facebook page.

Tommy: Yeah.

Josh: And the word from my source was that they get— they will like gang up on people on there if they start saying anything that's against what they're saying, like the slightest bit, and bully people out of the page. Yeah, really fascinating.

Tommy: Yeah.

Josh: So, but there's a— there's like heap of niche pages, closed groups that would be very fucking unusual.

Tommy: Yeah, well, I think that it's a, um, because if, if there's a feminist page, they're going to get people who are just obviously actively, you know, trying to provoke. But then there's also the Light and Shade, which is like, what does it mean to be a feminist?

Josh: And that's more angry, like the the, the people you see picketing, or like, or like very at the front of the movement with the aggression, with a bit of separation, you know, like it's a us against them, which is not everybody. Yeah, who's a feminist? It's like, it's just—

Tommy: and that's what we spoke about on it like a previous episode, which is like, I call myself a feminist, most people I know do, and you know, I think that it's the, uh Yeah, it's— but there, there are people in all sides of every single camp that are using different fucking ideologies, or whatever you want to call it, to basically, um— I don't think ideology is actually the right word, but, um, they're using these names as a way of justifying their actions, which aren't necessarily agreed upon by everyone within those things. That's why I think, you know, people are moving away from calling themselves certain things. That's why I don't like, you know, saying you're left or you're right or you're this or you're that. Like, I'm just like, I just have my, uh, my views.

Josh: But you, you've even said it before about the categories people like to fit somewhere, and, or even from the outside, maybe not even people like to fit somewhere people like to fit someone in somewhere so it makes sense to them. Well, Josh, yeah, I get it, he's right, his views are very right. Yeah, yeah, okay.

Tommy: Yeah, I think, yeah, I think people do that because it, uh, I think it's a way of taking a complex issue and simplifying it. And we, I think we do that a lot. And, um, I think people can be very dogmatic about those types of things. And I think that it's, uh, it's limiting. It's, it's real. It's what I like to think about is the light and shade in things, and that just because someone might be a conservative or this or that, they might be, you know, it doesn't mean— you can be a conservative but you don't have to be a racist, right? Where it's like, I think that, you know, uh, you know, and the, the other the other way around, which is like, um, uh, you can, you can believe in so, you know, the equality of men and women and, you know, but, uh, there might be some other things which you think in isolation isn't part of that. But I think that where we've always ended up landing on this sort of thing is I don't like getting bogged down in certain things which might uh, affect the overall thing that we're trying to do. Which is like, yes, there might be, there might be these, um, paradoxes or examples where these things don't necessarily match up, or there might be, there might be a good debate for certain things, but it shouldn't, I don't think, come at the expense of the broader thing that we're trying to do.

Josh: Which, but I think also it there are the right people to do that for different aspects of things.

Tommy: Are you someone— so I want to talk, uh, about a few topics and you can tell me whether it's something that you actively talk about or how you feel about it. Politics? Nah, you don't talk politics?

Josh: I don't know enough. Yeah, it's one thing I probably steer clear of because I don't know.

Tommy: Yeah. What about money?

Josh: Um, gimme some.

Tommy: How do you feel about conversations around money? Do you have to be ideal? Yeah. Have you— because I think, you know, we talk about family values and all that sort of thing, and I think I've mentioned that to you before, where it's like my parents always said to me they'd buy me really nice shoes and they would say, if you fucking tell anyone how much these shoes cost—

Josh: yeah, I didn't know that mindset. Yeah. Where do you think that came from?

Tommy: I think it came from this idea which is like, you— I grew up in an area where not everyone had these things. And, um, while that— whilst it was something that I could afford, it wasn't something that should— it wasn't a part of our identity, or it didn't make me a better person because I had those shoes. I was just lucky, and I was lucky, you know, not saying that they're unlucky or anything like that, but I think that it, um Yeah, it was, um, it was building empathy. It's saying just because you've been given these shoes doesn't mean that this is something that everyone gets, so don't treat—

Josh: So you're saying the lesson came through for you, or—

Tommy: Yeah, the lesson did come through.

Josh: See, I didn't have those lessons, but I don't think I— like, I got good shoes and kids I went to school with had better shoes and got more stuff, and then I was hanging out with kids that had fucking nothing. Because they were poor. And so yeah, I don't know, I'll give you an example.

Tommy: Like, there was kids at school that would—

Josh: the first thing you were the kid that would moonwalk into school, fucking cheque out these.

Tommy: No, but there was— there were kids that where you'd be like, oh, you'd say, oh, awesome shoes. And like, yeah, $130, right? Or I remember, and the interesting thing was, and I think that this is actually the lower socioeconomic end is probably more common. I remember one kid who I was good friends with, he was pretty poor and he was sort of like in a sort of, um, uh, single— I think he was being brought up with like a single parent type of deal. And his dad would give him like $50 cash for his birthday when he was like really young, right? Well, so, you know, you're talking like grade 2 or grade 3 and would get like $50 cash. And that was seen as like, he was like, we as kids at the time, we're like, fuck, he got $50 from his dad. Like, how much? What does his dad do for work? You know, like, we thought that was a really big deal when in reality it's, it was, it wasn't coming from a place of sort of wealth in any of those definitions.

Josh: As a kid, it was, who's— I see rich people 'Oh, this person's rich,' or 'This person's got a lot of money.' I never thought about salaries. I never thought about how much people earned. It was just, 'This guy's rich,' or 'They're a millionaire.' Remember? 'Oh, they're a millionaire.' Yeah. Oh, he's million— he's got millions. I laughed the other day. I was watching, uh, uh, was it, uh, Millionaires and, uh, something. It's a show about these millionaires that become homeless for 9 days in Melbourne. It was like an ABC show. It's really cool. It's like to give them a new perspective. They go out in the streets and, and one of them was like self-made millionaire, and they, and they had him on. He's like, my net worth is probably standing at around $14 million. I laughed because I was like, $14 million?

Tommy: You got $14 million? Great, you, you own a house.

Josh: Yeah, I know, but it's like, that's not rich now. Rich, like who you see on fucking Instagram, they got a $20 million house. To have a $20 million house, you need $70 million.

Tommy: But also, I think it also depends on where you get money from too, right? Like, if you were self-made and you didn't come from something like, you know, fucking a million dollars would feel like— for some people, rich is owning their own house.

Josh: Yeah, 100%.

Tommy: And there's going to be people who, who, who never get that opportunity.

Josh: But my, like, I guess comparison is back in the day it was they've got a million dollars, they're a millionaire.

Tommy: Yeah, yeah, the millionaire thing was, was a big one.

Josh: Now it's all about the billionaire.

Tommy: I don't know. Yeah, the old big B.

Josh: You know who the richest person in the world is?

Tommy: Just quickly, uh, would it be Jeff Bezos? Correct. Yeah, uh, founder of Amazon. Yeah.

Josh: Um, that cunt has fucking been taking some anti-aging drugs because he's looking good. I think I said on this podcast, look up Jeff Bezos evolution. Literally has him back in the '80s and he looks younger today. Yeah, he's ripped, he's fucking bald head, he looks like Jason Statham.

Tommy: He looks, he looks like a weapon, looks like a P.I. He looks pretty amazing. Yeah, but, um, no, I think, uh, money's an interesting thing, man.

Josh: So as an adult, I, I don't really have much of an issue talking about money.

Tommy: Yeah, but I don't like—

Josh: I don't have money to flaunt. Yeah, so I don't know what that looks like when I do have money to flaunt, how I'll feel.

Tommy: I think it's, um, I think some people attach their identity to it a lot.

Josh: Yeah, um, man, I've just been trying to build on— and it's you and I both have a similar mindset of we will make it work, we will make it at some point, and it's just, it's kind of when. It's not, that's not even a cocky thing, but it's like I haven't worried about the money. It's, yeah, when you have your own business you can easily live in a world of fucking, I need dollars, dollars, dollars.

Tommy: Well, I mean, that's the— and the funny thing about— and everyone has a different perception. Yeah, because, you know, I've told you this before where it's like I, I've had $30,000 of debt and been like, I've still got some money, I still can like, I can still get by and all that sort of thing, I feel fine. And there's other people who are like, man, I've got no money at the moment, like I really need to be careful. And they've got like a deposit for a house in the bank. Yeah. And so everyone has a different perception, and I think it's good to— I've tweaked stuff now, so it's like, okay, I have money in the bank and I want it. Like, I don't necessarily want to be, you know, I was able to finance a lifestyle, the lifestyle essentially that I've had since the age of 21 has been funded thanks to banks. But the thing is, and I don't have a house, I don't have anything like that, but I feel like the— it's given me the ability now, now that I've— I feel like I was paying, spending more money than I was earning. And I feel like for the first time in the last 12 months, I'm able to have that shift where I'm able to say, okay, I, um, I can put stuff aside and I can have savings and I'm saving for things. And the interesting thing is cash feels way different to credit, right? Like, you spend it the same way, but if you spend— if you've, if you've got money in the bank, you know, it's like, I'm gonna have all this money in the bank for when I go away on my trip. And I feel like the way that I'm going to spend it— like, I fucking bankrolled trips purely on credit cards before, right? And the way you spend it, it's like this real disconnected thing. But when I'm fucking spending my own money, I think I'm gonna go like way tighter than what I say.

Josh: I, I think you will too, to some degree.

Tommy: Well, because it's that thing of like, you know, it's even the Gumtree shit I'm doing and just having cat— like We don't use cash that much any— you know, uh, that much.

Josh: I can't tell you when I've had cash last.

Tommy: I, I've never— I don't think I've ever been paid cash for a job. The only— like, I've had— I've done maybe one cashy— actually, not even a cashy in my life. I've done one job where I was doing it for a golfer, and it was a party. There was an event, and I was filming and all that sort of thing. I would have been 20 at the time, did a, uh, you know, it was like maybe a $3,000 job or whatever. Anyway, the, uh, the golfer who I was doing it for came up to me, he's like, thanks mate, just gave me like a wad of 50s, said thanks so much. It was like $400, so it's a small wad, so 50s, it was good. And I, I just remember being like, fuck, this is huge. Yeah, like that was massive.

Josh: Well, you hope the bigger the business, you hope that you're probably not getting paid in cash the bigger the business you start doing. No one's coming over with $8K cash to hand over. Thanks for that video, mate. I reckon they wouldn't do it because it'd be feeling like they're fucking parting with too much. Yeah, it'd be like, look at this fucking money in my hand, versus accounts department just quickly flick that over, right?

Tommy: Exactly. I was saying to Bree that before the trip, um, because I like, I think it's a, it's an interesting one, right? Because I'm comfortable I'm comfortable talking. It's this weird, um, what's, what's, what does everyone call it? Humble brag. It's literally like a humble brag that I'm sort of doing, which is like, I didn't have money and now I've finally got money. But the thing is, like, it's only been like, I've spent so much of my time not there, and I've told people that, like, I've been pretty, uh, transparent with it. I've never gone, but I've always felt even though I was outside of my means, it never felt like that for me. I'd been treating it like a credit line where it's like, okay, I want to do all these things and I know that I can elevate my career by— if I do all this stuff, it's going to give these opportunities, I'm going to be able to do that stuff.

Josh: I had a— we went to America, me and my mate, years ago, and he just— I remember him just, ah, he was just— he's almost just fucking huffing and puffing around the hotel room. Yeah, about not having any money. Fucking chill out, bro. Yeah, I had my credit card. Yeah, but like, I'm not feeling that trip now all those years later. And the anxiety and shit he was feeling, yeah, which he doesn't now. He wouldn't be thinking of that. And he came back and he like, he wasn't bad off.

Tommy: Well, the thing is, it's like, I always like, I remember, you know, going to Europe and we're going like, oh fuck, we're, um, we're gonna have to spend like 5 grand on the credit card or stuff like that. It's like, okay, that's like how many weeks of work? Like a few weeks of work, or, you know, if that. It's like, it makes complete fucking sense. And that was when it's a, um, you know, a salary. I think the interesting thing now is, now that we're in businesses, we have the— our earning potential goes up significantly, um, but also there's that lack of security as well, uh, so it's you're playing with different things. And I think that people that have the willingness to make bigger risks, and there's good debt and there's bad debt.

Josh: I was just thinking then, relationship with money, reflecting on your own, because everyone's is different, right? We've heard an insight into yours and a bit of mine, and that's like, you're pretty introspective and you're looking, you know, you're thinking about yourself and your approach and why you think that. That is the tool that people need to implement to their own life to go, what's my fucking relationship with money? Is it healthy? Am I actually telling an absolute bullshit story? 'Cause the storey of you and the credit card thing, it was a storey of some bullshit and you were okay, you got through that. Imagine the person that does that and fucking buys the Chanel bag for 10 grand on the fucking credit card.

Tommy: And that's the thing that I don't completely understand, right? So for me, like the biggest purchase that I ever made would have been my FS7, my camera, right? Which I bought 3 years ago for, you know, 15 grand or whatever, put the whole thing on a credit card and balance transferred it. And that was the tipping point. That was like having that for a few months and being like, oh fuck, like I should really be using this asset like beyond just like doing my, the work that I was doing, like I was working full-time. I'm like, I could be going out and doing jobs with this and making way more. And so that debt was what pushed me to actually do it. And then it's like, fuck, it makes so much sense.

Josh: So you stretched— it did, it stretched you.

Tommy: I think you're being stretched makes, makes a lot of, makes a lot of sense. I remember seeing one guy on Facebook saying, hey, I just paid off This was like quite controversial, I think. He said, I just paid off, um, this bike, motorbike that I bought, and my mentor has always told me that I should always be paying something off. What should I buy next? And his thing is, if you don't have something to pay off, what's the point in making money? And so his mentor whole thing was, even if it's a small loan, always have something so you fucking have that drive. And I think there's—

Josh: he's mistaken the physical object with a goal.

Tommy: Yeah, just have a goal.

Josh: Yeah, set your family up or send your kid to school or fucking—

Tommy: so you plan it? So I forgot what you said. Are you going to send Bodhi to a— what sort of school?

Josh: Not even thought about. Yeah, not even thought about it.

Tommy: Yeah, well, because things change so quickly, especially in the industries we're in. Yeah, like, and the funny thing is that you can be in the same role. The person who's— you can be doing, having a radio show and be a multi-multi-millionaire, and you can be on a radio show with an award wage and just getting enough, right? It's the same with comedians. There are— there is Jerry Seinfeld, and there is fucking Craig living at his parents' house doing fucking shows, making fuck all money. Um, and yeah, no, I think it's, it's a, it's a good point to think about where you are financially, but also where, like, what are some of the limiting factors that, like, the mindset that's maybe limiting your growth. Because my thing is that if you— if there's something you want to do and you're like, I can't do it because I don't have the money, like, work out what the what is the benefit, right? If the benefit— if it's like, if only I had $10,000, I could do this thing which would enable this thing, then fucking like, if you believe in it, if it's really got the return that you think it has, fucking borrow the $10,000, I reckon. I think that that's probably an uncommon—

Josh: I almost think that that advice for people— I don't know, it's not advice, you're just thinking out loud. But I think the people that will go and do it aren't the people needing to hear that advice because they will do it.

Tommy: Yeah, 100%.

Josh: So it's like, if you were doubting doing that severely, it's probably you're not the person to do that. Yeah, there might be another solution to get the same result, right?

Tommy: Yeah, people self-filter.

Josh: This has been an episode of money because being sued is all for money. Yeah, fucking— a private investigator makes money. Every, you know, everything is kind of relating back to money of what we're talking about.

Tommy: I also think it's probably, um all these things tie into identity. So, um, it's about, you know, your position in society. Being sued, what are people worried about? They're worried about their position. What is this going to say publicly about me and about my life? What is it going to do about my financial standing? Um, yeah, it's a, uh, I think that a lot of, you know, like we, uh, even today hanging out with, you know, someone who is really wealthy, and he says, I wish I could do this, I wish I could do that. And the question that you have to ask is, why not? And, and so much of the time, these, these reasons, or the things that we're giving ourselves as reasons, are just little, little cushions which we call excuses, just to save us from the pain of reflection and realisation that there's nothing fucking stopping us. And if you can look around and you can see— if you can look around and see that there is someone in a lesser position than you financially, education-wise, whatever it is, and they've fucking done it, then there is no excuse.

Josh: Yeah, totally.

Tommy: It's the Daily Talk Show, everyone. Uh, today is Thursday, tomorrow is Good Friday, so we're gonna have to hang out tomorrow.

Josh: I'm going to Lawn tomorrow.

Tommy: What time?

Josh: I don't know. Okay, well, that's probably a discussion. We have to sort that out, but we'll get it done because that's what we do.

Tommy: Good Friday, can I just quickly say, I love fucking every Good Friday watching the Children's Appeal.

Josh: Oh, what is that?

Tommy: Good Friday Children's Appeal. They donate money, but just thinking, oh no, I did donate last year, but I should do that again. But yes, whatever you're doing over Easter, enjoy. We'll be here tomorrow eating chocolate chatting. Remember, send us an email, hi@thedailytalkshow.com. Michelle, thanks for your email. I hope this is a bit, bit of a better fucking arc. I, I do.

Josh: I appreciate the feedback, and it was— we're a bit flat yesterday.

Tommy: Yeah. And, uh, Leon, thank you so much for the message of support as well.

Josh: And BMAC, it's 41 minutes.

Tommy: We're doing— mate, BMAC, we literally have done this last 15 fucking minutes for you because otherwise we'd be out of here. The Daily Talk Show, everyone. Remember, please review us on fucking iTunes. You know what, stop what you're doing, get out of your fucking rut, and, you know, just— and fucking review us.

Josh: Send us money.

Tommy: Send us money and write us a fucking review.

Josh: I don't know how you get it to us.

Tommy: Um, well, yeah, we're going to give cash to every person that does a review. You have to send us an email: hi@thedailytalkshow.com. Uh, we'll see you tomorrow, everyone.

Josh: Bye.