Lying

Tommy: It's a very low barrier to get into the Gronk Squad.

Josh: That's crazy. We've committed to do the Daily Talk Show for 10 years.

Tommy: Hi guys. Hi guys.

Josh: Put it in the calendar. I'd just like to cheque the temperature in the room. I told you my squeegee story.

Tommy: It is outrageous.

Josh: Come on, let's go. It's the Daily Talk Show episode 986.

Tommy: What is happening?

Josh: G'day listeners.

Tommy: What time is it? What day is it?

Josh: The day, it's Wednesday.

Tommy: Wednesday, yeah.

Josh: 3:50 PM here in Melbourne. Been a bit wet out on the road, so be careful if you are driving.

Tommy: Have you been driving?

Josh: This morning I did, yeah.

Tommy: Was it wet on the way in?

Josh: Yep.

Tommy: I was filming at a great event, closed-door event, and it was 20 floors high, 21 floors actually, at top floor. And it was quite nice in the morning, like it was a little bit wet but then clear. And then we were in the clouds. It was like fogged up. It was nice. And then it sort of lifted. It's awesome. I mean, it's that corporate life in the CBD. Like if you were high up one of the big buildings.

Josh: I'd really get around that.

Tommy: It is nice. It's— there's something about being really, really high up.

Josh: If you could have any type of office for Big Media Company and Full Stack Films, what sort of office would you go for? Money isn't like a problem. What would you do?

Tommy: God, I want both. I want bunker. Like I want sort of that underground. So it's like, you know, you're under the ground. Like it's just concrete around you. They're like basement studios. And then top floor with a penthouse, but then I want it by the water. So it's a bit hard. Where are we going to find a— Yeah, getting close. But then you want, I mean, like Bondi, you could, you want a basement in Bondi plus a rooftop in Bondi across the road from the beach. Now that's living.

Josh: It's nice.

Tommy: I just saw, fuck, I mean, it's, we know comparison's the thief of joy. Yeah. But when you, when you read that the Afterpay founder is 31 years old and worth $2 billion and just bought himself a $20 million house in Bondi, and then the block of flats goes up next door for sale and he buys the whole thing because he doesn't want it to be, you know, on Afterpay. I mean, he's got cash. Yeah, he's the one one guy not needing Afterpay is the man who invented Afterpay.

Josh: I mean, there's many other people that you could compare outside of him. Yeah, but no, it's way better than you.

Tommy: Well, no, but it's looking at the, the age, the accomplice, and then I look at the photo, I'm like, that fuck, he's young.

Josh: Is he nice? He looks good.

Tommy: Attractive young man, world at his fingertips, probably stressed out of his mind. This is where I start going. Depressed, you know, hates everybody.

Josh: Or maybe that's just you.

Tommy: That's what most people will start to do when they say it. But it's fuck, man. Good on him. Good on him.

Josh: What were you reading?

Tommy: What was that in? Maybe it just was like a, you know, you get, I don't know, you might not, but sucked into. So real estate sites write articles like they're a newspaper.

Josh: Yeah.

Tommy: And next minute they've threaded, you know, businessman this and business, you know, business lady this buying this. You know, so they give you a bit of a backstory in the business and then what they've purchased.

Josh: And so, were you looking a lot at real estate?

Tommy: No, I don't know where I saw that. Maybe it was, I mean, my dad, I love like going to my parents' place. My dad's a newspaperman.

Josh: Like, as in delivers newspapers?

Tommy: No, no. I did that. That was my job as a 12-year-old. But growing up at home, we always had a— In our laundry, bottom shelf, just like, which is the ground, the ground. There was a, like a box. And in that box was old newspapers.

Josh: I remember this, like stacks of papers that you would have. And then you would sometimes you would use them for like a school project where you're doing papier-mâché.

Tommy: Papier-mâché fires out in the backyard we used to do. And now, like, I don't have that. So, when I want to make a fire, It's like scratching my head, what should I do? I don't want to go buy a newspaper. And so, but I remember it like, still going to Dad's house now, he's got the bit, he, you know, the smart paper, as in the biggest one you can get. As in The Age, it's just really big and it's spread out on a weekend and he's got all the bits and he likes reading the financial stuff. But in that you're seeing, you know, Rich List or you're seeing, you know, reading about the stock. So anyway, I pick up some So, I get a bit of it there. And then he might say, have you heard about this?

Josh: Yeah.

Tommy: Heard about that?

Josh: I was really impressed with myself at a café the other day because, you know, I can be a bit socially awkward or not knowing what to do. Can be?

Tommy: Really?

Josh: Yeah. Sometimes. Only sometimes.

Tommy: Occasionally.

Josh: Yeah. I was really proud of myself, though, because I saw a newspaper and just picked it up and started reading it and it seemed Like, you know how you have an out-of-body experience and you're like, what do I look like? And it just— I didn't feel socially awkward. Like, I was like, he's an interested guy. Because there's definitely been times where I've—

Tommy: I didn't act weird at all, but I was thinking, look at me.

Josh: Zoom out. Zoom out. Zoom out. Zoom out.

Tommy: Didn't even read the paper.

Josh: Well, that's what I was going to say. I, in a situation like that previously, I've definitely looked at the paper and actually not taking any of it in. Like, all the words are dancing. It's like when you're out to lunch with some friends and you're all talking.

Tommy: Yeah.

Josh: And we're all looking down at the menu. I don't know if it's just me, but I'm never actually reading the menu.

Tommy: The amount of time. Sorry, fourth time around the waiter has to go and come back again.

Josh: I'm the one to say, let's go now. You start with you, and by the time it gets to me. I'll know what I want.

Tommy: I'll try that.

Josh: Probably be a beef burger.

Tommy: I do like that pressure. It's the flip the coin model in, in some ways. It's like, make the decision quick by a flip of a coin. I can't decide. I'll get—

Josh: How often do you have coins though? Never. But anyway, I did feel— I was really proud of myself because it was shit. No, but I was, um, I felt like a poser, but at the same time it was about, um, uh, Iran or whatever. I was like, oh, look at me. In the morning at a cafe reading about international news. Fuck, I'm cool.

Tommy: And did you stay there or you just were—

Josh: No, no, I just read it and I was like, you know what, like I took it in. I was actually reading it and, you know, like, um, I don't know if it's just me, but as I'm reading it's like, um, there's a hyper— like when I'm doing something that's different to what I'm normally doing I become like, not only do I— it zooms out, but then I feel my face. I can feel my face. Do you ever have that when you like become so sort of— No, in the moment that I'm like, I've got a nose, I can feel my— Oh, my lips are moving.

Tommy: But I don't get it when I am reading a paper. I get it if I'm in a conversation with somebody and you have a heightened sense of self. Sure. It's not self-awareness, it's just sensing It's just being stimulated. It's, um, which is why we end up feeling like we are minds trapped inside of somewhere. So there's actually a location to our consciousness, which there's not.

Josh: Should we try— like, you hear these exercises, obviously looking at some— like, looking at an individual for a period of time as like a, um, relationship builder. Have you heard this? But I guess we're doing this right now.

Tommy: I told you about when I had— I did my coaching course. I offer coaching, if you didn't know. Hi, The Daily Talk Show. I'm a life coach. No, I'm not. But I did a life coaching course, Cert 4, didn't finish it. But one of them was to sit— one of the things to do, this is like a weekend workshop. You've never met these people in your life. You come together, but it was about opening up. So, you have your palms facing up. On your, on your, um, on your thighs sitting opposite somebody. Yeah, someone didn't know, very close to them, and you'd look at each other. But at that moment, there's a hyper sense of awareness on yourself. So what are you looking— what this is, the meditation that I do with Sam Harris, it's all about sort of trying to, uh, understand that there's no location of the self. So we think it's behind our eyes, which gives us the You know, like right now I can see my fingertips come in front of my eyes, so I feel like I'm back here. But that's all like the appearance and it's being stimulated by the things like my hands and my eyes and the sense of my eyebrows and my nose and being behind my face.

Josh: Well, it's like the eyes are the windows to the soul and your hands are the windows to intent.

Tommy: I don't know if it's like that. It's not Sam Harris's bit, but—

Josh: That's active defence. Always look at the hands. I've been very good at that, by the way.

Tommy: But if you think about it, If you're looking at me and you're looking at my hands, but look at me. What? Who's looking at me? Like, you're seeing my face, but where are you looking from?

Josh: Sure. Well—

Tommy: It gets real trippy there.

Josh: Have you done that with a mirror before? Where you look at yourself close and I mean, you would do it every day.

Tommy: No, there is a meditation which is looking in the mirror.

Josh: It's a Tommy Jackett meditation.

Tommy: Sorry, I said meditation. I meant mantra. Look at yourself. You're beautiful. Your hair's great. Actually, I didn't need to say that. Everyone else does.

Josh: I mean, the thing, it like, um, being in compromising positions and having a mirror, uh, where I live at the moment, there's a mirror where when you're seated on the toilet, there's a mirror where you can sort of see yourself like side profile.

Tommy: Side profile.

Josh: Okay.

Tommy: Yeah, good to clarify.

Josh: Yeah, but it's just not like, um, You just don't need that negativity, really, do you?

Tommy: What does it do?

Josh: Wouldn't it just like—

Tommy: I mean, I don't mind it.

Josh: You like it?

Tommy: No, no, no, not that I'm wanting to perv on myself, but so what are you looking at? You're looking at you. But what are you? Like, if you go real deep with it, what is it? Like, everything threaded, any negativity that's coming from your mind is exactly just that thought that's sparking up about something because you are just you, like, sitting there. And so that's why there is no there's nothing to be ashamed of.

Josh: There's nothing that wants to get all like nice, uh, spirit, more spiritual. Like, I think the more— like, I think part of it is, um, the— there was that— I don't know if we ever spoke about that on air, but when I was talking about the gurus and your mum was not happy, like, oh yeah, texted, texted you saying, Josh, shut up, he doesn't know what he's talking about.

Tommy: Yeah, no, because you push back on shit. Like, I know that Half of it's like, and you're the first to say, "I actually don't know." Yeah. But you're the first also to say, "But are you sure?" Like, and so, those two things happening at once can be very annoying because you're like, "Well, I don't know, but are you sure about this? And how do you know?" Which is implying that you know something that they don't or you're of a different understanding. And so, that's where it can be annoying. But there's a lot of dropping of that when it goes into, um, into the spiritual space. But that isn't in the dropping the sense of, I don't like— I'll believe anything. So there's a place in between.

Josh: Well, sometimes you can have a contrarian view on something, or you feel like you have to play devil's advocate. This is the problem with like a bunch of social issues that are happening at the moment where it's like people feeling like they just need to be like, oh well, it's not all black and white, like, oh, not all men are rapists, or like, as a way of not having— like, I was reading an article where I think the headline was Rape is a Men's Issue, Not a Women's Issue. And I like caught myself just for like a moment being like, what, hang on? And I was like, oh no, like, and then I like— it's so funny how from this debating or saying, but like, like, you get in this dark area of trying to justify. It's like, no, no, like, I caught myself doing the exact thing that gets people in a bunch— like, a bad headspace, which is, of course, justification or, oh, devil's advocate. Whereas, like, not everything needs a devil's advocate. Not everything, yeah, needs to be defended.

Tommy: You know, I agree, not everything needs to be defended. But it's also the essence of what you said, which is triggered, you could use that, or something that stimulated an emotion or a sense, whether it's like what you actually give a fuck about. Because I know that you don't actually, you're not over here saying, oh, but white men, you actually don't give a fuck about it. But it's obviously done something.

Josh: And then what about ScoMo? Did you like, so ScoMo coming out and saying like, he's done such a poor job of everything that's been happening with parliament to the point where in a moment where they They're saying, hey, take responsibility. He then did you hear about the News Corp thing?

Tommy: So he said clean up your own house before you get, you know, look at us.

Josh: I mean, that is like the opposite of what a leader should do. Like, how can you look at that and say, oh, that's a win, dude?

Tommy: I'm surprised people aren't harder, like, aren't more wild. I mean, it's not why.

Josh: What do you mean?

Tommy: It's not. I was going to say it's why I'm not in politics, but like, People aren't looser than ScoMo in these high-pressure situations, saying more dumb shit. I guess Eddie McGuire said some stuff which, you know, he says taken out of context, it's not what I meant, and other people say otherwise. And so I'm surprised it doesn't happen even more, that these— that people are saying shit like that.

Josh: Like, why is that? What do you think?

Tommy: Like, I'm surprised only because it's what you said. It's like knee-jerk reaction could be something that you're not proud of.

Josh: But the leadership thing You hope that the people in your country. But I think that that's a thing, right? Like if you've made it to a certain point.

Tommy: I mean, you look at the standard, though. Look at Trump, the president. And so, the standard of— I'm surprised. Yeah, I guess.

Josh: But that's why it was so disconcerting and why it was— Because things like morals and ethics can become this sort of side thing. It's like the— It's how he talks about our spoke to Jenny, like, he, he, to get a perspective on women. Yeah, he can't like empathise at the human level. He has to speak to fucking Jenny. Um, yeah, I saw it because obviously there was that politician that, I don't know what, he must have got his dick out or something on a desk.

Tommy: I just saw a screenshot of something.

Josh: It was all blurred, but you sort of, the thing, what, there was a Batuta Advocate, I think, article where it was like the headline was Scomo in tears thinking if that was Jenny's desk. But it is a shame. I mean, it doesn't matter what political view you have, you can look at that like, Scomo, I think it's fair to say, not great when it comes to, at the very least, communicating leadership qualities.

Tommy: Yeah, I don't know if— I don't think he's a piece of shit. Like, I don't think—

Josh: which is what he's saying himself is this, you know, like he's a Christian dude.

Tommy: Yeah.

Josh: So you would think that some of the things he's talking about being—

Tommy: I mean, we don't get scrutinised for what we say, but we're not also in charge of the country.

Josh: Yeah.

Tommy: And so what do—

Josh: but he also is representing All Australians. And so, really, you want a prime minister that is reflective of—

Tommy: Which seems fucking bizarre because people, humans are flawed. How can we expect one person, like, this is more just than looking at—

Josh: But it's common decency. I think the thing is that where he lands is it's like, at what point, like, just think about apologies. I feel like if you look at, say, you know, everything from how the bushfires were handled, All of these different things you're like, look, there's probably a better way of doing it that's more empathetic, less in the defensive.

Tommy: Oh, of course. I think that's for anybody, right? But also, like playing dumb. You hope he's not actually just playing dumb, like he doesn't know.

Josh: Well, so the thing is—

Tommy: Because then you're lying at that point.

Josh: But the problem is that it's a lose-lose, because if he doesn't know what's happening, then he's probably not tapped into the culture and connected with the people at his workplace, or he knows about it and he's pretending he doesn't, which, you know, means he's lying.

Tommy: Yeah.

Josh: So, it's not a great—

Tommy: It's a huge problem if the person running the country is lying. And that was a lot of the time the case for Trump. He lied about a bunch of stuff. On record, like it's clear. And so, but fuck, man, I'm reading the book Lying by Sam Harris.

Josh: What are you learning?

Tommy: Um, how much we all lie. And it's not to the extent of, uh, I stole your money, or I didn't steal your money. Yes, you did. No, I didn't. And you got— I've got your 50 bucks in my pocket. Not to that level of, uh, deception, but just in little things. Think about writing an email where you are saying, oh, I missed this. And you didn't miss it.

Josh: Yeah, sure.

Tommy: And how that is an easy thing I've done in the past. Definitely in the past, earlier when I, you know, earlier on.

Josh: Well, if an email, you know, the thing is, it's like if an email, it's been so long and you're only getting back to them sometimes to save face and to make them feel okay saying that it went into your spam folder.

Tommy: Saving face for you though. No, I think—

Josh: Oh no, no, no, no. So the thing is, so this is like, who's it for? What's it for?

Tommy: I think that the, um, which is a good point to ask about when you're about to start using it for what's it for.

Josh: So the thing is, so if I use that example, when I was younger doing freelancing, that was a common thing. Like, I feel like shit, we used to go into spam a lot more back then. I don't trust anyone when they say it's going to spam these days, or it's just rendering. Um, but the, uh, on the, the email thing, the Uh, so the reason you do it is because you don't want to communicate the disrespect that I just didn't bother writing back for this long. Yeah. So by saying, uh, it was in the spam folder, all of a sudden you bring up that person's status because you're like, you are still important to me.

Tommy: Whereas if you say, but are they? Because if you do—

Josh: So this is, so this is like a living truth. Yeah. But the problem is that sometimes you might be living out of alignment with these things. So, for instance, think about people who you might care about, but you just don't get to their text message.

Tommy: I guess what we have to preface, in this circumstance, the options aren't— So, you have other, another option. So, you've got the lying about the spam thing.

Josh: Yeah.

Tommy: But that, but the point of it is you can't retrospectively change anything. I've done it too, Josh. The reality is, what is the other option that just doesn't thread a lie through to it?

Josh: And so, the other option, I think the reason why people might not go down the other option is because it feels like it's becoming about you. So, they're like, as soon as you have to explain yourself, it seems like you've missed the point.

Tommy: I've made the decision in moments to not address something in, in respects, like, because you could easily think it needs a reason why I haven't written back to you for a month to then get back to you. But so, because you could get hung up on needing to justify it, there is the other option. So the, the point is that the opposite of threading the lie through is saying something that's truthful in some respects, which can bring the, the communication closer.

Josh: When I was, when I was younger, I set up, I think it was called, um, I don't remember what the service was, but it was called like 3 sentences or 5 sentences, there was different versions, .com. And when, and you would put it at the bottom of your email signature and you would say, I'm practising 3 sentences, find out what it is here. And what it was was it's like, I only email back 3 sentences to try and like, oh yeah, reduce my workload, which is It's very funny. It's not far off the time that I—

Tommy: If someone sent me one of those, sorry, it was in spam. Mate, it's real bad. Sorry.

Josh: Isn't that so fun? But this is what happens. Like people who read 4-Hour Workweek and then if you actually try and do that in the real world, like autoresponders, you know, I had the classic case where I set up an autoresponder saying, hey, I'm, you know, only cheque my emails once a day. Did the classic, which George has done this too, he set up an autoresponder in Apple Mail. And I did this when I was younger where I accidentally sent the autoresponder to every single one of my contacts saying that I only cheque my email once a day, which is not, which is not great. Oh God. But, and so lying, is there anything that you're— because I think that there is the other part of it, which is there are people who pride themselves on, you know, I just tell it like it is. And the problem with the tell it like it is attitude, if there's a certain flavour of it, there's obviously like really positive flavours, but there's a flavour of it which is I don't care how this is going to make the other person feel. And so, it's a bravado thing.

Tommy: There's also the other tell it like it is person that values the truth and they were all— So, when that person also gives you a compliment, you know that it's honest. But they don't have the arrogance of tell it like it is. It's like, from where I see it, it's like this.

Josh: So, maybe it's more silence than anything, which is what you're describing. So, rather than lying or addressing, hey, this email's a month old, this is my excuse, just going into the email without addressing it, which I don't know where I stand.

Tommy: I, unless it was requiring the, the event has gone, this is where it's hard because you then get held up on a situation.

Josh: So what about if it was like, um, to benefit, uh, so for instance, I say if you're going for a job, right, you, um, uh, Yeah, I mean, you wouldn't really do this.

Tommy: You don't. I think the thing is, if you just take stock of your day-to-day and see the moments in your life where lying becomes your first go-to, which I'm like guilty of it, right? Because Bodhi, hey, is there any more chocolate? Nah, it's all gone. Is a lie. There's a fucking shitload in the cupboard. And so what's the language there? It's not No, there's no more chocolate. It's none for you. There's none for you right now. And so, that's another way of doing it.

Josh: Yeah, sure.

Tommy: So, the kids thing is lying to kids.

Josh: Don't be tricky, Dad. Do you fucking have chocolate?

Tommy: Because at that point he's like, if he's ever saying to me, don't be tricky, he knows I'm a liar. And so, there's little bits. So, with your partner, I don't know. So, there's heaps of examples in the book of lying that, you know, he asked his He gives an example of this one family where the mum got MS and they were at the doctor's. The husband found out that his wife had MS. Yeah. The doctor had told him, he didn't tell his wife, and so she never knew that he knew. She didn't know, but then she found out. And so, and then her son didn't know and then found out later, a year later. So for a whole year. His point is that there was, there was no support. There was a year that nobody knew that each other knew.

Josh: Sure.

Tommy: And so everyone thought every—

Josh: it's like ignoring it. Okay, what about this long connection?

Tommy: What's the key to not lying? There's a lot of connection that can be made.

Josh: Relationships, wanking, and porn. Yeah, it's a common one.

Tommy: 100%. And so I've lied about it for sure.

Josh: Which is so, um, there's something you feel so pathetic about it. Of course, of course, real pathetic. And but don't you think that I feel like that is a look at how much, uh, like something like a Pornhub, how many, uh, viewers or how many users use porn.

Tommy: Should we cheque their monthly?

Josh: You can, yeah, sure. But don't you think that's an interesting one?

Tommy: Like, I think, yeah, man, it's— and but that's why it's like I've had people say to me, oh, my partner. It's one girl said to me, my partner never watches porn. I said, bullshit. I mean, maybe. I took— I didn't watch, I didn't watch any pornographic material for over a year.

Josh: I was speaking to one mate who, during COVID he's like, you know, you're in an apartment, you're in an apartment, it's pretty—

Tommy: By yourself?

Josh: It's pretty— No, no, with your partner. But he was used to, oh, you know, 7:60, wife's gone to work, have a wank. And so all of a sudden he's like, got this wanking habit. It really is a friend. It's not me. But seriously, I was thinking about who are your mates that live in apartments? It was you. No, so no, it actually isn't. Uh, but I don't know, I did, I did connections. I changed some of the storey so that it wasn't, uh, so obvious, but they may have had to quarantine, they had to quarantine in a spot that wasn't their house or whatever for that period of time, and they ended like, he ended up having the conversation.

Tommy: Fair enough.

Josh: With his partner, which is like Like, uh, I'm an addict. I'm gonna have to have a wank. It's got nothing to do with you. Um, that's so good. I mean, so on the line, like, when you think about that stuff, I mean, we've spoken about it early days, your number, how many sexual partners I actually had.

Tommy: What, hand on heart, could not tell you.

Josh: But I— do you, do you speak to Amy about it?

Tommy: Would you tell her what, like Much now, but I— So, I think there's a lot. I think if you're talking for myself here, a single guy gets into a relationship, there's a lot of— I mean, lying, it sounds so heavy.

Josh: Yes.

Tommy: But there is a lot of deceptive communication, you could call it, like veering off, trying to bring up something else or getting out of it. You know, you're just like, not wanting to go there. And so, there was a lot of that for me with Amy early days, but now, now it's a bit different.

Josh: Yeah. It's it, but I think that, think about the reaction that you have or like going into it. It can be like maybe not your proudest thing. Like if you're not proud about, you know, your previous sexual history or whatever it is, someone asking it, even if it's during a relationship, could be confronting.

Tommy: Exactly, exactly. And so I think that most of the evidence of actually talking about it with Amy is a deeper connection. And so you can always think that like the truth is too hard for somebody. It's fucking too hard for you because that was— I literally thought that I can't tell Amy. The stuff she wants to know about things that are just, you know, very basic. But I was just like, she can't handle it.

Josh: Yeah.

Tommy: Now everyone's thinking what the fuck I was up to.

Josh: Threesomes. Yeah.

Tommy: But at that point I'm like, Amy can't handle that. I can't tell her. Like, but then, you know what it is? It's the, it's the tough moment of being in that conversation with her that, that feeling for me, I don't want.

Josh: Yeah.

Tommy: I didn't want that. And so it's like an aversion tactic.

Josh: Yeah.

Tommy: Which sometimes it's like, imagine that. So, that's like not me doing anything wrong. This is just previous sexual history if we're talking about where I can't even handle that. Imagine actually like having to tell, you know, somebody something that you are honestly lying about, stole the money. Imagine actually saying that. Fuck no.

Josh: Yeah.

Tommy: It's like too much. And you can't say no comment, like at the cop shop. No comment.

Josh: I mean, you can. What is it called? The Fifth.

Tommy: Oh yeah, in America.

Josh: Yeah, plead the fifth.

Tommy: Plead the fifth.

Josh: Yeah. I, um, I watched, uh, Bridesmaids last night.

Tommy: Nice.

Josh: Funny film.

Tommy: Yeah, it is, it is, it is.

Josh: It's a great— if you want to laugh.

Tommy: Yeah, it's fucking real good.

Josh: And so any other thoughts on the lying thing?

Tommy: Um, I think nothing other than try it. Try just having the filter of, am I lying right now?

Josh: Have you noticed? So what, what areas have you picked up on? So there's the boating.

Tommy: Okay, now I got one today, got one today. Today we went to the film shoot in the city and there was early bird parking, $16. Yeah, the person producing the event told me about it. Great. Uh, we had someone, a contractor, helping us.

Josh: Yeah.

Tommy: Film and I said, go there. And I said, mate, I'll cover it.

Josh: I'm a big dog.

Tommy: Yeah, big dog will fucking cover it.

Josh: Yeah. Jeez, you're sick.

Tommy: $16.

Josh: Yeah.

Tommy: Anyway, we go to the car park, the machine's not working. I'm like fucking putting the— I was like, I got this, son, I got this. Putting in the ticket, she's sending it back out. So I hit the help, lady comes online. I don't know where she is.

Josh: Yeah, it would be international, I think. Oh really?

Tommy: Yeah, it wasn't in the, in the actual thing. Anyway, she's like, yep. So, that will be $73.

Josh: Oh my goodness.

Tommy: So, this is—

Josh: Is this on the way out or the way in? So, this is on the way out and trying to— You put your ticket in to leave.

Tommy: No, no, no. So, it's at the machine before you pay. At the machine to pay.

Josh: Okay. Yeah. And what'd you say?

Tommy: I caught myself because I was like, oh, but someone told—

Josh: I was like, but that's not a lie.

Tommy: No, no, but it's not the rules. The rules are in before 9, out after 3. It's a real con job.

Josh: I know.

Tommy: Early bird just means you fucking get there early.

Josh: Yeah, but you have to leave late.

Tommy: Early bird gets the park but has to leave after 3. That should be there.

Josh: So could you not just say— So did you pay $73?

Tommy: I paid $73.

Josh: Is this your way of telling me? This is my way of telling you.

Tommy: I can't lie about it.

Josh: What about the freelancer?

Tommy: He's not getting money.

Josh: It was too expensive. So if this was a radio show, I'd play Justin Bieber. We would fucking high five with that out, but we're not, so we're still here anyway. Thanks for joining us.

Tommy: I didn't lie about it, and we're $73 in—

Josh: $140, $146.

Tommy: I didn't park, I didn't park. He gave me lift time.

Josh: Okay, that's nice. So of course, yeah.

Tommy: So it's okay. Yeah, dude, but I was literally about to lie to this lady, which I probably could have fucking spun some bullshit. Yeah, like I have in the past.

Josh: I mean, you are the one to, yeah, to sneak into the lounge at the airport. I've had so many blow-ups.

Tommy: Which, that was almost not a lie because I asked the guy to help.

Josh: Yeah, sure.

Tommy: And so, but so this is just—

Josh: Being more creative.

Tommy: You've got to get more creative with it, which I just actually thought of one because I couldn't, my ticket wasn't registering and I honestly told her how long we'd been there. But if I dishonestly said, yes, I've been here for 2 hours, she'd be like, yeah, no worries, $22.

Josh: Oh, but seems like a very easy lie though, doesn't it?

Tommy: Yes.

Josh: Yeah. So, you fucked it. I know. I think— No, it's, um, but it's—

Tommy: I mean, it's a good practise because then I— It was only from me thinking about not lying that I did that in that moment.

Josh: It's interesting because from a culture perspective, I think that where we go with lying is what is culturally acceptable. And so, for instance, you imagine, um, You know, like you go overseas and you're buying something and you're sort of haggling on the price and you're like, no, no, too much. Talking about that, you know, the level— The thing is that it's rarely too much. You can afford it. Like, I catch myself sometimes, you know, you're in a third world country, you're like, no, no, no, $5 for the sarong. That's a rip-off. No, no, no.

Tommy: You're on the back foot. That's the approach you have to take. Like, they're fucking— They're ripping me off. So, I'm going to—

Josh: Which is a really annoying— Like, think about from a business perspective.

Tommy: How would they feel?

Josh: Yeah, well, I think that they know it's— The thing is that I remember going to Thailand, for instance, and—

Tommy: You weren't paying full price to sit on an elephant. Absolutely not.

Josh: No, no, no, no, I did. It was through Flight Centre. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I paid through Flight Centre.

Tommy: I wonder if they're actually still doing that.

Josh: But definitely.

Tommy: The elephant one?

Josh: Yeah. I don't think, um, get a photo with a tiger through Flight Center.

Tommy: Yeah, I wonder if they are distancing themselves from those, but you still can blow up a cow with a bazooka. Yeah, I can actually do that. That's fucked.

Josh: I don't know if you'd be able to do it, um, through Flight Center. Yeah, um, but, uh, I'm just— I just don't want Flight Center to get upset. This is not a Flight Center integration, but if you're looking for some sort of, um, I'm sure you could get it on, um, Red balloon.

Tommy: Two cows for the price of one.

Josh: Yeah. No, you don't want to shoot up a cow. That's actually been—

Tommy: You can. You can.

Josh: It's been very sad, the flooding with the cows and stuff. But no, what I was going to say is in Thailand, in Phuket, you're walking along and you read in the Lonely Planet book that if you get given a black bag, it means that you're You're easy.

Tommy: Did you watch Ryan Johns' video?

Josh: No.

Tommy: He did one about this in Bali.

Josh: Oh, really?

Tommy: Yeah.

Josh: So, they give different colour bags depending. Yeah. Depending on how much of a chump you are when it comes to haggling.

Tommy: Can you rip them off?

Josh: Yeah.

Tommy: You get a red bag.

Josh: One thing that I think people misuse, they say when they're doing this, they say bartering.

Tommy: Yeah, I would say bartering. Bartering.

Josh: I say haggling because bartering He's like, if I'm going to swap a, my leather jacket for the sarong.

Tommy: Don't lie to me. Are you questioning now that if you're right about the battery?

Josh: No, I'm right.

Tommy: Okay.

Josh: Just like when people say aesthetic. That's aesthetic.

Tommy: I would say.

Josh: That's what the kids are saying.

Tommy: Aesthetic.

Josh: That's aesthetic. Well, but aesthetic.

Tommy: That is aesthetic. You could see it as Aesthetic is not a descriptive—

Josh: No. So, aesthetic is— So, you can have a really nice aesthetic.

Tommy: Sports aesthetic.

Josh: Yeah, yeah. It's like a— It's a great— It's not a good aesthetic, but that's aesthetic.

Tommy: That's probably—

Josh: It's lingo.

Tommy: That's the bit.

Josh: Yeah. That they're doing.

Tommy: Yeah. That's aesthetic. They know it. I mean, they don't know that it doesn't work, but—

Josh: Is my hoodie aesthetic?

Tommy: That's aesthetic.

Josh: I feel like a European DJ.

Tommy: Yeah, yeah, yeah. This one goes out to— It's a—

Josh: It's a mint green.

Tommy: Amsterdam Couture.

Josh: Yeah, it's— It feels good.

Tommy: Amsterdam?

Josh: Yeah.

Tommy: Yeah.

Josh: Yeah.

Tommy: It looks— It would be warm to sit in.

Josh: Do you like it or no?

Tommy: It's nice.

Josh: It would probably get dirty.

Tommy: It's going to get real dirty. I mean, for you, I value that you're spicing it up. You're minting it up.

Josh: Well, I wore pants on a shoot on Monday and Jess was blown away. She was like, you guys look great. Literally just put pants on. Normally wear shorts.

Tommy: What are you wearing right now? Pants.

Josh: Yeah. Pants. Because I just felt like I want to feel good today. I was driving in. Yeah, wouldn't trust wearing something so light in the rain. And so I drove in, felt like a bit of an executive, you know, just driving in comfy with the heaters on.

Tommy: Yeah, love it. Um, nice jumper. No seat warmers or anything, but mate, you don't have a Benz, you don't have a fucking Rolls-Royce in your Scotch and Soda. That would go.

Josh: Yeah, thanks. All right. It's a daily talk show. That's aesthetic. Yeah. Hi@thedailytalkshow.com is the email address if you want to send us an email. Episode 1,000 coming up very strong. Yeah. We are doing—

Tommy: And soon.

Josh: 16 hours. Which is 1,000. Well, it's 1,000 minutes.

Tommy: Yeah. So, it's a bit over 16 hours, which is—

Josh: Yes.

Tommy: Not 24 like we did, but it's doable and still on Friday, the—

Josh: 15th?

Tommy: That's, um, 9th. It's 2 weeks away. Um, 7th, 8th, 9th, 10th.

Josh: Okay, just double-check.

Tommy: Just checking.

Josh: So we're doing— we're going to stream 9th.

Tommy: 9th. 9th. Yep.

Josh: A thousand minutes. We're going to stream. Yeah. And have a bunch of guests. Still got to reach out to all of our guests. So if you're listening and wondering where the call is, it's coming.

Tommy: I had an idea, and I'd like to get a hotel on the bandwagon.

Josh: Okay. I have thedailytalkshow.com.

Tommy: It's the, the after party. Okay. Not even, it's the, it's the kick-ons, but you don't party and I don't really party.

Josh: Sure.

Tommy: But I thought if we were to have our own hotel room that's waiting for us, we do the show all day. So we're starting at 5 AM, we're done at like 10 PM.

Josh: But so you and I, you and I, okay, great, have to go.

Tommy: We get to, but in— during the show, we have someone go to the hotel, cheque in for us, do a video in the room.

Josh: They—

Tommy: we bring them into the livestream. Well, I would separate.

Josh: Yeah, okay, you get 2 beds, but like 2 singles.

Tommy: It's the— it's the kick-ons. Yeah, and you might take— we might take the team back there.

Josh: Sure, for—

Tommy: for a nightcap, but then that's it.

Josh: A night cappuccino.

Tommy: Exactly. Yeah, I mean, a nightcap could be a beer. Okay, but we'll We'll integrate the hotel, we'll show the room, and then you and I will head back.

Josh: Well, it can't be the Hilton based on your history. The Hilton's no longer the Hilton, but I did my dirty at the Hilton. Okay, sure. All right.

Tommy: And Crown, we burnt the, um, sofa. Okay, well, good though, it wasn't under my name.

Josh: Yeah, I think you should just stick to lying. Have a good one, guys.

Tommy: See you tomorrow.