The Gift Guy

Tommy: The Daily Talk Show.

Josh: It's The Daily Talk Show, episode 479.

Tommy: What's happening, guys? What's going on?

Josh: Oh, look, not much. I just had a delicious bowl.

Tommy: Oh yeah, low-carb bowl, not cooked by you, cooked by Jim. Yeah, Jimmy Gratz.

Josh: Yeah, not, not sponsored. No. Also, uh, joined today, Basil. What's going on, mate?

Basil: Hello, guys.

Josh: You're just off, off cam right now on our sort of Well, it used to be a couch mic setup. Yeah, but we can't reach headphones to the couch.

Tommy: Yeah. Yeah. And I did realise it's weird that we just didn't put you in the middle of it.

Josh: That's right.

Tommy: Because we used to have Dill sitting there all the time.

Mason: Yeah.

Tommy: And Dill just felt like he had to sit there because he was being disciplined for something he'd done.

Josh: He had the eyes in trouble.

Tommy: Yeah, he'd be taking notes. Whereas you've done nothing but help this show. You brought Fat Friday's brownies once when we had Zoe Foster-Blake. They were amazing, by the way.

Basil: Oh, didn't make them, so no credit.

Josh: But you bought them.

Basil: Yeah, I bought them.

Tommy: Actually, you did Uber Eats them to your joint, didn't you? Did you really?

Basil: Yeah, I did the day before because they weren't going to be open in time.

Josh: So there's some serious thought that goes into that.

Basil: Yeah. Well, I tried. Yeah, I tried.

Josh: What's the nice— like, are you— do you go out of your way of like, I'm going to do nice things for people? Is this—

Basil: yeah, yeah, it is. Like, it really is. Like, it's a, it's a big kind of core tenet of mine. Huge value to me.

Josh: Love language.

Basil: Love.

Tommy: Yeah, have you heard that before?

Basil: The Five Love Languages. And so you're huge into self-help, it's crazy.

Tommy: Yeah, it's so crazy.

Josh: Oh yeah.

Tommy: And so you're a, um, gifts, gifts guy?

Basil: Um, yeah, I am, I am a gift giver. Yeah, yep, yep. But more like, uh, it doesn't have to be a gift, like it can just be as long as it's thoughtful. But usually that's doing something which is, I guess, a bit of a gift.

Josh: Maybe that's just your time or So the thing with love languages, does that mean that that's the love language that like, should we be getting you gifts as well, or is your love language different, the one that you want to receive? Does that make sense?

Basil: It is. I'm not— yeah, that is a great question.

Unknown: It—

Basil: they don't always line up. For some people that they do, um, but for other people, yeah, they don't. I don't, I don't think so. I think, yeah, I, I mean, who doesn't love a gift? I think, I think that is the key. Um, I don't need like a heap of quality time. Like, that's another one.

Josh: I think that quality time's overrated.

Tommy: Yeah, but no, in general, it's your love language necessarily, necessarily isn't the one that is on the other side.

Josh: Mr. 97, what do you think your love language is?

Mason: Probably words of affirmation and the physical touch one.

Josh: So the Amazon gift card we got for Christmas doesn't really— because we didn't— unless a word of affirmation is $100. She didn't really put enough effort into the words, unfortunately.

Tommy: And there wasn't really a card. It was just a, "Thanks, brother." The whole thing was a card.

Josh: I always wonder about that with the— You mean the gift card.

Tommy: And it had the amount. And so, it was— We outsourced the—

Josh: They put— Well, I mean, this is the thing.

Tommy: They write the $100.

Josh: Well, Amazon put like the "to" and like the "from" and you can write that down. But it feels like there's— There must be an industry because if you go to like AusPost and stuff, I always imagine, you know how you see like calculators and just random gifts. I've always like told a storey that it's like the dad who like they've separated from their partner, but like it's the kid's birthday and they like live in Melbourne and the kid's in like is growing up in Sydney. And so the dad just goes to AusPost and buys whatever's there.

Tommy: Oh yeah. I mean, but that's the thing about occasions like Christmas or birthdays is you end up thinking that I just have to give a gift. And then sometimes that's all the thought is, is last minute. So like my dad doesn't give a shit about gifts. I mean, yeah, he's like—

Josh: Receiving them or giving them?

Tommy: Receiving them. He's— the way he shows love is like spending time helping us. And so he'll come— The show.

Josh: Yeah.

Tommy: I mean, building this fucking wall, like he spent a heap of time with me chopping up this timber behind us.

Josh: And what? I was there.

Tommy: No, you weren't there, mate. You weren't there.

Josh: I've got boomerangs that I did.

Tommy: Oh no, you were there on the day, but it was all these days beforehand, like him and I. But here's the thing, we ended up driving around together, driving through back streets of like industrial areas, hunting down like dumped— what do you call it? Like pallets, which we then flung onto the back of his truck.

Josh: I've seen so many pallets since we've like moved.

Tommy: Oh yeah.

Josh: Everyone's giving away pallets.

Tommy: This is the hard— they're everywhere, but it's super hard to end up doing.

Josh: These are high quality. These specific ones.

Tommy: Yeah.

Josh: Yeah.

Basil: Anyway, they look, they look great.

Josh: Thanks, mate.

Basil: Thanks.

Josh: Absolutely. Well, we've actually—

Basil: the blue ones?

Josh: No, no, no. Really? That was how they came in the pallet.

Mason: Really?

Tommy: That's old school. Yeah, that's just— yeah.

Josh: So what came first, the pallet colour or our logo? The pallet color.

Tommy: Palette colour just happened that way, and then Dil, yeah, created the logo. And then I got back one day and you decided to go with a blue thing. I was like, it's my favourite color. Um, I'm fucking happy about that.

Josh: As we're talking about names, uh, so I was trying to get your last name right. Yeah, Jared. Oh yeah, yeah. And then you were saying—

Tommy: I've got it right.

Josh: And you're saying, well, that's actually not my last name.

Basil: No, I mean, not on— not for tax purposes, it's not.

Josh: What does that mean?

Basil: Okay, just like, uh, on Facebook and stuff, because I have a pretty weird name being Basil.

Josh: How did that come about? How did you end up with the name Basil?

Basil: Yeah, so my parents aren't hippies like most people think. I get a lot of like, how's your sister Rosemary?

Josh: Like, there's a lot of that gear. Did you just say, oh, she's still living in Byron Bay?

Basil: She's taking some time out or something like that. Yeah, no, it's my parents are super Catholic, so I'm named after Saint Basil the Great, which is a bit wanky. Saint Basil the Great, like it's a full title.

Josh: Yeah.

Basil: And then my—

Josh: But it's not The full title isn't in your name, is it?

Basil: No, no, there's no—

Josh: I love that.

Basil: It's not. Oh, that's very good. Uh, no, so my, my, uh, my, like, my last name is Curtis. I'm Basil Curtis. I grew up as Basil Curtis. And then this thing called Facebook came along, might have heard of it. And, uh, I was like, hey, that's my joke.

Josh: I made it, man. Yeah, yeah, that exact one. Instagram, social media.

Basil: We're the same guy.

Josh: And so when Facebook came around, yeah. Why did you decide? Because I always wonder about this unless you're a schoolteacher.

Basil: Yeah. Well, it was before that was even a thing that people were like trying to hide it. I think I was the only like Basil Curtis on there, so I guess I was trying to hide it as well. But I just wanted to have like a, you know, a fun uni experience and not kind of be so taggable in everything.

Tommy: Which I think is a powerful name. Basil Curtis.

Basil: Yeah, it's not.

Tommy: Yeah.

Basil: And that's the thing. Like, I remember It was, it was, it was weird. I got a, I got a Christmas card from a friend overseas, and so they had only met me overseas. And, um, so it rocks up to my house. Uh, I grew up in Bendigo, so mum picks it up and it's Basil Jarrod, and she's like, are you, are you ashamed of our last name? And I was like, oh, mum, no, it's not that. It's just, that's just what I go by. And so Facebook turned into Instagram, and that turned into everything.

Tommy: So Ryan John who's been on the show many times. Yeah, he's not Ryan John.

Josh: Really?

Tommy: Well, it's not his surname. Ryan Dunn is his surname. D-U-N-N. Yeah, like, um, Ryan Dunn from, uh, uh, what's it called, Jackass. He was a part of Jackass. But anyway, he's— yeah, I was so confused.

Josh: Well, you get that all the time about your name, Tommy Jackett. It sounds like a made-up name.

Tommy: It definitely does. I've heard all the jokes, so roll them out.

Josh: Uh, um, I mean, Craig Bruce used it in the in the No Jacket Required, which we tried to deconstruct it because you and I were doing the interview. So I took that as next time don't invite Tommy. I took it as, uh, oh yeah, the only part that they could think of, right?

Tommy: Yeah, the, um, the, the thing, the consideration for the surname, my surname, is having kids, and then what what the kids call, you know, like, because now there's like a River is a cute name, but River Jacket.

Josh: What's wrong with River Jacket? Or like a River is a brand.

Tommy: Blue Ivy, you know.

Basil: Well, you're really—

Tommy: when you go for a River Jacket, River Jacket. I don't know, it's just combining it with the last. But, um, my, my brothers Anthony, Michael, and myself Thomas, we're all, um, Patriot Saints Catholic. Mum's like that.

Josh: Yeah, so I think I remember getting some sort of key ring because my nana and pa were very Catholic, and like, I think I got like some form of key ring that said, what, Joshua? Oh yeah, yeah, Joshua's something.

Tommy: Yeah, they're quite nice. My mum usually gives me that. They're somewhere. I've got cards.

Josh: What does it mean? Like, how Catholic were your parents?

Basil: Like, uh, like Mass every Sunday, but very involved in the community. Like, they still— like, mum cleans the church every week. Dad um, does all the gardening and stuff, and they're in prayer groups and all of that stuff. So like, they're, they're in. Did you— they're in, they're in fully committed.

Josh: So when you— because when my nana died, there were 8 priests. Oh, like, so she was legit. It was like big deal, all at the front or whatever. I had no idea because I— what did she—

Tommy: what was, what was her connection?

Josh: Uh, like, just her always there, always doing it. Okay, so yeah, she want— she got like a one of those like community awards or whatever on Australia Day or some shit. Uh, yeah, but she, uh, but when she died and I met the, like, the main priest, like, I was so not involved in all the church stuff, I didn't even know, like—

Tommy: Did you kiss his hand?

Josh: Yeah, well, yeah, I didn't know what the fuck I was meant to do.

Tommy: You meant to kiss his hand. Did you kiss his hand?

Josh: Were you really meant to?

Tommy: Yeah.

Josh: No, I didn't. I didn't even know whether if I should have, like, I was like, you don't have to kiss his fucking cat's weed or whatever.

Tommy: You would have done it.

Basil: You would have genuflected.

Mason: You would have done your hip.

Josh: And so, and did you do like the Sunday school and stuff?

Basil: Yeah, I was an altar boy. Yeah.

Josh: What is it? What's the job of an altar boy?

Basil: Just a lackey. Just a runner. A runner for the priest. That's what it is.

Josh: Picture on the ground.

Basil: Got a coffee, got the wine all sorted, and then just, you know, I need the book, bring the book over, you know, open it up, hold it, you know, because why would you use a stand when you can use a 12-year-old to hold up this humongous book?

Josh: I mean, explains your biceps.

Basil: Yes, we're still from the US.

Josh: And so, um, did you, uh, are you still religious today?

Basil: No, nah, so I pretty much did, uh, like until I was 18. I was 18 right at the end of December, at the end of school, and then just special occasions. Just, I just go for mum and dad now, just, you know, Christmas time, Easter.

Tommy: Keep them happy.

Basil: Yeah, keep them happy. And just mostly see like a lot of the big families, like I'm from a big family and you know, I can, I can name off like the Keatings and the Omars and stuff that you'll see the whole family back at Christmas time and stuff. So that's, that's, that's nice. But yeah, I mean, I find there's a lot of things.

Josh: So was the 18, was that like a rule set by your parents where they're like, um, you can work your own shit out when you're 18?

Basil: No, it was very, it was pretty unspoken. And by that, I'm the youngest of 5, but by that stage I was at home by myself, so it was just me sortin' it out. And a lot of the times, like, Mum and Dad would go to like 7:30, like Sunday morning, and I'd be having huge nights on Saturday, like plenty 18s. So I'd be rockin' up very hungover. Yeah, just, just, just sippin'. I've got my holy water, thank you very much. Just in the back seat, right at the back of the church.

Tommy: So you'd still have to go?

Unknown: I'd still—

Basil: yeah, well, have to go. I— yeah, I think I felt obliged to go.

Tommy: That's fair enough, you're not paying rent.

Basil: Yeah, exactly. And it was always just like, yeah, yeah, um, yeah, just the, just the— it did make my parents happy to do, to, to go. And I know that they're not, they're not super pumped that, that, that I don't anymore. But yeah, they've always been like really respecting, like, yeah.

Tommy: So it's interesting, I mean, for for people that aren't practising a religion, I wonder what that new thing that you have with your children that you really want— wanted them to do. What is it now? Yeah, mate, I'm pissed you're not a vlogger.

Josh: It's not quite a religion, is it?

Tommy: What is the thing? Like, if you don't— it's just take out the religion, so it's community. Maybe it's football, maybe it's sports. So it's the community element. Is lovely in, in religion.

Josh: I remember being pissed as a kid that I like didn't get a bar mitzvah or a— like, is it the communion?

Basil: What's that?

Josh: My cousins did that and I just saw them fucking getting cash and stuff. I was like, why don't I get it? It's like, Josh, you say you never want to go to church. I'm like, yeah, but I want to do that thing.

Tommy: Oh, bar mitzvahs were unbelievable. Like, I grew up Catholic and having— going to a school like Wesley where there's a bunch of Jews and they had, you know, their bar mitzvah when they were 13. The place is like, one kid had it at Melbourne Museum, and I just remember like it was more elaborate than me wedding, which wasn't hard. But it's this huge long table, like I'm talking 40 metres of table and chairs either side, and in the middle was just donuts, coloured donuts, colour red, just red donuts. And so we're just getting in there Get in there. That same one, my friend who, he was my best mate at the time, he had diabetes, still does. The bad kind where you need to inject.

Josh: And they're all pretty bad.

Tommy: More bad if you need insulin dependent versus the other one you can sort out with diet.

Josh: The funny thing is I have managed in my life to be annoyed that I'm like not religious, but also even diabetic, because I would always be jealous of the jelly beans, those big bags of jelly beans.

Tommy: I eat them all the time. Yeah, but my mate did not. So this was back when you, like, a lot of them have pumps now. You can just, it regulates your insulin via this little machine that you sort of strapped to your leg. But we would actually inject my friend. And so we thought it was hilarious being at this really extravagant bar mitzvah where we're drawing back the needle in the toilet. This guy walks in, he's just, and walks out like he thought we were taking heroin or something. It's a rich private school party, just a bit of heroin from some 13-year-old. It's a bit funny.

Josh: Yeah, I mean, growing up in Bendigo.

Tommy: Yes, that's where you grew up, right? Yeah. Yep. So, how old are you?

Basil: How old am I now? Uh, 29, about to turn 30. 29. We're the same person. Yeah, I think so.

Tommy: Do you love gifts, or do you love giving gifts?

Josh: No. Yeah, I love giving gifts. What, are you kidding me?

Tommy: When was the last gift you gave?

Josh: Last gift?

Tommy: I mean, you gave me a good one. I'm just— I'm talking for other people. I don't think you're a gift guy.

Josh: I'm definitely just a guy. I bought—

Tommy: I spent some time around, mate. When have you—

Josh: I spent $3,000 worth of books and I give them out.

Tommy: No, that's because you heard Tim Ferriss bloody say you should gift books.

Josh: I reckon I like— I think I'm not necessarily good at thinking of stuff.

Tommy: Maybe it comes so naturally to people who their love language—

Josh: What do you think? What's my love language then?

Tommy: Um, uh, Quality time, not so much because you don't really like spending time. Quality time with people you like, definitely. Like, like just hanging out, talking. But there's only a select few people that you're allowed to do that.

Josh: Mine's always elaborate. I feel like my gift giving was always like, like silly words of affirmation.

Tommy: Definitely.

Josh: As in that I give words about—

Tommy: no, no, you like getting words of affirmation. Like, I think you— what we do is it's really nice when we get validation, and you particularly like it.

Josh: I think so.

Tommy: Yeah, which is fine. There's nothing wrong with this shit.

Josh: So what's yours then?

Tommy: I don't know, you answer for me because we can do a test. There's a test, there's a like a online—

Josh: yeah, online 20 questions. Giving one is an attack.

Tommy: Definitely. But you're not like— I think you might be identifying as a gift giver.

Josh: And I'm not. But you can identify with whatever you want nowadays. You can.

Basil: Yeah, true, true.

Josh: Um, if I want to be a gift giver You can't question that.

Tommy: Words of affirmation and some, a little bit of like the quality time is in there with specific people. So what would I be?

Basil: Physical touch, question mark.

Tommy: Physical touch.

Josh: Yeah, I reckon you would be— you're not physical touch. You're, um, you're not a gift. So this is what you would receive. So I don't think gifts necessarily interest you that much. Maybe the quality time. The words of affirmation, definitely.

Tommy: Yeah, I think there's definitely, um, like, I love, I love affection. So there's probably three.

Josh: I want to know, like, big slivery kisses.

Tommy: I don't like watching your ones sometimes.

Josh: You don't? No.

Basil: Uh, can I ask a question?

Josh: Yeah.

Basil: Um, how do you know that your partners love you?

Josh: Um, good question.

Tommy: Great question.

Josh: Uh, oh no, Bree texts me.

Tommy: Words of affirmation.

Josh: My last text from Bree.

Tommy: I did, yes. I reckon I'm a combination of, uh, the words, touch, and quality time.

Josh: I think words. I'm quite the poet.

Tommy: So you like to share, so you show your love.

Josh: Yeah.

Tommy: Mr. 97, can you turn the heater off?

Josh: It's just a bit hot.

Tommy: Yes, I had put it on to 27 bucks by accident. But you know, I clicked it a couple of times, it went up and I was like, fuck it.

Josh: So at 10:05 AM I said to Bree, I love you so much, kiss kiss.

Tommy: With no prompting.

Josh: No prompting.

Tommy: Because some of us need a little bit of prompting.

Josh: Absolutely no prompting. And then she wrote back, I love you so much, you're the best human, X.

Tommy: Oh yeah, have a kid because Bodhi and I have arguments. No, I love you more. And he says, no, I love you more. It's funny. Yeah, I would enjoy arguing, but sometimes I, I ask Bodhi, do you love me? Do you love Daddy?

Josh: Yeah, so words of affirmation is definitely up there.

Tommy: Bodhi, absolute little rat, to be honest. I love him, but I've got blood on my hands. I've had blood on my jeans. He had a, he had a fall. He had a fall at the, um, the dirt jump park in Ivanhoe over the weekend, and so I was pushing him around and I pushed him and he got onto this like a little kicker, just a few of these little jumps, and then he got too this one where he got to the top and sort of went off to the side of it and fell off.

Josh: It was only probably 40 centimetres high, and it was on top of the ground. You think 40 centimeters? Can you just do it with your hands in front of the camera?

Tommy: So if from the table, it's about there, it's about 40 centimeters. Yeah. And so, um, that's very good.

Josh: How big do you think 5 centimetres is, Basil?

Basil: I'm bad at this.

Josh: Um, yeah, it's, uh, yeah, yeah, I think that's about right.

Unknown: That's good.

Josh: I think that's about right. I was surprised because I thought 5 centimetres was way bigger. What are you laughing at, 97?

Basil: I just got Tommy's joke.

Josh: It's just a classic penis joke, just the 19-year-old in the room.

Tommy: Yeah, so anyway, play to the audience. Um, and so anyway, he smashed his face on the ground, bleeding. And like, I ran over, picked him up, blood pouring out of his mouth.

Josh: What was he saying?

Tommy: Just crying at that point. And then I kind of like wiped it with his top instead. And then I'm getting my hand in there, just wiping it all. Anyway, he's got cut up. And so he goes to daycare yesterday and he's got, you know, cuts all over his face.

Josh: Is it like a— because as a kid I had like a moustache scab.

Tommy: No, this is on his lip. It was fat and now it's just like little scabby bits. And so it looks like he could either have herpes or he came off his bike.

Josh: Sure. Could he have herpes? He could have herpes based on you having herpes.

Tommy: Well, I thought he had a cold sore months and months and months ago, but anyway, hasn't had one since. So let's fingers crossed that he doesn't have that little bastard.

Josh: Would people actually, would people test for that or no?

Tommy: No, I mean, it's pretty clear if you've got a cold sore. There's a test for it. I don't know what you can do. I've never been tested for it, but I've got cold, I get cold sores. Anyway, yesterday Amy went to pick him up from daycare and the woman who is in charge of the room She said, 'Bodie's told us that you and Daddy have pushed him, have been pushing him over.' So he's told the daycare that we're abusing him.

Josh: And what did you, what did, what did you say to him?

Tommy: I saw him later that afternoon in the car and I was asking him—

Josh: What do you think he wanted out of that?

Tommy: I don't know, attention? Yeah, attention. Because then he was telling someone else, like at home, he was telling his auntie, or he was in the bath saying, Daddy pushed me over.

Josh: It's so annoying.

Tommy: So if I'm not here tomorrow, mate, it's—

Josh: yeah, they've taken you away.

Tommy: They've taken me, which is not true. It's not fucking true.

Josh: And so, Basil, when did you move from Bendigo to Melbourne?

Basil: Segway king. I moved for uni. I did a gap year in Bendigo washing cars. What a profession.

Josh: A gap year. A gap year in Bendigo. Yeah, mate, never heard those two things said together.

Basil: They shouldn't be, to be honest. They shouldn't be. Oxymoron.

Josh: Um, I think you're gonna say OxyContin. Yeah, got me through.

Mason: Yeah, good.

Basil: No, but I was saving up to try and get the, um, the Aus Study thing with youth allowance back in the day.

Josh: I think I fucked that up too. It's not Oxy Cotton, is it? I always say Oxy Cotton.

Basil: It's OxyContin. Code. Content.

Tommy: Content.

Basil: Content.

Josh: Content.

Basil: There's an N in there, I think.

Mason: It is content.

Tommy: Yeah.

Mason: Content.

Josh: And what is it?

Tommy: 97?

Mason: Oxycodone. Oxycodone.

Josh: It's what? No, I was just asking for the definition.

Mason: It's a medication to relieve, uh, severe ongoing pain.

Unknown: Okay.

Tommy: And it's codeine-based.

Josh: It's used basically like I— when I was in San Francisco once, there was guys trying to sell it to me. That's why I—

Tommy: you feel great if you have one. So highly addictive.

Josh: So Say that again. Sorry, I just got distracted after I said, all right.

Tommy: You were washing cars for a year?

Basil: Washing cars, 19, and then come down to uni in Melbourne.

Josh: Were you detailing cars?

Basil: No. So I was working at a car wash and I could get all my jobs done in about an hour and then I would just listen to podcasts for the rest of the day.

Tommy: Back when you were 19?

Basil: Yep. Shit, that's a long time ago. Early days.

Tommy: Yeah.

Basil: Yeah. I mean, so it was, it was Hamann and it was Will and Limo on the drive home and the, the Triple M Arvo boys.

Tommy: Yeah.

Basil: So and there were other weird stuff that you could—

Josh: you ever listen to This Week in Tech? Do you remember that? Leo Laporte?

Basil: No, no.

Josh: Dig Nation. Did you ever?

Basil: Yeah, yeah, yeah. With Kevin Rosen. Yep. Yep.

Tommy: Yeah.

Josh: Great.

Basil: Hell yeah.

Josh: And so when you—

Basil: you're a podcast nerd from way back as well. Yeah.

Tommy: Yeah. He actually just mentioned some people you definitely that you wouldn't know because they were beyond 10 years ago, just so he could make it out that he's been listening for longer.

Josh: No, there's a—

Tommy: And he has.

Josh: All right.

Tommy: There's a Curtis.

Josh: There's an Amazon. I don't get the Curtis joke. Oh, because that's you, guys. Things take a while.

Tommy: Yeah. Yeah.

Josh: There's a doco at the moment on Amazon Prime. I think I mentioned it the other day called, I think it's like One Mic, One Voice. It's all about podcasting, which I don't know what Amazon's like model is in regards to accepting movies. But I've searched a few things like podcasting and then clicked on whatever's available on Amazon Prime, and they have been so poorly done.

Basil: Really?

Josh: My assumption is that they, they don't have this, you know, like Netflix, you've got to go through obviously a process to get it on there. Yeah, I wouldn't be surprised if it's like submit your film to Amazon Prime. Upload deal.

Tommy: Yeah. If you can find an upload deal, Mr.

Josh: 97, we could do a documentary straight to Amazon Prime.

Tommy: And then, and then you moved down to Melbourne. So you, you live, you live near the studio, right?

Basil: Yeah, I'm like a couple blocks that way.

Tommy: Was it, was it you that spotted Josh ages ago? I remember.

Basil: Oh, just at the lights. Yeah, just at the lights one day. But I kind of, I had never met you guys in person, so I didn't want to be like, oh hey. Uh, and also crossing the lights is a weird one too because, you know, trying to cross a huddle. Yeah, huge huge, you know, what is it, 6 lanes or whatever. It's, it's, it's a lot. So I just got about halfway and then you looked up and I was like, aha! And then I just, yeah, I was like, oh, I'll see, I'll see you guys again.

Josh: And, um, so moving into a bigger city like Melbourne, was it a big jump for you or no?

Basil: I mean, by that stage, like, if you, if you grew up in Bendigo, there's— it's a big country town. Like, it— they call it a city because there's 100,000 people, but it's not.

Josh: Do you know Keegan Backer?

Basil: From the radio. Yeah, yeah. I did work experience in like under him. Isn't that crazy?

Josh: Oh really?

Basil: In the day.

Unknown: Yeah.

Josh: Because Brett Fitzpatrick.

Basil: What's that?

Tommy: Brett Fitzpatrick.

Basil: Brett Fitzpatrick.

Tommy: He grew up there too.

Josh: Keegs. Keegs is like the youngest person to have ever gotten a metro station job.

Mason: Yeah.

Josh: As an announcer. And he is from Bendigo.

Tommy: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Great people came out of Bendigo. Have come out of Bendigo.

Mason: Yeah.

Basil: Star FM and 3BO.

Unknown: Just.

Basil: Yeah. And then just in general. Yeah, totally. But you come down to Melbourne a lot, like for, you know, if you're into sport or into music, like none of that comes up to Bendigo. So you catch the train down. And then I also have an older brother and 3 older sisters who are all in Melbourne. So I was down here hanging out anyway. Yeah, but there is like, it's big and it's funny. I probably appreciate it more going back now. If I go back on a Sunday and I'm like, I'll text some mates who live there and be like, let's catch up and let's do something. And there's still not a whole heap open. And it's a little bit of like, I think it's a bit of the chicken and the egg. And I have some mates that own a bar up there and they're only open Thursday, Friday, Saturday, and sometimes for a Sunday sesh. And it's like, people aren't going to come out because there's not a heap of things open, but then vice versa, like, you're not going to open up if people aren't coming in. So I don't know, it's, it's a great place. Great place to raise a family is what you hear a lot.

Josh: Is that what your mates are doing? What, why are your mates all there?

Basil: Um, That's an awesome question. I think a few of them just kind of never left. A few have gone back to raise kids or to start up things or just didn't kind of like the rat race. Like, I got plenty of friends that will come down, we'll go to the footy and I'll get a text, be like, so happy to be back in Bendigo. You know, just they just get worn out by the pace.

Josh: Yeah.

Basil: Which is— I don't notice it, but What feels like that's home, right? Yeah.

Tommy: What's home for you, Josh? Like, you grew up in the burbs. Is that like when you were out in these areas or is that just gives you shivers?

Josh: Yeah, I don't know. I like it. I think there's a difference between feeling like home and feeling nostalgic. Nostalgia. If I go to Endeavour Hills Shopping Centre like that, for me is like nostalgia to sing little— like I remember when Domino's came to Endeavour Hills, it was huge.

Basil: Big day.

Josh: It was massive. Yeah, it was a massive deal.

Basil: Yeah.

Josh: And yeah, it just felt like America has arrived.

Tommy: But would you ever— would it be something you'd want to move back to?

Josh: No.

Tommy: Yeah, it's interesting. I mean, I grew up in Brighton and it's— I definitely have— I said to Amy recently, I'd love to live there again. Like, I'd love to be able to afford a house in Brighton. It means you're doing pretty well.

Josh: Yeah. It'd be cool. Like, I think about like regional, like something that's like a Daylesford or something like that being cool.

Tommy: The thing is they get so quiet. Shepparton got so quiet. I can imagine Bendigo Sunday afternoon.

Basil: Yeah.

Tommy: They become sleepy towns.

Mason: Yeah.

Tommy: And then, but then there's a bit of a bustle, you know, during the week and on a Saturday.

Mason: Yeah.

Tommy: But then there is, yeah, they, they do kind of just shut off at night. Yeah.

Basil: And so I think people just switch on when they have to and then you switch off and you kind of, you you have to fall into the rhythm because if you want to do something on a Sunday, you really have to work hard to drum up people because they're not in that rhythm. That's what I find. And I just love in Melbourne being able to, you know, it's like if I feel like comedy on a Monday night, it's like I'm gonna go to Spleen, you know. I don't have to wait for that one Thursday a month that, you know, my mates in Bendigo run the comedy night where, you know, Tommy Daselow and that come up from, you know, from Melbourne.

Tommy: So when I was living in Shepparton, my housemate Kel, who's been on the show, bought, uh, he brought me a gift for my birthday, which was tickets to see a band that he loved. Who was it? Um, so it was like, uh, a rapper.

Josh: I've definitely done that before.

Tommy: Aussie rapper. Um, he, he— anyway, this— I can't remember the name of him because he clearly wasn't my pick, but I appreciated that he bought these for me. And it was double pass, and we were going to go on a Friday night. We had to drive across to Bendigo. So it's about an hour and a half, an hour.

Josh: Yeah.

Tommy: Yep. And we're like, oh, we got a shift on in the morning on air. And so I had to be up early, 9 AM. So we were driving. We couldn't really get wasted. Didn't want to come back really, really late. And so we went and had dinner at Grilled, which was lovely. It's a great selling point of Bendigo.

Basil: Bull Street.

Tommy: They've got a tram and they've also got—

Josh: They've got a tram in Bendigo.

Basil: Yeah. Yeah. Tourist tram. Can't do anything. You can— there's one stop on it.

Tommy: Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Basil: But they got a tram.

Tommy: They got a tram. And so we drive across.

Josh: They're part of V/Line? Bendigo in general?

Basil: Oh, in general. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Big stuff.

Josh: I wasn't expecting the tram just to like—

Tommy: Yeah, you get the V/Line down there.

Josh: Onto the V/Line, just keeps going.

Tommy: Putting down to Melbourne. And so we went across and we went to this venue after dinner. And so it was early, it was about 8 o'clock. And we found out that he—

Basil: Was it the Black Swan?

Tommy: It was a corner. It was near the burger, near that same place.

Unknown: Yeah, it's the Black Swan.

Tommy: And we looked across and on the corner and we went in. It was— he was this guy, Seth Sentry. Oh yeah, was the guy. He wasn't on till 1 AM.

Josh: Oh no, what was happening in the meantime?

Tommy: I don't know, there was no one at the pub when we, when we got there.

Josh: Would you reckon he was doing the rounds going from place to place?

Tommy: No, no, it was a head— he was headlining a show in Bendigo. And so he was, um, I don't know, there was like DJs beforehand. And so we left. We drove back to Shepparton. So we basically drove to Shepparton for grilled, which Shepparton doesn't have. So yeah, Bendigo.

Josh: What about like finding contacts, like being in the production space? Yeah, trying to build a client base from living in a regional town. How did you find that?

Basil: Yeah, super hard. Super, super hard. And I'm a big reacher outerer. And so because I'd been in Canada for a couple years working as an editor. So I came back to Bendigo.

Josh: What sort of things were you editing?

Basil: Sports. Yeah, hockey and baseball in Toronto.

Tommy: Did you notice the puck when you walked in on the— there's a puck on the shelf. 3D deal.

Josh: It's just on the bottom, bottom left.

Tommy: Yeah, in the books.

Basil: Amazing.

Josh: Yeah.

Basil: Hell yeah. Is it a Leafs puck?

Tommy: I don't know. Has it got a leaf on it?

Mason: Yeah, there's a leaf on it, but Dill said it's not an official puck.

Tommy: Oh, I think it's great.

Mason: It was a puck based on, I think, uh, it's, it's not heavy enough to be a proper puck.

Tommy: Can we throw it at your head, see what happens?

Mason: Yeah, it definitely hurt.

Josh: Anyway, so you, was it, were you working for like a sports channel or something?

Basil: Or yeah, I was working for a post house and, and they were, um, they were, yeah, just pretty much sport and music, uh, music docs, which was sick because I was like, I'm gonna make docs, I'm gonna, that's what I'm gonna do. I got out of like journo school and I was like, I'm gonna make docs and documentaries, not just documents with text documents. Yeah, no, no, documentaries. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But then I just started to get that feeling of like I wanted to do my own thing and what I was drawn to was the short forms.

Josh: Why did you go to Canada?

Mason: Sorry.

Basil: Chased a girl originally, but it was also to start my career. I studied over there, so I was always going back. So I had grand dreams of living in Montreal, which I figured out when I visited. I was like, man, I would have failed here pretty hard.

Josh: You speak French?

Basil: No.

Josh: Okay. Yeah, that's fucked.

Basil: So bad. So bad. Yeah, you could survive, but I don't think you can thrive there without speaking the language. Yeah. But I lost where we were with the original question.

Josh: Yeah. So, the—

Basil: Oh, Bendigo. Super hard. Super hard.

Josh: Yeah.

Basil: That's why I moved back to Melbourne.

Josh: But so, how did you end up from Bendigo to Canada then?

Basil: Like after— Because I studied in Melbourne and then I studied overseas in Canada. And then—

Josh: Was that an exchange program?

Unknown: Exchange.

Mason: Yeah.

Basil: Yeah, yeah. I went to Carleton UEL, so it's like our Carlton with an E. Yeah. And did like video journalism over there.

Josh: Oh, that's cool.

Basil: I was like, this is sick. I love this country. I'm going to come back here.

Tommy: The, like the, I mean, is Bendigo a country town? Is that what you call it?

Basil: Yeah.

Tommy: Like a regional town. Yeah. Because you could, you could look at it and go, it's super hard. Or when you're in a big market, you could— or I could look to somewhere like a Shepparton or Bendigo and say it would be super easy to get to infiltrate the, the small community.

Basil: Yeah, definitely, in a great way.

Tommy: Infiltrate sounds a bit— no, no, you're driving, but you just, you know, all the business owners. Maybe you can't charge as much for what you do, your service you offer, but you could just be the number one service provider totally in the region.

Basil: Yeah.

Tommy: And so it's— what do you think now being in a big city? Yeah, having to service clients when there's, you know, a million of you trying— a million of us, of us trying to do the same thing.

Basil: Yeah, it's, uh, it's, it's super hard. I, I hear what you're saying. Like, there's, there's— I think there's a couple of levels to it. To, to get out there and meet people is, um, is definitely— I think, I think it is harder in, in the country town. Like, you know, there's there's just not like the meetups and, um, people that know people and know people. Like, that's in the country in general, that's what happens. But it's, it's so niche that I was trying to hit up like one or two kind of production companies, um, who were just, you know, people doing it. And there wasn't really like a scene, I guess, is what I'm trying to say. It's, it's— I think it's easier to tap into a scene in a big city. But you're right with like crushing the market. But that was the other thing that was just like there was, there was like 3 people that did video and it was like, that's it. There's, there's no more fresh businesses coming up that need new. It's like, oh, we've already got the video guys and I know them. And then we have our photographers and it's like, I know them, you know? So you just end up, you know, stealing work from your mates, you know, in Malibu, there's plenty to go around. You can just handball and yeah.

Josh: And so you were, you did a bunch of video production stuff for Jake and Amir, the podcasters and comedy duo. How did that come about?

Basil: Just like an ice-cold email. That's what it was. But I think I was able to get across some giggles and get across that I was a true fan in that, in that email. I think it'd be funny to go back and check, but I think I pitched like the Olsen twins. The Olsen twins did a bunch of movies back in the day and there was one like was, was supposed, supposedly Australia, but I don't think they even came to Australia to shoot it. So I was just like, maybe we want to watch that tonight. Do that.

Josh: Yeah. What is that? What do you remember what that film was called?

Basil: No, I don't.

Josh: '97 Beyond the Case. Was it— did they position it as going to Australia?

Basil: Don't— I don't think I even watched it. I just like, just watched the trailer. I was like, this is trash. There's no way they shot this in Australia. And I think I pitched something like that. And anyway, I just, I just gave them a very, a very good offer to be like, hey, we can film. You don't have to pay us. We'll sort ourselves out. We'll sort everything out ourselves, you know. Flights and a comm and all of that. And so yeah, they were like, yeah, sweet. And I think we did a really good deal and we, a really good job for them. And yeah, I think we, we became kind of friends with them and then they came back out like a year and a half later and we, we did the same again.

Josh: So great.

Tommy: That's great. So Jake and Amir are American podcasters.

Josh: Yep.

Tommy: Creators.

Basil: And they did CollegeHumor for like 10 years.

Tommy: So they had their own show on that.

Josh: Yeah.

Tommy: It's so cool.

Basil: Yeah, they're really cool. And, and that was just kind of around the time of like, you know, doing small client stuff in Bendigo and, um, you know, just, just wanting to do— aspiring to do bigger things. And so I was just looking, I was like, what can we shoot, what can we shoot, what can we shoot? And it was just like, you know, because we love bands. Um, I'm talking about when I say we, it's like me and my childhood best friend from, from Bendigo, Dill. Like, let's, let's, what do we want to shoot? And then just like cold, because we had nothing to show for ourselves either, just like dinky die little, little vids. So, you know, you have to catch a break at some point. Someone's going to take a chance on you.

Tommy: There's only so much tram B-roll you can shoot down Main Street of Bendigo to seem like you're from a Metro Market.

Basil: Hey, don't forget about the fountain.

Tommy: Oh yeah, yeah. And the churches. How many churches?

Basil: Just a few, but the other one, the one cathedral. Yeah, the biggest in the Southern Hemisphere.

Josh: Is it really?

Basil: I think it's the only one.

Tommy: And, um, so how many emails does it take to get somebody to say yes? Mr. 97, he's lucked out at about one. One email to me, the next minute he has a job.

Mason: Just one? No, actually, it would have, it would have been like probably 15.

Tommy: Really?

Mason: Yeah.

Tommy: There's poor—

Josh: who else did you email?

Mason: Just a bunch of randoms.

Josh: Who else?

Mason: I don't know, you just go through the top, top listings on Google.

Josh: I get that.

Tommy: And then just the subject, I'll work for free in every one of them. Was that every one of them?

Mason: I mean, you have to go through and, and cheque if you actually want to work with them and if you like them. But yeah, yeah.

Josh: Basil, what's your thoughts on working for free?

Basil: You got to do it, you got to do it. I mean, uh, I think, you know, the likes of Gary Vee would would, would say it a lot better. Um, but yeah, I mean, you've got— you, you've got nothing to show for yourself. Why— if you flip the script, if you were in their position, like, would you pay someone that has no skills, no life skills, um, to, to, to, to do the work? You probably, you probably wouldn't. Yeah, you know, but would you, would you take a chance on someone? It's like, I think I wouldn't, and I have. I've had a couple of little young guys come in and work for us.

Josh: And the going to Canada and doing all that sort of stuff, if there's someone listening who is in uni and they have that opportunity, opportunity to go overseas, yeah, what did you take away from it?

Basil: Um, well, I mean, everything. You're like, just getting outside of your comfort zone is, is a huge thing. Just travel in general does that. Um, and it just, it just forces you to, to problem solve. And then think on your feet. Um, and, uh, yeah, I mean, the— it was funny, like, getting into— because I was doing journalism, I got into— and I'm— I did journalism knowing that I wanted to make documentaries, but I'm not really into news. So that's just a bit of a caveat. So I get over there and, um, I can't remember the guy's name, but it was the current— it was the, at the time, the current Prime Minister of Canada. Everyone's talking about this big news story, and I just had to like lean over to the girl beside me. I'm like, I'm sorry, who are we talking about? But like, the Prime Minister of Canada. I'm like, okay, okay, cool. And like, that's the, that's the first, first day, first lesson. And I'm like, I am in massive trouble here. Like, I don't know what I'm doing. But you get through it, right? And, and then you just, you know, you— I mean, a lot of it's just figuring yourself out too when you're young. Like, that's the hardest, that's the hardest thing. You don't know what you're good at or what you can offer. Like, you think you do, but You don't.

Josh: And so that, like, doing the journalism sort of skewed thing— yeah, a lot of people want to be doing documentaries and stuff. Was that a good route, um, specifically if you want to be doing documentary filmmaking?

Basil: Yeah, I, I, oh, I don't know. I definitely know an authority in the area, and I think it's changed so much too. Like, a lot of, of a lot of what I look at and the, and the world that I'm in is short form, so So, you know, the longer big issue stuff is stuff that I've, you know, stayed away from. You might need like Damon Gamo on the show or something.

Tommy: But it's— what's interesting is the university selling the dream of creating documentaries, or you want to be a long-form documentary filmmaker.

Basil: Yeah, I think it's horseshit. Yeah. And it's weird. I'm definitely a hypocrite because I'm a big Monash University fanboy. I went there. I do a lot of work for them.

Josh: You have like a hoodie and stuff. I don't have a 95% $95 hoodie. No, is that really what they charge? Fuck, we underbaked with ours. $95, really?

Basil: Yeah, I think so. It's up there. God, it's gross. It's, it's nowhere near as good as the dailytalkshow.com.

Josh: I mean, these are, yeah, screen printed, high quality. Yeah, yeah.

Basil: Um, comfy.

Josh: Yeah, yeah, very.

Basil: Yeah, but I didn't like, I didn't learn any of the editing skills or anything like that at, at uni. I remember we had a 2-hour tutorial on how to use the camera before we went out and shot our you know, first pieces. And I just had been making videos since I was like 16. So I was— yeah, every birthday in Bendigo, all my friends got a video. That was the thing.

Josh: So if you've got like a journalism degree then, or what?

Basil: I do, yeah. I got a BJ, Bachelor of Journalism.

Tommy: Nice. Yeah, nice.

Josh: You'd do it just for that, wouldn't you? Just for that joke.

Tommy: But my body's initials are BJ.

Josh: Hey yo.

Basil: But like, honestly, no one's ever asked for that. No job I have ever got. And in the last few years, like, I had to do a resume the other day to do some work up at the at the hospital, and they were like, they were like, hey, can you send through, uh, your CV? And I was like, I haven't done a resume in 5 years.

Tommy: You know what you can do? Keep your LinkedIn updated and press export because it just really spits out a resume. It has your name, has all the things you've done that you've entered. Why? I mean, this is— I once had a client ask me for my credentials.

Basil: Really?

Tommy: Just laugh at them. I don't know if I made— maybe didn't even respond to it.

Josh: I can do an ollie.

Tommy: But it's so— it's bizarre.

Basil: Yeah.

Tommy: I mean, I haven't— I can't remember the last time I was asked for a resume either.

Mason: It's weird.

Tommy: I mean, but maybe it's just the— it's the field.

Basil: I think, I think it's definitely the field we're in. But yeah, I mean, there's so many online debates of like, should I go to film school or not? And it's like I don't know, I don't know, I don't think so. Like, the Dill who I work with, like, he went to, he went to uni, but he did, uh, he did like accounting and management. So, you know, that there's nothing creative in there, and it doesn't lend itself to him being an amazing, um, camera operator.

Josh: Yeah, it's, it's interesting.

Tommy: The, um, we were a year ago today We released our episode that we did with Seth Godin. So today is quite a momentous day, you know, like it's a bit rattled, to be honest.

Josh: Why? No, no, we're just— we're here.

Tommy: We're here. But a year later.

Josh: Yeah. I mean, does it feel like a long time ago?

Tommy: Feels like so long ago. You posted a photo yesterday of us out the front of his office and we look so fresh and just like so young.

Josh: Young. It was only a year ago.

Tommy: Isn't that depressing? I look so much older.

Josh: '97. Did we end up getting a snippet that we could play?

Mason: We got a snippet.

Josh: Okay, here we go.

Tommy: So if you've just started listening to the podcast, as in not this moment, but just as in recently you started. Yeah, I mean, I'm amazed.

Josh: Does anyone just press play?

Tommy: Sometimes I randomly pull up and let go. I reckon that's pretty, um, but if you have, Seth Godin is someone who we're a big fan of, and we— I set Josh the challenge to get Seth on the podcast a long time ago, and he made it happen. And we flew to New York and we went to his office and we had an hour with him. It was amazing. And this is a little snippet.

Josh: Yeah, what is this? '97? What are you about to play?

Mason: Uh, it's how to work out how much you should charge.

Josh: Great.

Tommy: Oh, great relevance to the topic we're talking about. Amazing. You could just pull that up randomly.

Josh: Don't get it. Why are you—

Tommy: it comes to, um, putting the value on yourself. I've had my own business for the majority of my working life, and I've always kind of, you know you know, set the point of which I think I'm worth, started charging that, and then thought, hang on, I could be making more money. And I'm not there internally feeling that I'm of that value, right? But then somehow I stumble and I get the value, and then I'm like, I'm worth it. How does people who are running their own business, right, it's a great question, get to that sort of feeling inside? And do you even need to have that feeling?

Unknown: Okay, so first of all, price and value are totally different things. And you have to decode that if you're going to be the person who's charging for your work. What you would pay you to do it is different than what someone else would pay you.

Tommy: I'll do it for free, right?

Unknown: And so we begin with price is a service, and it's a service that helps the client identify what kind of promise are you making. And so So, you know, in, in India, uh, there's an eye hospital that will— that has saved the eyesight of more people than the sum populations of Chicago, Los Angeles, and Detroit put together. And they will do cataract surgery on you for $115, or free if you don't want to pay. And the message of their pricing says to people in India, you can afford this, you don't have to be blind, right? So there's an absolute value of what's going on. But not 20 blocks from there, if you're a wealthy person living in India, you can buy an Hermès bag for $10,000. Is it worth it? Well, I'm not sure it's worth— what is that, 100 times as much as getting your eyesight back? How could it be? Yeah, right. But if you have your eyesight and you're rich, the Hermès bag is worth way more than $10,000 because it sends a message to your friends and your family and everyone else that you're the kind of person that could have a $10,000 bag. And so Hermès is not stealing from people. They're saying, if you want to buy this symbol, this is what the symbol costs. If it's not worth it to you, don't buy it, right? So when we think about, for example, uh, those those firms that do naming. When NBC wants to change its logo, they pay $100,000 to one of those firms. Turns out they got a logo that someone down the street would have built for $200,000. So were they ripped off? I don't think so, because what they got for $100,000 was all the meetings, was the fancy office, was the ability to tell their boss to hire the top of the field, blah blah blah blah blah. That's what you sell. So I don't think it's, am I worth it? It's It's, is my storey coherent and am I making a promise I can keep? And the last thing I'll say about this is, if you're a freelancer, the only way to, to do better is not to work more hours, because you can't work more hours. It's not to hire people to do your work because they're not going to be as good as you. It's to get better clients. Freelancers with better clients charge those clients more. Those clients demand more from them, are more likely to say yes to good work. Work, which helps them get even better clients. So the way you get better clients is by charging more, not by charging less.

Tommy: That's amazing. Thanks, Seth. Thinking of you.

Josh: Uh, it was also a year ago that we, um, had Chase Jarvis on the show.

Mason: Yeah.

Josh: Uh, which, Basil, thank you for the book. That is, uh, Chase's new book, Creative Calling.

Tommy: What do you come with next to the office? I mean, you first came with brownies, second with Chase Jarvis, third you come with Book on how to make brownies.

Josh: You're on your own.

Basil: Don't know, it just felt right. I just, I got, uh, I was ordering a book and I was like, I will order because it was a pre-order, so ages ago. And I was like, I'll just get a second one and someone will need it. Yeah, yeah. And then, um, yeah, then he popped up on a video that I saw, um, with you guys the other day. And I had originally heard the— I think that was my first mic drop moment listening to you guys, was Chase just in New York and Chase Jarvis. So I was like, I wanted to be that guy. I've walked around New York wanting to run into Chase.

Josh: Damn. And what's your plan with your, uh, podcast?

Basil: Um, getting outside of my comfort zone a little bit. I'm starting to get outside of my own network and, um, kind of start to talk about issues and stuff, going back to the journalism roots. Because at the moment I've just been talking about media and it's a very, it's a very like, um, insular thing. And I've had friends go, listen to your podcast, it was great, sounded, sounded good. Um, you were, you were like, you're a little bit funny. I was like, thanks, I'll take that. And then, um, it was like, didn't really get it, and it was, you know, what, didn't really understand. So I just turned off and I was like, I don't, I don't want that, you know. I can have those conversations off the mic. That's, that's what you do anyway, right?

Josh: What's it called again?

Basil: Uh, well, the plug, uh, it's The Process with Basil Jarrod.

Josh: Okay, we'll link it up in the show notes.

Basil: Appreciate that, guys.

Tommy: Thank you. I love it. So the outside your bubble thing, yeah, it's, um It's interesting because it's so— it's easy to create inside your bubble. It's easy to show people and have your mates all say, yeah, that's awesome.

Mason: Yeah.

Tommy: But then there's the, the, you know, the, the courage you need to do to put it outside. And that's like, it's a weird thing creating things that will be seen by a bunch of different people that will have opinions on it.

Basil: Totally.

Tommy: What, what have you, what have you learned from doing that? That, uh, what have you— yeah, what have you learned from putting stuff out to potentially be criticized? Or, you know, you just, you just don't know what's gonna land.

Basil: I think that that's always so surprising. And, and it's, it's the— it is the old chestnut with, um, vulnerability. But, you know, the more, the more gross and, and exposed you feel like that's what people connect with. So I think especially, especially, you know, doing what we do for a living and being like a professional editor, you know, in a lot of people's eyes, a lot of clients that I work for, I just edit for them. Yeah, I have to be, I have to be very wary that I'm, that I'm not editing on the fly with what I'm saying. And, and, you know, especially when it's my own show and, um, you, if you want, you're expecting huge vulnerability, and if you want, you know, huge nuggets from your, from your guests, then you've got to you've got to bring it as well. So that's, that's, that was a big thing for me. And I've done plenty of interviews, but a lot of times I'm chopping out, you know, my questions and all of that. So to keep a lot of that stuff in. Yeah.

Unknown: Yeah.

Basil: I mean, yeah, there's, there's so many, so many learnings.

Josh: Have you worked out what the thing is that you would by default try and hide or what is the editing that's going on in real time?

Basil: Man, so good. So good. Uh, I— yeah, I think it's probably— it's probably that first thought. It's that first thought, the first thing. And then I go, oh, let's just run it through, is that going to be okay? And then I'll— yeah, a lot of times I still offer it, but I'll, I'll kind of like filter it. Um, which there's no— in an edited podcast, there is actually no need for that. Um, because, because I, I edit my podcasts, it doesn't, doesn't go out, you know, live or A lot of people just don't touch their podcast. But, you know, that's a skill of mine. So I do. I think that I can offer that. Yeah. But yeah, I don't know, like nothing murky. Like, I think that that's— I'm always pretty confident when I go through security cheques and stuff like that because I'm like, you can hold me here for 10 hours, but I ain't got nothing. You know, I was the good Catholic boy in the back of the church. Ain't got nothing to hide, you know?

Tommy: So he's stashing his shit out the front. Yeah, I don't I don't think we're all that great at identifying what is great because it's so tarnished by all of our experiences. So especially when we're creating something that puts us, puts our vulnerabilities out there, because then it's like, well, like, like you said, what, what are the things you self-filter? Yeah, it's like they're the— that might be what you're editing out could be the gold.

Basil: Yeah.

Josh: And so, for instance, it's like, I think for me, it is trying to sound smart or not to sound dumb.

Basil: Yes.

Josh: And that's like, sounding dumb is normally a great in for really solid conversation.

Basil: 100%.

Josh: And so sometimes it can be like, we know what the right answer is. We know, you know, the right things to say. But it's not necessarily the true thing to us. Like, I think that we all think stuff that's irrational or dumb or doesn't make sense, and I would prefer to bring— like, my natural inclination is to say the right thing to sound smart, but there is, I think, way more to learn in that unconscious, almost that first thought. Like, what is the insecure thing that this push back the lizard brain that's talking.

Basil: Yeah, I think you guys, you guys do it awesome. And I'll watch on clips that you've cut up being like, you could have left that out, you could have left that first part out. But then you see where it leads to and I'm like, oh, that makes sense. You need that at the top. That's where it all stems from. Is that, is that mistake or is that fuck up or, you know, whatever, that the incorrect turn of phrase, something that might be a little, you know, un-PC or whatever. But that's where the, that's the, where the learning comes from, right? Otherwise, it's just— you're just spouting bullshit that you're just regurgitating over and over and over again.

Josh: Yeah, it's playing to the platform as well. Like, what is— oh yeah, what is, uh, what does podcasting bring that a 3-minute radio break, um, can't bring? And so if you are super, super edited, have you just created another radio show?

Tommy: Yeah, yeah, it's interesting.

Josh: Anyway, uh, thanks for the book anyway. You are most welcome. And the brownies as well.

Basil: Thank you for the marshmallows.

Tommy: They were good.

Josh: They were really good. But we're, um, I'm glad you didn't bring any in because, yeah, I'm leaning out for LA. So yeah, just on those brownies, we, um, annoyingly Basil, uh, quiet laugh, he silent laughed, his face was, you know, I was like shredding for stereo.

Tommy: Yeah, we left a whole bunch of the brownies you brought in the fridge.

Josh: A 3D deal with a fucking Yeah, he ate the final ones.

Tommy: No, he ate all the good flavoured ones and left one that just—

Josh: which one was that?

Tommy: So the berry one.

Josh: I liked the raspberry.

Tommy: I liked it, but he had the, like, the peanut butter, the one that most people would go to. Yeah, and he left the one that would usually get left that us fatties would just come and scoop up. But I had to go at him still and then ate the other one.

Josh: Anyway, it's a daily talk show and Mr. 97, your LA, uh, fact of the day.

Mason: Yep. In 1996, Charlie Sheen bought 2,615 seats at the Angels Stadium so he could catch a home run. He didn't catch a home run.

Josh: Oh, really?

Tommy: So anyway, that's true. Far out. Yeah, wait, that would cost so much money.

Josh: He bought 2,600 seats, so he was on his own so he could just catch it.

Mason: Home run. Yeah, yeah. Yeah.

Josh: Have you found any photos or anything of this? You didn't think of looking, did you?

Mason: I mean, it said he didn't catch it, so.

Josh: Yeah, but I'm just, I want to see a shot of Charlie Sheen in the middle of 2,000 seats.

Tommy: Just dropped $260K or something. Ridiculous.

Josh: It's a pretty good fact.

Tommy: And if you want to go and have a listen to the Seth Godin episode that we did, you have to search thedailytalkshow.com/190.

Mason: It'll also be in the show notes.

Josh: Thank you, Mr. 97th. Thank you, Basil. That's The Daily Talk Show. Hi@thedailytalkshow.com. Is the email address. Uh, please leave us an Apple Podcast review. We haven't had one in like a week. It's very upsetting. Yeah, so feel free to do that. Otherwise, we'll see you tomorrow, guys.

Tommy: See you guys.