- October 12, 2018
The Daily Talk Show — Friday October 12 (Ep 194) – Josh Janssen & Tommy Jackett
Amiira Ruotola and Greg Behrendt have helped millions of people in the dating game. As well as being a stand up comic, Greg co-wrote the bestselling book “He’s Just Not That Into You” which Amiira collaborated on. Amiira’s background as a music exec translates to a no-time-for-bullshit approach to writing.
They’ve appeared on Oprah, had their book adapted into a Hollywood film and written “It’s Called A Breakup Because It’s Broken”, “It’s Just A F***ing Date” and the recently released book “How To Keep Your Marriage From Sucking” — bringing guidance from both Amiira and Greg, commentating on modern love and relationships through the lens of their own marriage.
They also have a relationship and behaviour podcast, Maybe It’s You, which is well worth a listen!
On today’s episode of The Daily Talk Show from Studio City, Los Angeles, we talk about how marriages change after having kids, Greg doing standup in Australia, mental health issues within a relationship and how being diagnosed with cancer changes your life.
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conversation sometimes worth recording with Josh Janssen and Tommy jacket. It's a daily talk show everyone from Li wearing what part here in Studio City within the City of Angels. Okay great
all the movie studios that are here in sweet sweet Studio City and the voices yoga studio apartments just a lot of sad
we have the different lots of that the Universal Studios and the studio. Be right you might recognise the voices a mirror and Greg from maybe it's your podcast, maybe to podcast Yeah. And you might not even recognise my voice because it's going does seem a little a little a little raspy. Yeah, we've been doing
A lot of podcasts and it was much worse and they said I'm I was right about that voice belong to him because I listened to the podcast and then I was like, man, I wonder which one it was. And I was right. Really? I didn't know one photo and what was the tell tell song? without being too hurtful. Be really hurtful.
You seem sweeter, and you seem cooler.
I mean, I was trying to show my new fancy new balance shoes to put you off. Yeah, that's my corner.
They're pretty cool. I the only reason I get them is because they fit a wide foot which is probably less less of a cool storey. And here's the thing that doesn't mean that you can't have both things. But what people would notice about you first is like oh, that guy seems pretty sweet and you're like mega cool for me. And then he made me not you don't you know, I don't feel intimidated at first. I'm like, that's the guy that's gonna be and also
just like, you know, yeah, read the game or whatever. Maybe you pick up on it. He's He's more likely to peacock Yeah, and
Right right I'm I like to come across more gentle now that I'm married and I've got a 19 month old baby. Congratulations. Thank you. I'm excited. So I think that hopefully brings me down to a sweeter level. I feel like you both have very sweet energy and demeanors. I think you Where's travelling? I know it's just it could be that could be Yeah. What do you enjoy Australia? I was gonna say what's cool is it could be actually creepy. Greg, for you for when you in Australia doing your comedy.
You've now got someone from the audience in your house. It's true that could end up really badly but
that's Josh Well, what was 22 2012 I was actually going through my Facebook messages. So in 2012 we brain I went to the headliners and we saw we saw you there we talked we I Facebook message and I was like You are our favourite part of the show because you were talking. Maybe you talk a lot about this is how we connect. You talk about food tick if I
Yeah, you have the you know, you talk about me being sort of the softer one. I feel like we both have potential female qualities. Yeah, absolutely. their actual female an extra cup of girl in the
girl yeah very fam. And so no there was a lot of reliability and what you're talking about and and so we did so Brian I not only saw you on in 2012 but we then saw you again when you had the show with a clown pants. I feel like you walk
the clown from the neck down when I came out with Dave my podcast partner and we did the podcast out there as well the walk in the room thing and I yeah, that was part of the yeah
shamelessly wear clown pants a little bit their days where they fit better than other pants. You know they've got
more room for anyone tell you you can't wake clown pants. Well, it's not that I can't it's I won't get the things I need if I wear them.
They don't help me. They don't take me forward in the world. They regress me in the same way that a teen daughters Yeah, if they come home, he's wearing clown pants. They're like no, but they're they're just about to hear because I wanted to explain to you remember, I don't know who you're who when you saw the triple headliner who you saw, but just if my daughters are listening to this for any reason, john Delaney was on the show, so he liked me more than john Melanie. I'm just saying. That's possible because they love
I know it's Todd Barry. Energy shifts in the house is when the kids want to talk about john Molina. He said like having kids. It's sort of like having trolls at home all the time. Like do you feel like you get true troll? No, it's just by virtue of the way they live. I find it like I they're lovely to me, but just what they like, makes me go Oh, really? Because I know what he's doing. It doesn't you know, like you it's just you know, it's a little if you feel time, ya know, you see time and also you see what's like for a young person to like something that's new, and you're like, Oh, right. How old are the kids in
stina 13 Yeah, we have two girls 16 Whoo. Yeah, I'm dreading those days from my young son. And you might hear Yeah. Hey, that's how
we have so many dogs here. And there's so noisy we apologise to the listener, they have to listen to the drink water or pass the microphone.
to any of the dogs have anxiety. Yeah, no, not no fear.
Anxiety and it is not not a lot of fun. I mean, I'm dealing with my own anxiety. I don't need to worry about
Enough, man. What are you doing? named after the drama of the clash? And okay, so if people have engaged you guys are married women over 18 year? Yes. Yeah, yeah. So yeah, they're about 20. Okay, and you've got your book that's just coming out. Yes. How to keep your marriage from sucking. Yes, we wrote a book we've we've we've written other books in the past but but this is part one of our marriage series. And it's for like, like, anything
engagement through the first five years of marriage and then the follow up is coming out next year and that's called, we used to be in love and now we work here. And that's for all of like the different forces and when kids come along and and fuck up your couple dumb and that kind of stuff warming the thick of it. I'm two years into marriage yes and 19 months into fatherhood. That's so exciting. So is there a question that you could ask me that would pull out some details to tell you whether my marriages
we'd rather you ask the question like, we don't like to watch other couples and go event they aren't asking. We're not saying you know, right. The one thing I've learned about self help, is it. It only comes when somebody puts a question at the end. Like if people tell you stuff in life, you start going you know what you want to do if you start with you know what you asked, and they don't want to know Yeah, most the time I realised like that people really don't want to know until they really do.
And sometimes that's a shame because you're like, Man
You could have, I could have told you that I wanted all that we'd made all the mistakes we figured out. We figured out so much later in our marriage that we had planted all these fantastic landmines for each other to step on, or didn't pay attention. I didn't pay attention or foundries or respect boundaries or made accommodations that you don't you don't think of in the early days, especially when things are relatively new, where you have a you know, you have an infant, and all of a sudden, if it works once, that's what happens. No one's discussed it, it might, it might not be okay, five years from now, but it's already set in stone. Because there's no conversation and it worked. The one time with the baby is that's what happens or you're the guy that does that. And you find that, you know, you get years into a marriage and you feel invisible, you're not being heard, you're not being considered or you didn't agree to this situation that you're in, or you're always conceding or you're getting the short end of the stick. And it's because we make these accommodations and agreements without actually conversing and agreeing upon them. It just has
Sorry, should should you be trying to put your worst self forward? in some regards? Well, you, you were always
a long term relationship. I also think most people really are themselves. It really isn't that I mean, you know, you think you've got like, I've gotten different sides and people don't know and they're like, no, I could see it. I could, I could tell you know, and sometimes you will see things that you don't even but
it's, it's about accepting a that
the person you picked, you know, there's no person to stop you. This is a very common thing with every married couple. It's like everybody gets to this point. You also you get old one day ago, Fuck, I'm going to leave at some point. You know, you have this mortality thing, you know, am I having the life I really want and how come I'm not getting the things I should have gotten. And so there's also that perspective of suddenly you start going back and trying to figure out how you're going to get happy again or be different or whatever and the person who is going to get all the blame for that will be your spouse because they're the closest and they're the ones that limited you bye bye
abilities or they didn't encourage me when I should have. And so that's there's sort of an imaginary thing that you do too. So you have to kind of look at all of that going forward, knowing that that's out there. It just makes it easier to scale up. Here's a Bridget my cross. Here's another bridge, my cross, you know,
some people, when bad things happen, pull back, some people wouldn't bad things happen, get too close, you know, if you look at your person and realise, look what they're doing the best with what they, you know, with what they have, you know, things have grown in empathy for couples that have, I guess called it quits years later after the kids have lifetime. Because having the kid and like, it's survival mode, right? It's like, absolutely, I mean, Amy, my wife and I, we've had to, you know, we talk a lot. And so we are very open in the dialogue of our marriage and what's going on. But if we weren't, you could see how it's just like, you're zoned in on this key is the key to do this work money and it's
And you start and you stop being the first consideration in the relationship you're no longer her number one first thought of the day, or first lot of a time and but and vice versa. But there also is, here's the thing you don't realise is your son is 19 months old, so he probably goes to bed at seven or eight o'clock at night and on the right, so you still have night time together, you can actually be a couple and finish conversations and what have you when your kids get older, and they're not going to bed till 10 o'clock, 11 o'clock 2am with AC t testing or whatever like, there you absolutely get so disconnected and the time for the relationship or the the couple of the marriage relationship. That's the first thing that goes because the other thing is can't wait. You can't you can't change that. Their schedule is the important one and their needs are the important things. And so the first thing to go is each other or because because then you throw the obligations of your job and then your family before you
Got married like your parents, your parents need things from you your siblings need things from you. And the thing that you you really show them It really makes you a symbol my person knows I love cool if I don't deal with them today Yeah, right there the first one to be, you know to be disregarded because you assume that your love is strong enough its elastic enough that we can stretch it it's going to bounce back because we both know we love each other. So it's fine if I fuck you over in favour of the child. My parents my job would have you know, put them outside. Sorry guys are our dogs literally are Greg's not heckling me.
They want all of the attention right now. Oh, wait, wait, wait, Greg. Oh.
Yes, we'll have to tie it what this time, tap the timestamp this. Perfect. I take Buddha to Buddha's over here, Buddha at and don't throw three dogs into the mix of what we've been talking about. The kids the marriage
Can't not even kidding. It is. And then career on top of all of that, yes. I mean, yeah. What have you found with having kids dogs, and then having those responsibilities where you ask them in survival mode, plus a marriage, and then also wanting to have a career, it's, you know, it can it can be really challenging for and for a long time for for, you know, the first I would say the first few years of having kids Greg travelled a lot for stand up. After that, you know, we started writing the books and we started having, you know, shows and work in town and we worked together a lot.
And, and so there there was sort of that they were forced together for work
during that period, and then he went back on the road again, so there's a lot of times where he was travelling for work, and I was sort of single parenting and there were times when we were working together and the kids were, you know, when we could see them and my parents helped out, but there's also been times when it's just not if he
He's travelling for work, I don't have time to work, I have to be like full time mom and pick up, you know, writing jobs here and there. But But you know, you have to raise your children, you can't just expect them to be raised by the internet or other people like if you want them to not be raised by the internet. You want them to be good people and feel secure. Sure. They have to be important to their parents. There's I mean, it just is that thing. So it is there have been times where I've gone years without working because having kids really is especially young, young kids. Is is full time. How do you how do you balance that, especially with say, having one spouse who might do a job that's quite individualistic, and by design, if it's something entertainment, they're travelling a lot? Is there actually a conversation where it's like,
Greg gets to us to do the thing that he wants to do and then you know, come back and be at home.
A lot or, like, do you feel that there needs to be that concert? I do think there needs to it needs to be agreed upon. You know, I mean, have a big I mean, we we, I mean, look for us, the being able to go on the road was nice. I mean, most people don't get that sort of gap in the relationship. So there's a downside that you're not there with your kids. But there's also that you're also not in the way there's certain points in time where you're just not needed in a house full of women people are happy sometimes they don't even know you've left.
I did this insurance isn't my standard backed up my there was a day where my daughter called me and said, Daddy, are you upstairs? And I'm like, I'm in Denver.
days. So how are you? And then she just texted me she said a bunch of emojis but yeah, but so you do sort of like you know, it's we both been sort of as far as work goes but open to the idea and look what both of us are like it like if she got a show or something. Quit stand up in a second come home. Yeah, I you know, I love
But I be happy to do you know, the stuff around here wouldn't you know, be okay with me? It's a burden. I definitely think you know, like our kids are old enough now that they're pretty self sufficient at 13 and 16 or 16 year old, you know, bringing home the bacon.
She does have a job. Yes, we have a job and she's also a student and she's a dancer, but you know, she could you know, she could drive them to school, they can make a meal like they might there. You can leave them at home alone. But you know, there are times when it just was not possible for me to work. Yeah, they can drive at 16 by themselves. Yes. Crazy. Yeah. What is it? Was it really?
That's probably good. Yeah. And you can start doing
Relation go together. No idea. I shouldn't have had my licence at 60. No, definitely. No, no, no, you're wrong. You're wrong. Let me say something that I find that best route because I went all over Australia. That's the best driving I've ever seen. I was like, What
I was like, What? Are we going 50 analogous. I'm like, everyone's going the same speed. Like that's not how it is here, man, you go 150 if you can, and then and then and then just stay with traffic, this fastest traffic goes, nobody signals everybody just cruise around and then and then someone gets in an accident. That's why our roads are all screwed up. Because nobody down here knows how to drive in that very sort of insane way where I thought like people obey the rules here in Australia. So it's very, that extra two years makes people either really respectful of it, or cautious, but I found it to be like wildly different. I don't know how many of you've done some driving around here. Yeah, well, so I had driven driven here a few times. When we arrived into la yesterday. It was what we could probably only describe is fucking not
just a fact but I know because we went to pick up the rental car booked it through rental cars.com winter Alamo,
This is the opposite way bringing around for what's the opposite of a plug and unplug? Yeah
so we we rock up I mean it's up to but no we've gone to the counter or to the self check in it turns out my driver's licence expired the fourth of October 2018 the day that we arrived in LA oh and so we couldn't have it we couldn't actually change the the main booking driver to someone else so we lost the the booking and so we're Uber axing around the joint which is okay look, we don't have to worry about parking Right, right. Which which is what I would have said or recommended in the first place because you don't want to drive Park find a place get the valet everywhere, you have to go to ballet, which is I mean, it's nice to have somebody ballet but it's you know, 1020 bucks, you know, like here, they're tipping all that stuff. It's a lot and and and we're either stopped in traffic or once people are finally able to go, they got it. You've done it. Again. It's just a wild west out here. When you're in Australia, what was the difference in the
I mean, you've got one in your house. Why did you the Americans stand up audience it's there's a weird like, anytime you travel, there's just a weird sort of embarrassment period where you don't know why something doesn't translate and you're like, Is it because and I think sometimes it's just finding a sort of a there's a rhythm you pick up a few words here and there, there's just a little bit of ease so that people get you a little bit because you you think Well, I mean, we all speak English so they should get it but I think sometimes you come at it a different way or your your persona maybe a little bit rough or there's just a way of like I would like but the thing I would tell you is like find something to talk about from there. Don't just talk about you. They're not that interested. You're not that interesting. So you know, they had this long bit about the Tim Tams to their own my fucking bed when I got there and I thought they were stupid. I was thrown away and then I got I couldn't stop eating them. It was problematic and so that seemed to people you know, that and then there was
shooting. There was no it wasn't a it wasn't a vegetable place like a supermarket. It was just, it was just a store. Just a veggie veggie shop. What about like a fruit? That you like? I was like, oh, that would never happen in America. We don't have a big shot. There's no place.
Yeah, yeah. And so like just sort of finding something like that now sudden people are okay with you. And it's a weird thing, but it does make a difference. If you acknowledge I'm not from here, I'm also trying to, like take the typical tact of the things that I know are different. I'm going to try and see if I haven't experienced that, you know, makes it and then you're usually pretty good. You know, some words some some ways of going about the what's important to you, and what's important to us kind of thing. You know, sometimes you're, you know what a target means here and a target means they're different things or you know, something like, you know, did you find the Australian crowds less cynical than the American crowds sometimes? Yeah. Yeah, they were warmer. I will
comics. I liked Australian comics a lot that I felt like that when I was there. Like I was out with Hannah. And it gets me Yeah, yeah and it was on we did the tour the I did that I was at did a month in Melbourne and then the tour and Adam rose and Bach and Amos Gill and
earning the two there's no way a black but there was a bunch of really great comics. And they were I like them a lot. Do you as a comic? Are you expecting the crowd is there and they want to laugh? Like do you going going here to laugh? So what is that filter? I've got them a little bit all you never you're the idea that they're there to laugh. They're there to find out if they want to laugh. They're not there. Nobody comes that good. I am in the mood to laugh and then they laugh they come out I go I don't know unless I've been smoking a bit of Yeah, I'm hoping to laugh. But I'm not like it's not like I'm going to do the fucking work without you doing the work first I'm not in a like a lot of times we were very suspect So, especially if they don't know you, you know once you have fans then it's a whole different thing.
Been there? You know, I've heard this guy's okay, but I'm gonna see for myself be the judge of that. Yeah, I always think why would you go see an American if you don't like them and it just to know that I don't care for them?
what's the what's it like working together? Do you find that and what was the first dabbling in doing that? So with for the podcast through the books, we first we first started working together and we were still dating before we got married. We
we took a stab at writing together. I was in a development deal with HBO and I had this two guys from third rock writing a script for me. And I brought brought it over to her place one day, and she read it and she was like, what
would it What is this meant to be funny? And I was like, that's okay, already. And she was no, it just doesn't make any sense. And so she sort of went through the script with and I'm like, you're a record executive. Like, you know, how she just really great instincts and she's funny. And so, eventually, we said, let's start
Look, yeah, scripted. Yeah, we kind of rewrote the script. And like this is, you know, what if we approached it this way we wrote just as an exercise. And somebody read it and let her I think we gave it back to the writers and they liked the directory came out and they were anyway, it didn't move forward. But we decided to pitch a show together. And we sold the pitch to Fox when I was still working in the music, business. And so we started writing together when we were still just dating. And we went, we did sort of like, in fits and starts, like we would, you know, work on a project and also, I mean, I don't know what it's what it's like, where you live, but here it's your year in development forever, and barely anything moves forward. Yeah, you know, it's like a very long process. And, and with very little money for the amount of time you're putting into it and, and generally, it's not going to go anywhere. So it's like a joint hobby to start with. It's almost like a joint hobby. Yeah, yeah. It's like you can sell a pitch. For seven months. You get to go through the exercise of writing a script, and trying to
Peace people who've decided now they want a monkey in it or that whatever, you know, they want their ideas in your thing too. And you keep changing it to fit their notes. And then they're like, well, thanks for Thanks for coming. But no, thank you. But also the time when when I, you know, this is in the late 90s, the there was only the there were the three big networks and a couple of networks and HBO and, and then there was the beginning of the Comedy Central's and all that. So there weren't that many
comedy Yeah, and also, but it was also the days where like, if you were a comic, and you were white, and you were moderately funny, it was possible to get development deal after development deal after development deal if you had a solid point of view, just a simple point of view. And I made a record called on cool, which was just about being too feeling too old to concerts at 40. And it just got developed and developed and developed, you know, and decent cash for those days. Those are those were those were unreal. Yeah, those would be like to have Yeah, be like a quarter of a million dollars for and then they put you in another one.
And then put you in another one. And you were like, it was really like you were very, very lucky.
And nobody even said any act i don't know.
But yeah, literally just
go away and then initiate a new project that would go away. Yeah, so we started writing books, you know, after Greg was consulted on sex and say but we had we had developed scripts together solid pitches together that never turned into pilots. And then we started writing when the idea of when you know, Greg uttered the magical phrase at the writing room at Sex in the City, and he came home one day and said, Oh my god, Liz thinks he's just as it should be a book and I was like, it totally should be a block Are you kidding me? And I was like, I don't want to write it I'm like all right, let's do it.
I got a fan base. Man I'm selling records out of my I'm selling CDs out of my basement so it's time to read a book. Yeah. What is the collaboration actually look like like to not like this.
Do you have to one of you have a crack it at a thirsty go and then the
Tears, it destroys rides. What does that look like? You know for that for for It's a shame because when we did you just put that into you like, I would I would write like Liz would send something and then I would write something you think would write on top of me or I would write something. And he ran to me and said, it's Liz, like, we go back and forth like that. And then for the second book that was just as a not lives. We literally just email each other, we'd sit next to each other and email each other, we'd write our things and be like, why do you think of this? Can you make this funny or better or write something about this, and we would just email back and forth and with the different scripts that we've done, there's a lot of Greg paces and talks and we and we talk and I write it in or will sometimes he'll be in a different place, and we'll FaceTime and both be like in a shared document in Google Docs or final draught shared or whatever, and it's just as fun as it sounds. And it just is.
It sounds romantic, like it sounds like a process that could bring you closer together. Did you find that? While it did and then it's like crazy.
Yeah, yeah, I think I, you know, I hadn't I had no intention of writing or I mean,
writing really I came here to do stand up, and then I didn't have plan. I'm sort of like that. And, and then I ended up getting this consultant work, which was you'd go in and just be, you know, pitch on ideas, but you never had to write a script, you just, you know, sex and city for five years, just coming in saying that I shouldn't have a purse or whatever, anything, you know, anything that like, was just meant to be from my point of view, and we talked about last stuff. And then so when this opportunity came up, and also or when I wrote stuff, it had nothing to do with romantic comedy, or whatever it would, I would, I mean, I wrote a thing about a band of trolls that came to the surface of the earth, like that was where my head was at. So when we started writing together, we didn't really have a thing, but for me, I need someone to think I'm hilarious. And then I say funny things and then it works. And so if we don't have that dynamic, I don't know what we're writing. I find it very hard.
And so after a while, you can only find your partner so funny, right? Like you're only as
Especially if you live together, you're married, you work together, you parents together, like you're ready to live. And when you realise some of the jokes are real,
really is incapable if they said it in his act,
he was kidding. No, he can't do anything. And he's gonna leave. Yeah, we can know your partner. So well I even know like when I'm in a social situation with my wife, and she, I can I know the joke she's setting up and so I just like, sit back. You have heard this one before. This storey. I could imagine there's a similar vibe of that where you kind of know each other. So well. Yeah. And so then also, you're coming back to we were talking about relationships earlier. Like, you know, we got into this habit of
for a while, like he was he was just like walking around and spit balling. And I was typing. But a lot of times I would be typing my thoughts are my things. And he's talking I'm not even listening to him and then I'm not giving him I'm not giving him the laughter that he deserved. From what he's
saying because I'm not listening to him. And then his things get lost because he didn't write them down and I wasn't writing them down and then all of a sudden you find that thing that worked a month ago or on the last project is now in a different place. And you have to make adjustments but it's already like, well, it works so great. Why can't we can't give you that and like, well, because I'm I need to do it a different way now because I, I can't do both of us. You need to do you and I need to do me. He's like, but no, I like working that way. I'm like, I but I can't. So you know, does that think we're like the first the first thing to be thrown under the bus is all my best ideas come out of conversation? Yeah, she's gonna have a conversation. I'm like, I don't understand how to do that. Because I'm just like, I just have to get this out of my brain. I got her and he's like, but I want to talk about like another just it's just right. But that Yeah, yeah. So it has so there's been times was worked really well. And there's times when it's been a bummer and created conflicts because neither of us are getting what we need out of it and then that makes the project struggle or not feel harmonious
Yeah, have you worked out a way to sort of hack it, as I say, sort of in the tech world? So coming up with a mechanism so that you can almost fake it that sort of vibe of podcasting? Yeah. Yeah. No, truly so we started. So I was, I felt like what this is book, I'm like, I don't know how to talk. I don't know how to do this without conversation. Like most of the time, even buddies, you know, you have an idea. Somebody goes, let's do this. You're like, Oh, wait, here's what we should do, and then practice, right. And then we can write and we never have that keep improving upon each other. Right. And we were not generating ideas or having conversation. And I was like, I don't really know what to write. And I don't feel that excited about marriage. So I'm really not interested in talking about it. So I said, we should do a podcast, blah, blah, blah. she resisted. I don't know about that. And I was like, let's just do it. And then we start talking. And then the conversation got really real. And some of them were hard, and some of them were intense. And they were tough times I'm sure where the people who produce the podcast like coming back
after that when they come back. And and I found that that really started to like, get that part of it loosened up. So we remember stuff. We can go back
And listen to podcasts and they're all captured there. And, and I think for us it also just you start to hear what the other person is saying because you forget what they're actually like when you're with them. And you get a little bit actually, like when you both are being on your best behaviour and listening. Yeah, yeah. And then being thoughtful before you respond as opposed to going well, I already know what you're gonna think because we have this history where you do that and I'm still mad about this but but also embraced it with your force field position where you know, people are listening and we and you have to, but also, you're by yourself that you wouldn't a there's questions you wouldn't ask if you were just at home, do you know you think you know the answer? And be suddenly people are talking in this way? They reveal things about themselves. You're like, I didn't. I don't even think I've ever been asked you that. Yeah. Wow. And then you start to realise like, how maybe I'm maybe the things I think are wrong, you know what, that's what we call maybe it's you meaning where you think yourself? Oh, maybe it's me. Yeah, maybe creating this issue. Maybe Yeah, like I'm, maybe I have this all wrong because you're so so you get really certain of yourself.
When you're in a marriage for a long time, and I know that when I'm certain there's a maybe a 99% chance that I'm wrong about everything. If I say something emphatically I am usually wrong. I come on I go on, let me tell you something, this is how it's going to go and then it's not going to go that way at all, Tommy and I always joke about all the content, which is just this idea that anything that you do in life is a content opportunity or like ABC always be content writing.
Always be closing. Yeah, exactly. Always be content. So how do you like this like great content? Exactly. Every good storey literally the only way that we can get through some of the shit that happens when you travel or anything like that is it's like, at least like if I shit my pants right now because I need to go to the toilet. They could be a storey and I'd be a great podcast. Actually, that's so I mean, but so do you have to be wary of turning your relationship into just a
Big Content session every opportunity is there the interactions that you're having or the the moments where you might be having a fight is there a little bit where it's like actually I'm enjoying this because this is this is something that could be used as content or even within the context of recording the podcast saying getting off on let's be really honest that it might actually you know it's so funny because I swear every time we finished a podcast and when we have to go and do the intro for it I'm like what are we talking about? I have no it's literally like it leaves my brain I wish I wish I was as as wired or connected to be always be contacting because I feel like I would be able to you know expand my opportunities in life if I work because I I am
I don't I wish I did. Do you
I haven't gone both ways with it. You know, like there's times where I feel like I just put too much self out there about myself and I now made people worry or you know, I maybe I don't maybe
I wish I was more private. And I also there's days where I'm like, I want to walk away from the internet and everything all together, you know,
I go through a big news boycotts of like, I just can't take it, my, just My heart can't take it, you know, there's just too much that makes, you know, I'll get lured in and I'll start thinking about oh, I used to present and then I, you know, go down this path of some stuff I can't do anything about you know, unless I go out and the way that I do affect changes by creating content, but I think like with stand up, you get these things in by the time they get to the stage, they're sort of half truths. And you know, there are things that you've sort of made
specifically funny. On the other hand, the being I think if you're listening to something and you listen to two people have a discussion where it's a little edgy or they don't agree I think you you have an opportunity get somebody with that telling people should they already knows no big deal. Everybody knows you're supposed to be a good person not what everyone knows you're supposed to come from love and love.
Yeah, but to like last week, a man I talked about, you know,
struggle with a bipolar diagnosis. And I was like I said, we just talked about that, because I think people listen to the show go, what the fuck? He was on a whole different thing last week, I thought, you know, it's an important thing to say. And sure enough people start writing me and telling me and I.
And that's, I think that's a good thing, because I think people then feel like, Oh, okay. All right, maybe I understand. What about it? Like, if you don't even understand it yourself? Can it be hard to be communicating it? Because if I know, people that say, Look, I don't understand what's going on? Look, we're not perfect. This is not a marriage we're telling you to have. This is what we've seen. These are the things I think as an as a person who's been around longer. This is what I have to offer because hard conversations are hard conversations and but your your wish you'd said these things first, you wish you'd said look, maybe every year we sit down and talk do we do we want to renegotiate for another year. It's a silly thing to say. But what you're saying is let's look at the way we're going about stuff and are you happy let's not build up a bunch of shit because what happens with her is it
You in the minute as it's happening all the time What the fuck is happening? And she'll go four months ago, you and I'll be like, what's a fun? Wait? Wait, how are you been holding on to this for four fucking months? Yeah. Hey, how do you do that fantastic but be like that's doing you know good yes I'm so I'm coming home not knowing this anyway, it's finding that stuff and saying look, we can't You can't do that to yourselves because you my big thing is if one person in relationship has resentment the whole relationship is locked in that resentment, how that is the content of the you know if someone thinks something about you and it's bad, and you come home to that, and you know, even if you created the resentment even if you did, if you don't let go of it, that's the level of the room that you're in always from being with my wife, and she's learned that I love to talk things out straight away when she doesn't, and she's come towards me more so than and I've sort of, you know, giving her space, but it is that dance because you are two different people.
With two different approaches to things right, right, which is what you liked about them in the first place, though I already had I was like, that's what I liked about you the stability, your ability to not let stuff freak you out in the moment your ability to keep your head down and get things done. But the same time it's not super cosy, that version and I need a lot of stroking and a lot of attention, right just the way I am. It's just the way and I also think there's men are I think you're finding genuinely as men become less and less useful to the planet.
Absolutely true. Absolutely. One day we're all going to be on an island somewhere What the fuck happened man, they got rid of us. They did it. They couldn't kill us. But this is where we are run our own Wonder Woman Island and we're all gonna die here and it's very messing up wherever you want.
were we get men especially older, get a little lost a little bit and need a little bit more like attention then then women think that we do. I think a lot of times guys just need a little. I don't even think it's sex. It's just a little bit of like, Look, I can't
We're here. You're the guy I would fuck up. I was fucking somebody right now. I think you're awesome. You're still handsome and you're still my favourite? Yeah, you go do that. Can you figure it out? Leave me alone know that part you don't say did you you don't that's the part that makes them feel bad. That's why essentially person you just tell them nice things and then they get it they don't need it. But thoughts on facts and I feel sometimes that I'm like, if I'm if I've got an idea in my head is I'm trying to work out Am I just triggered by something? And am I if I say this thing? Am I just going to trigger everyone else? And so I feel like I hold off on things where I'm like, actually, you know what, I think that I'm just being unreasonable, but I still have it in the back of my head. So I'm like, I'm trying to like connect the dots and then something else because you're actually you're monitoring you're you're monitoring, taking the temperature of what's real versus what you're feeling and thinking and that's, I mean, most people are just impulsive and they just say the thing. People know I think most people know that.
The same thing. They say it anyway, the way is already going, Yeah, no, they're not they've had this. They've said, Is this right? This may not be right. I'm probably wrong. I need to think about this. Let me stop and not talk about it. I'm not going to talk about like, hey, yeah, by the way, but it's, it's it's a casual downfall. But but it's almost doesn't feel like because you're not being impulsive To start with, right? It's all of these things that add up and then you see more psycho because you're saying, Look, I've been monitoring this situation, and I've got six examples. And I think that it's really great because it's like, I'm coming to the table. It's like, I want you to know that I've done my research and this is why you blame me the sheets and the thing is
like, You're fucking crazy. Why didn't you tell me on the first one I'm like, why didn't know the first one was an issue but then when it all these other ones, right? So how do you how do you approach it? How do you approach the thing of like, every time you have a thought, just saying it and triggering everyone in the room? Well, first I'll be the Why am I having this thought right now?
What's happening with me because I wasn't having a 10 minutes ago. The other thing is, okay, what is the evidence that I have? Right?
What is evidence I have and then I go, Okay, do I know that to be true, right? Not to be a fact? Well, no, but I mean, okay, well, already, nobody would take that to court. Like, the more you really break it down, unless you have real evidence in a real fact, you really probably just are
in a snit about that your feelings are hurt, there's something there's something something's being taken from you, you feel fearful, and you're going to not get what you want, or you're not going to it's not things aren't going to work out for you something about this is making you afraid.
And rather than go to the person saying, I'm super afraid, and this is what I think's happening, and I could be wrong, which would make anybody go Oh, you're afraid? Oh, okay. Well, let's talk about that. But if you come in and like, Look, here's what I know. You're an asshole. Yeah. And here's what you've done. And you're like, well, I actually do this because blank, blank and blank. Like, I didn't know that I apologise. I was, I heard the the latest episode where you talk about your bipolar nights, I think, and I could actually relate
Light to a lot of stuff. I think I've got like on the spectrum of fucking 100 different things. But the thing that the thing I was thinking about is when when you're diagnosed with something like bipolar, does it change the dynamic in the sense of how do we know when a mirror is actually doing the wrong thing? Like, like you might in the wrong Amir vs. Greg's having a moment because I feel like potentially if someone's got a diagnosis in the household, there's mental health things. It could be really easy to be like alpha Greg's having a moment versus actually a mirror
fucking up right yeah. That's actually you know, it's it's funny because when when Greg was was diagnosed he's had first it was high anxiety and then it was manic depression and, and and just you know, when you finally was saw the neuro psycho psychiatrist that did the whole evaluation and diagnosis Bible, I was like,
that makes everything makes so much more sense. Because
you know, when you
When when you have an am explain to people where one person is very Mercurial and one person is very. I love that word. We have a thing word of the day. Can you tell us what mercury over your place market? like mercury rises and falls? Okay. It's Mercurial. It's like it just sort of takes off and then it disappears, then it takes off. Yeah. Good. A real visual, I think. Yeah, that's right. I see it in the picture. And and I tend to be relatively detached and very reasonable and grounded. Right. So he's always been like the dreamer. And I'm like, steady. Yeah, right. So Oh, whoa. It is like closed off maybe like I think there's also those terms where you're like, well, what?
Like, I'm more detached, like I'm not ruffled. I'm not easily ruffled. I'm not
anything. He makes you somebody a general standing at the fucking front of the lines, when it's more of a thing of like, I receive it as you're not interested, or you don't like I think there's that Well, I was just trying to answer his question. No.
I'm saying was building up to answering the question
so back to when I look
back to what I was getting back i was i was going to dress that type of thing where I think that because historically I'm less easily ruffled he's more Mercurial that I probably am less giving in generous in in our dynamic or situation so I probably trigger more than I realised I tried your or I'm being not as a thoughtful kind and considerate or soft and cuddly as would benefit both of us the situation because I can get a little
detached or disengaged. So if you like that little exchange right there if you listen to our pocket
maybe it's you maybe a jail. Yeah, I do. I do think that my
you know, to answer your earlier questions also, like I am just not bothered by that many things.
My system of what I go through of like, is this real is not real is like, how am I going to feel about this 10 hours from now? Am I going to care about 10 weeks from now? 10 years from now, will this have any impact, but that's almost triggering. And it's in itself, right? Because Because I'm not engaging and things because I'm like, that's not a big deal. Yeah. And I guess the other part two is it can be,
I always wonder about the thing of saying, I'm this, like, this is the type of person that I am. And I've always worried that if I say this is the type of person than I am, we're setting ourselves up to be that so like, is that vain? And I guess in regards to that dynamic of a, of an argument, if every argument is met with I'm the cool, calm, collected, thought for one, and the other person is, you know, a little bit more sort of unhinged or a little bit more passionate. Does it already sort of set this set the stage to make it hard to have that conversation because you
Go ahead go ahead No, no I was I was gonna say you know it's almost like
I don't know what you call them like see sauce
is a song like I see it as like you need to have see and saw you can't be both like I'm sad me too yeah I'm I'm insane me to like like I really feel like there's a level of for a functional relationship you kind of need to balance each other out otherwise it doesn't kind of get to live or work or go or have energy but he might not feel the same way I do you think there is a worry whenever you define yourself at all you set yourself up for failure because as you know it's like you're like I'm a person has good taste you immediately just stop having good. People who have good taste are open to the idea that things are constantly changing. You know that you're open to change. I heard this really smart guy,
Robin Hans's, his name and he's a bit of an intellectual and he's on the spectrum.
But he said, You know, people feel the need to talk all the time about things because they want to seem smart. But in fact, we only really know a lot about most of us about two or three things really understand. And he goes, so for most things, I just remain agnostic. And I find my life's much more enjoyable when I say, I don't know, I don't have an answer for that. No, no, I don't know anything about that, or I don't know enough about it to be in the conversation. So if it's a politics thing, and it's out of my leg, in a certain level, it's going to go beyond my scope. I have feelings about him. I mean, I think when you're telling people, your feelings, or your feelings, but to really understand something, so it's, it's a hard thing to say, Look, I don't want to just be the Mercurial one. And I don't want to just be the dreamy one. And I have moments of steadiness, I've held jobs, I've worked I've done things, you know.
So that makes me feel like that is a quality that I possess in our dynamic, it falls that way. But I think I don't have any other person I've lived with for 18 years. So I think you get in these groups yourself, and you also indulge in them.
Little bit you're like, well, I don't know why shouldn't expect me get upset? I am the material one.
I mean, it says on my thing, but I feel like I gave her a little bit of what she expected. me. She gave me exactly that because I haven't talked to her in four days. We just, we just we fall into the roles, I guess in summary, in some regards. Yeah. In Australia, there's, you know, a lot of talk around stigma of mental health. For you, Greg, when you got the diagnosis of bipolar? Is that something that you I know, you talked about in your podcast and he's very public, but is it something that you will apprehensive about, because other people will talk about it or you're thinking other people are going to, I think it will explain some things for some people, but I've in my head, it made it a lot easier because I was like, Okay, so this has a name and it has qualities and it has something I can study and look at and understand and it also there's bipolar, one of my poets who I'm bipolar who which is a lesser version of it, and it's it can be more environmental than chemicals.
But then I have an understanding of it and how the different ways to be aware of it also it for me, it's less about what the public knows and more about the people around me were like, okay, because I thought dude, okay, you know that sort of thing or explains like, eating call me back for three days I'm again and pick up the phone for three days. You know, I you know and then and I think we get really I was saying this to me the other day I think as we go on and we start to you know that guy was kind of addicted me yeah odd somewhere on the spectrum because he doesn't know how to make eye contact or say hi. You know, there's little versions of it throughout all of people's like most people's chemistry has some everybody has some little bit of OCD and people have little rituals where rituals and superstitions and things come from. And so we have to remember sometimes, like, it isn't personal. That guy doesn't know how to talk to you. He's afraid he's embarrassed, you know, whatever, but we really, we really like to make ourselves like well, I
so hopefully for me, it'll explain sort of like, when things seem odd or off, you know.
I think I think it helps helps for the children and I because there there are times when
when you can go out he's not trying to be this difficult. He he used to he is trapped in a thing where he he's not. He is not trying to suck all the air from the room and make everybody unhappier weirded out he can't stop it and it'll hopefully pass shortly and certain things pacify it which is the thing it's not like you're just super depressed and you're in the dark all the time. Yeah, you sometimes if you're just like, I got Netflix for like four I'm just I'm just on YouTube, looking at how to make movies or something because it anaesthetise is you It gives you you've got a place to go. It makes you feel better. You're not actually engaging with people, you're not going to be all prickly and you're not going to be weird to them. You don't want to go out like you feel like you know when it's not a good time to see people and say, but it's not again, you're not like it's not like you're in that continual state of suicidal ideation. You're just man I'm not right. And you know, it really feels good is one more video
David Fincher lighting I just need to know. So he's moving camera at the same time, but he stays with the Coen Brothers coming real tight like, brain is open. Your brain wants to like, let's digest something different. Let's, let's right? Yeah, he's like you withdraw and get very obsessive. Yeah, having a pacifier like it. Does that mean that you can use technology in a positive way? Like, do you think there's too much stigma to technology at the moment where we're saying, don't do that sort of shit. And we're actually creating more more issues, because the thing that's going to make you feel better? What we're sort of shunning, or I think they haven't discussed, I don't think I think it's all such new days. But when I look at things like I also write fiction and I do that usually when I'm in some usually when I wake up, but if I'm in a state where things aren't good, but my brains going, if I just start a storey, it'll just go and some of them are kind of all over the place, but I get no place I'm I'm in here now. And I'm creating characters and I'm doing this thing and none of it has a goal I'm not trying to make I'm not trying to sell this. I'm not trying to I'm just trying to outlet I'm just trying to find a place where I can be
not bother anybody and maybe channelled into some sort of creativity. And I tried this, I shot a trailer on my phone trying to teach myself how to use it a real camera because I thought I need something to do with my time when I go through those phases, and it's been very productive. So I think there's something about it that can be managed. If it is treated that way. I think people look back and watch a lot of TV. That's usually that's not what it is. There's something about you know, that's, yeah, I mean, there's like a quote, which is we judge others on their actions and us on our intentions. And yeah, do you think that if Greg is in a state where he's not feeling good, but he's intentions aren't negative? What should partners be putting up with the negative actions?
When can I say that that is something that still is something that we are working through because
I know he's not a monster and he doesn't have bad intent.
Tensions, but sometimes the actions or the words are the behaviours are the thing are very difficult to
the very, very few. So there are different very different like, you know he can be
really, like caught up in in, you know the really deep dark down of bipolar and it can all be channelled at me and it's conspiracy theory and there's paranoia and there's delusion and there's anger. And the next day he's like, we're good, right? And I'm like, I hate your guts. Like, I can't fucking stand you. Because I am still
feeling the you know, I was a punching bag all day yesterday and today you woke up in your brain felt good, but I am still like trying to get rid of the yuck. Yeah. So it's, it's hard because I do know that it's, it's, um, it's not real. Also, just
like the meltdown
Maybe I'm not 10 hat conspiracy theory.
I haven't you know, I haven't been asked to go to Largo for a while, and maybe planning it doesn't think that, you know, I don't know what it would happen. I mean, maybe it's been me, you know, you just started trying to figure out what you're trying to figure out. What am I in this mess for social media does that like I didn't get to a point where I'm like, Ah, that person hasn't liked my post lately. Maybe? I'm going to go through all my photos and say the last time I
did, they may not even know that. Okay, maybe I'll go into the activities and see like, are they liking other people's stuff? And like,
what sort of stuff are they like it like, Am I are they liking stuff? That would be maybe they're just off holiday photos. Maybe they don't want any holiday photos. Maybe that's why they're not liking any of this stuff.
is social media. Is it? Is that happened with you? Or am I
no, no but I understand that I understand every thought you just said that isn't where I go for that kind of stuff because I don't most of my friends are you know, because I'm older so any of my friends are there if you don't get a letter Yeah, but also like just yeah for me it's the things that I don't know anything about you know like I if a social media feed I can sort of understand it gives me sometimes it gives me peace like I'll be obsessing about somebody and then I'll see their posting of their fucking not even here they're not they moved the fuck is wrong with me or they've been on the road or they didn't like are they oh my god that guy sick. Yeah. Right. So that that but I try not to I don't try to get too involved there. None of my kids are on social media. I try to keep my my presence to sort of focused on work, you know.
And I and the only reason I do it is because I was like, you gotta have a, you're supposed to have a but I prefer less information. I'd be super happy with a landline and nothing else. Really. I really would. I really would.
Hey, go with kids being your kids specifically being able to, you know, consume this stuff that we're talking about, you know, they, they really none of them have gotten into podcasting yet. They're not, they're not interested. But they also have very busy lives with, you know, school to your dance homework friends, like they, they, you know, their social media interests are mostly Instagram and Snapchat and they communicate with their friends through Snapchat mostly. And that's a hard thing to do or homework with a friend and the friend will be doing homework and they'll just build on each other's screens, and that person will just be there with her and sometimes they don't talk.
They both have had
a few people on the screen. The funny thing is they preparing themselves for the workforce of today because I used to work at a tech company and you remote work that's literally the sort of shift that you would do you have people could if they're working remotely, you could have your webcam set up.
At the HQ at the office you could just say pick remote people working and that was the the actual connexion that they have the picking my nose too much
get caught doing some yeah yeah tell me what does that meant to me but the Tommy does have the the bit of sticker like the gaffer tape over the Wareham watching never know there's these things that you can buy where you can slide it to cover it and then slide it and I keep it
in America quite a few yeah. Oh yeah, you got that they're all listening. Yeah.
Yeah, every season same where you have a conversation then you go to your Instagram and that was like I didn't mention that movie mentioned that movie that's Yeah, you know that kind of thing. But no, but then you go you know what, okay, look, the the everybody's watching thing sort of is that thing of like and know what if everyone's watching them to be bored as fuck if we're who they picked. Yeah, you know, it when people having your information you sort of like the
There's a point where you go, it's all sliding downhill it once it becomes everybody, so people know that we're just that we're not as titillated anymore was last time a naked celebrity made anywhere near the front page of anything. Nobody cares. Yeah, like nobody cares anymore. I've seen is that a vagina? He is but that person is a vagina. It's exciting. I knew that before.
A long time ago Paris Hilton anybody? Okay, I could have sold one it was would have been pretty close to what that one is.
There is a little bit of like the shock factor starting to wear off the Kardashians couldn't make a move today. They they're lucky they got in when they did that, you know, it's um
there's a little bit of you know, there's also a malaise about it. That's why I think the Russians are everywhere and we're in trouble but the it does feel like we don't care as much about that stuff. And I don't think people are I don't think your generation is is punishing on people. Like when if somebody let's say somebody you work with had a sex tape, I feel like people be like, I don't care. They're there.
I work and I only work with Tommy so we know who's six type it would be.
I mean, mine would look like I remember watching a film with Seth Rogen doing like a sex scene and I had the behind shot on my that's what I look like.
It's just which is quite confronting. Oh, yeah, no, no, I had a pretty good I there is MMA as active as I don't wanna watch my wife soccer. bag of potatoes.
Me, where did you I heard an interview where you were talking about your parents work for the CIA. My mother works for the CIA and my father worked for the State Department. But yeah, they both they both works for the government. Yeah. How listening back then? Yes, for sure. I really do feel like they're, like I they're both so smart. And they're both so funny. And they're both a little quiet. And I feel like and they're both so cautious, too. But I feel like I'm not your mom. Maybe your mom's killed somebody. Just saying like we wouldn't. She's exactly who we wouldn't think would do something for the government. Yeah, yeah.
Yeah, there was there was a lot of I really I we really were not allowed to know a lot of what either of them dead and, and there was a lot of caution in the house there was a lot of using code words and landlines and things had to be
done. Yeah, we're listening to the podcast and he wrote me and he said, my dad too. I can't talk about it over the over over this, but let's have lunch. Yeah. He's like, I can't I can't talk about it. In text. Yeah. No, I know. We used to always joke that if you know my, because my parents are still quite sure that we're all being surveilled, which we are because there's microphones all over this you know, my my I have a smart TV where we list you by my TV by my Alexa by all of our phones were being listened to constantly now and they know something we don't so we should be trusting them in the sense that's what's the fucked up. But yeah, if you're listening, let's just give Greg another job. Yeah.
If it means listeners to our podcast, we actually want
devices do you have in the house because we can't count the amount of listeners? Yeah, it's but it's true. It's funny because I, I, I happened to spend the day with Johnny I've last year who is like the chief design Officer of apple. Yeah. And he meant by invented all of our things. And he was saying he was like, Oh, yeah, there's, there's because I because I was saying, Tell me if this is true. I was talking about something. I didn't go on anything. And then next time I opened my computer I was you re targeted? Yeah. Oh, yeah. Yeah. He was like, Oh, yeah. He was like, he was like, the whole reason Apple didn't. That whole thing where Apple wouldn't unlock the phone for the San Bernardino, what he's like, they had all the information they wanted. The president of us gave it to him, but they were listened to constantly were it's all they've solved crimes based on people's Alexa's and that have recorded the recorded murders and stuff like that, like it just is all happening. But when I was growing up, and none of that existed, yeah, we always joke like the people in the white van have hung themselves.
boredom from listening to our household All right, there's no way there's no way talking about Melbourne before. It was in Melbourne that you had health scare wasn't it? Was it? had the last time I was there? Yeah. Can you can you? Like, can you tell us what you know? We think about, you know, things like car rental shit not working when you're travelling, when your body starts to fucking shut down on you. I mean, I've been like, I've been fair, like, you know, for most of my life I've been I haven't spent a lion spent a lot of time in hospitals. And,
and I would go to my doctor before I went and I said, I'm gonna have any stomach aches and they're beyond that. They're pretty intense. They sort of come and go, I feel like sometimes I have want to lay down but
and so he did everything he would do in an exam and said, everything looks okay, but maybe you get some acid reflux. Okay, so they gave me some next time and I went off to do 30 days of a show which,
thankfully cut off back in
We're broke. But anyway, so I, I just started to get kind of progressively worse. And weirdly enough, I was reading the bass player from Guns and Roses has a Duff had a biography and I was reading it autobiography. And we and I was laying in bed and I'm like, Man, this is really just burned a really hurt. And what's kind of nice when you go to Melbourne if you have a show somewhere, they assign you a person who sort of your envoy and is the show sort of they sort of run the show, and you can call them for anything.
And I called him they sent a doctor over and the guy gave me some value and I was like, Okay, and then that didn't do anything and then that night, I was like a bug again, man, I think I'm my pancreas might have exploded because in depth Kagan's book, his pancreas explodes and he goes when your pancreas explodes, you have an hour because all of the juice inside of there was burning up all your organs. And that's what it felt like I was like, this is what's happening because it is it's instant.
painful. I've never been through anything like that a doctor told me once. He said, I had a woman who gave birth to triplets that also had that and said it was worse than childbirth. So I was like, I mean, I don't know that that's pretty grand and totally different. But anyway, it was very painful. And they picked me up and I went to the hospital, they took me right away and put me right in. They were like, I was like, I was in so much pain. I didn't know whether to scream or cry or not, I couldn't do anything. They hit me up with some drugs, and then I took a little heroin nap. And because I ate the morphine, nothing morphine, nothing they give me out and then when I woke up, they put me through the MRI, and they found a cluster of tumours in my intestine, which my whole thing is, I said, Well, if you're going to hear cancer, better from an Australian than an American, because you go up on your arm, it's the ultimate say it sounds better. It's a cancer cancer. Yeah, cancer. Cancer goes up. Yeah, it's we say cancer or down. Yeah, more positive. Yeah. And so and like I was young, super young, and
chillin out with a pretty chill the Australians in the way that they they told the guy was like looking at this cluster of two months that we don't know if the cancer but it could be cancer like slightly South Africa
It's awful. It's no it's awful and and i anyway so I said
well, you know I've had a nice life and he goes well we're not picking out tombstones mate, just you need to go home and I was so high at that point I'm, you know, staying there and I was like back to my apartment in America
and I was like, oh, oh, I gotta go back to America. So they gave me a box of oxy cotton and put me on aeroplanes and syringes. You had to inject yourself? Yeah. Okay, that information you're like, they're like, here's a box of oxy cotton like a box like a like a box full of leaves of it. Yeah, yeah, a lot of it. It's like a street value. You thought you'd like hit the lottery. didn't sell this. Shouldn't
The names Oh, and the you need to shoot yourself with these. Those are needles. And I was like, in my mean like in your belly, because that you might have a blood clot on the plane and die. And but I'm here so amenable you're like oh well i mean if it's going to be the plane, why not? And then the Euro Are you thinking what's what's your side of the storey when he called he was actually he called me on our daughters. It was her 10th birthday. She's 13 hours or 10th birthday. And he was in Australia and we were actually like for her birthday. we'd gone to Palm Springs for the weekend with
another family who were you know, we're close with it for the kids birthdays. And he called me up and he was like, So hey, I'm in the hospital and I'm really high. And I think I might have cancer so they're sending me home can and I'm supposed to bring a desk and you supposed to pick me up and take me to cedars and I was like, Okay, got it. I'm on it. And I went straight into because I've been trained I was raised by government operatives.
straight into the likes into his phone
like I do I didn't get like I straight was like all right I got it yeah
send me the information like I just went straight into like function mode and called my manager and I told him and he balls and I was like dude Did you get there Give me your script to a mirror she supposed to cry and you're supposed to get me out of attention and that is it do you find guilty like why am I Why don't I kill it? Where's it coming from a caring place obviously it well I just I am the person that holds it together in a crisis and keeps it together and makes it like I am the person when shit goes down you want me driving the vehicle? Like I am very I it's literally like I completely just go into survival function brain like I Why do you think from your childhood take us from my childhood because i think that i think that I was raised in a manner so that I don't
freak out. Like I don't panic, I don't freak out. I remained very calm. I remain very composed. And I don't I don't just if you're listening and you're
talking about me to have cancer, your cancer you're you're here. You as the person who does have cancer, you need to have an emotional response so the other person can go not going to be fine. Yeah, because you're you want to be able to say if you're okay Why are you okay with it? I had cancer Yeah. So I you want to be able to help other people through it. You know, you sort of want to look let's have a lot of tears. We're going to get through this if you don't get that you feel like you're not taking this seriously. Right? I mean, you know, I mean, people are like To be fair, those guys were chill but they're also like get straight to a hospital right? Go get off the plane go nowhere, but to the thing because the tumours were going very fast. And while they were there, let's play to his intestines and bowel. So they're like, yeah, it needs to be dealt with immediately. Yeah.
Do you think it could spread but but they're also there? There is one shot of chemo will probably knock them all out. Yeah. So you know, it actually very much like if you're getting the Oh, you've got the good guy and if you're going to have it like this is one of the best ones have it responds to chemo really, really well like, but anyway so I to and I also tend to be somebody that like I take my, I take my cue from information rather than emotions. Like if you tell me it's the good kind and it responds and and he's gonna be fine. I'm like, great.
He's gonna be fine. Here's the fun storey so i i that's what he wanted. I pack so I had to. I had like 12 hours before my flight so I did a show with will Anderson and you know, we did our thing called the super pod was our podcast and tofu. Did you talk about it on there? A little bit and Dave and they were all like they were all teary and stuff and I was still high as the Catholic fellas gonna knock it off. Yes, it's all gonna be okay and what do they airport
I packed colour coded all my clothes, and then I but I brought a knife with me, which that's, you know, I had to take those through my neighbours and my backpack and they were like we lady said
you're not supposed to bring a knife through security aeroplane and such because I'm happy and I said, Oh, I have cancer. And she went, ah, I don't know what to say.
I can give you a hug but I still got to take the night was that your first use of the cancer is a way to like, yes free Starbucks coffee. cancer was I think I said I might have cancer, but I but I at that point, I was like, would it help if I might have cancer? I thought the knife was gonna make me they're gonna take me out of line and believe me, I was gonna be in trouble. Yeah. I'll tell her right off the bat. Yeah. And by the way that does. You tell anybody you have cancer no matter what you're doing them I go. People feel very badly for you. Maybe I got on the aeroplane and my manager had
meant to come with me but they put me in first class and they put him in coach. And I had said because I am a drug addict alcoholic I said, Hey, listen, you know you I want you to have the drugs and then you just give them to me when it's time. So I sat next to this fella on that plane, he was very nice. And
and he was in the band, switch switch foot. And they didn't switch foot. I don't know any big Christian rock'n'roll band, but they're also a bunch of surfers and that's all that's which is surfing and they that's all they do is surf. And I said to the guy, listen,
I'm very high. And I might touch your chest at some point or walk around without my bed like just would just keep an eye on me. And then every six hours if you just remind me to take the pill, and, and he was very sweet. And then he told me he was in a band. Oh, that's so great. It's not a band. I know. And why isn't jack white but jack white probably would have been that nice. Anyway, he was very lovely and he walked me to the
He said I'll help you get your bags he took me to baggage claim and he helped me get my bags and I bent down to get him I turn around he can disappear like he had never been there. I mean, there were still lots of people like he was just it was just me how my way
but why would I? If I'm gonna have a if I'm gonna have like a waking fantasy switch flipped my dreams I disappoint myself just a little bit. Just a little bit. Yeah, he was lovely. He said, I said a prayer for you. You're going to be fine. And then I bent down to pick up my bags and he was gone.
And to where you're at now? It's been two years so far. So good. Three years, right. As 2015 Yeah. Well, some it hasn't. 15 Yeah, right. So you're you're actually right about? It's October so about midway through this month is your three year cancer free marker. Yeah. Tonight what I had like six months of treatment, get surgery and then six rounds of chemo every three weeks when I'm listened to
Maybe it's you the first time it was sort of the first thing I'd consumed after you sort of had the diagnosis and gone through it all and what I was surprised that is even if when you go through cancer and all that sort of thing I would have thought that all the trivial shit goes away in the centre of light you just like become a bit fucking Buddha by my oh my god they're fighting this they're still finding that really dumb shit and great potentially could have died.
I'm with you on that one man. Somebody else said to me they
said that guy goes but she had cancer and fixed everything. No sir didn't
did and I thought that would too. I really leaned into the cancer. So that will this will be helpful. It was it was a moments like when you nearly in a car crash and then for the next little bit you drive safely. Did you have a period of like, everything was good. I'm going to be all good in life.
Exactly. Did you have a sense of heart and gratitude a mirror. Did you appreciate Greg more after
It's interesting. I'm very compartmentalised. So I, I had granted I have graduate most of the time I have granted like, you know, when I said that to that doctor, I felt like I've had a nice life. I have a nice life. I'm like, Look, if I had to go now, it was 15. Right? I got I got to 50 some odd years out of this. I have two beautiful kids. They're the best parent is live, so they'll be fine.
Yeah, I've done a bunch of really, I've done a bunch of really cool stuff that I am proud of. I didn't not try. I mean, I definitely try it. I definitely went for it. And I achieved thing. You know, I did some probably, you know, a lot of people would love to be able to do so. In that respect. I don't feel cheated at all. I wish my you know, we've gone through some tough times and we hadn't quite solved their problems. And so I felt like I wish that would have gotten better. But maybe it will meet somebody nice. I
know I really did. So I had gratitude and I have it for
I've had it for
areas of my life. That's the best I can on them. I would say of course, of course, I definitely have gratitude, you know, that he came through it was how they but the thing that's so interesting, and I think you saw here today is there still is those habits that you have when you're in a long term relationship. Like he still is annoyed at me at the way I dealt with him having cancer. Yeah, or received the information and I still am like, annoyed him to like, why can't I receive it the way I received it, like, It's that thing of like, just have to shut that off, though for a bit. Is
it just as a habit of being like, Well, you could have got a little bit more upset when we're telling
a storey and really that was my that was my response to it. I mean, obviously, you know, if I was that annoyed with it together, I mean, we're not being forced to do this. Yeah. You know,
you saw this, you know, little peccadilloes that you have just from being a long term relationship where you still, you know, something can be fine. You're still going to pick it at 11 be like, you know, yeah, it'd be nice. If you add
It's true, I think would almost be we like, Did you find that people? Some people go weird, like when you like talking about cancer talking about all that sort of shit like, you know, what advice do you have for people who have someone in their life that has cancer? What's the wrong approach that well usually let look to see what that you can tell what they want out of it. A lot of people get real private about it is it's a real private thing. And also, they don't want people to see them. It's there's an element of it that you know, speaks to your vanity and how you're going to be. But what they don't want is for you to be like, you want to show that you are concerned and that they matter a lot and you want to tell them that they matter a lot on that, but they don't need you to be in more of a state than they are. Some people go, I'm going to be in this play and I'm the person whose partner has cancer. And then you're like that play doesn't really work. You want them to be able to say hey, we're going to be okay we're going to get through a
lot of people also want to they don't want to be seen as somebody who's sick.
Like that they don't want to be it's a define them suddenly I'm like no I'm still the same cool person with I just happen to have the work I knew what I was doing I had the thing I'm the guy with the answer upstairs I got this room for at least six months
nobody's expecting anything from me if I do anything everyone's gonna be thrilled. thrilled if I write something and yeah
when you walk yeah a pyjamas? Yeah, he really sort of handled that eating thing that you had a first class like when else you're gonna fly first class. That's right. Oh, man, they were gone. I wish those people are lovely. Great. Did it take you anyway in your head that you hadn't been before?
Hmm, well, yeah, Melissa, I'm not afraid to die. That sounds ridiculous. I mean, I that I don't. I don't think of death is of it particularly. It is not.
I don't know. It doesn't scare me. It scared me before it happened. I was like, I'd wake up and go. It's going too well for me. I don't want to die. I don't want to die. I don't want to I met a man in my life.
It's going really good. And I would really not like to die. And then after this, I was like, man, I need to be grateful for what I have. And it is not that big a deal, you know? Because all you have is it's really hard when you have the moment that's it. So you don't really know what happened before gone and people will miss you, but you won't know it. I always go like, usually when you go to sleep, that's exactly what it's like. There's a lot of stuff happens when you're asleep and you don't know it. Don't worry about it. I never am sleeping going. What do they like me? Are they saying good things about me just out? How did my service you know, was I
thinking about me? I bet she's not thinking about me now. You know, like I don't? I think it you know, and there may be some other thing that happens on the other side, but whatever it is. So that makes me feel also like I have a thing with the mirror sometimes where I feel like Look, I don't I've had a few health scare. So I don't know how long this goes and I'd like to solve our problems and get through it or, or not, and move on because I don't feel like
The time to be unhappy or make each other feel shitty. You know, in any relationship you never do. You don't have the if you know you're the problem, or if you know that it could be better, you know, fix it or do the person a favour, you know. So I think that I don't think I thought that before I thought I was before a little bit.
Amir and Greg, thanks so much for your death to the party. It's really cool. Well, I think it's cool that like, that's what I love about maybe it's you is that you can sit back and listen and it's almost a white like it's therapeutic. And I think that probably the next best thing from having the conversation is listening to the conversation and being able to connect dots and see where Hang on, like the thing that Greg does, I can actually really relate to maybe, and also that feeling of not being alone, right that everyone is experiencing all the different colours and shades of life. The one thing I realised every situation which is and there's a million minutes
Go back and do and it was the best thing I've ever heard. It was an interview with Josh Brolin, and it was another podcast, but they said to him, you know, he was talking about working in a movie with Denzel Washington. And he said, he said, I didn't know Denzel. And we have, it's our first time working together. And it was he knows his movie. I'm just a part of it. And I was waiting there for him to show up. And he finally came and went to the thing and I blew my line. And I went to say, what was my line, I put my hand on his shoulder, he goes, get your fucking hand on my shoulder. And he goes, now that could have ruined everything. You know, here's this guy telling me that it was part of me as a human being a young guy want to fucking slug him. And well, that's gonna ruin my career. And then part of me is like, I could, you know, if I, if I take this personally, I'm not gonna be able to finish this movie, or I'll get cut out of it. And so he really thought about it. And then when they got back together, they shoot a thing and they were sort of far apart and Martin supposed to talk we're just looking each other and about right before they started to shoot he looked at when I think I'm falling in love with you. Any it changed the whole his whole way of approaching the solution to the problem, which is I'm not less than you, but I'm not going to match you.
Going to be funny, but I'm going to take it to another place. And also remember your mental of people. So that made Denzel laughed. And they've been great friends ever since. And I think sometimes you just have to take a minute and go, what are the possibilities for what I'm about to say? And I don't do that enough, maybe. But I do think that is the real reactions. That's all we have. It's choose your own adventure. Essentially, it's a really 100% of the time in anything, you can change your life. If you have the ability to Bill ago, I might do different I got the thing I do all the time seems to never get the right response, you know, and sometimes somebody else is not going to change their way and then you go, oh, they're gonna always give me that response. So my major is not need to show up to be there. Yeah. It's like the fact that we have that choice, right. The only thing that we can control is our response. That's always things that say, Oh, you don't have to show up to every fight you're invited to.
Sometimes response is like not responding at all.
Yeah, yeah, that's right if you choose not to show up to a fight Yeah, you're right. That is that is actually
maybe a two is the podcast. It's weekly, every week, every Tuesday, every Tuesday. That's perfect. This is what's good about having you've got like a professional operation is just I love podcasts that are consistent and I love that on my phone like I haven't even realised what day you do it but I just pull out my phone. And it seems every single time I've we are perfect. Yeah, it's the daily talk show. Hi at the daily talk show.com if you want to send us an email. Thank you, Amira and Greg, thanks for coming to our home. Thank you. It's been a delight. Don't talk show. Have a good one.