#171 – Digital content producer advice/

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Cross face

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conversation sometimes worth recording with Josh Johnson and Tommy jacket. It's a daily talk show, Episode 171. Tommy jacket. How are you this morning? Hey, good. How are you this evening, I'm really good. I am above where we're staying in Dubrovnik is above a Irish Pub. And so this is the second night in the row that were about to go to sleep to Wonderwall by a live performer

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there's only there's only so many old songs because there's no new old songs so it just it just getting a real run for it I love watching people seeing other people's songs okay at pubs and stuff I was at over the weekend needed sugar will work this guy just he's so talented and I just added think looking at him just thinking you know instead of going into what he's what he's life has been like this like during the story yeah I was doing the story because you know he he doesn't look like a rock star so you start making judgments based on these looks not bad. I was like this guy's super talented. But what doesn't he have? Why hasn't he made it they're not they're not putting the Australian Idol producer hat on. Yeah,

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I'm thinking like what's the story yeah i'll see you know, deca

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always like you know what's happening. Okay. But then I started looking at the equipment he had and thinking about how much money he's earning. And then a message he we came up with a figure of 400 bucks. He'd be running for the afternoon of singing. And I thought that's not bad. Yeah, almost 100 bucks an hour. Sounds about right. And do that once a weekend. Little, you know, Bunsen burner on the side. Not bad. Yeah,

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I mean, I actually I said to a mate the other day when mode driving along on a road trip I said I reckon most my I prefer I prefer most covers than originals

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What's your favorite cover?

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Ah I like higher

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I don't know the bits I mad baby them so he's like acoustic version it's quite nice. Yeah, yeah.

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I like once I can be thou ISIS covers I think when they're in a different tone from the original like they've shifted I can either ruin ruin it or you can absolutely when

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anything that's an acoustic of something that wasn't an acoustic yeah I like that sort of shit yeah. 100% and quickly I forgot to tell you yesterday when I was up in ship it and this is a bit of a podcast talking about podcasts on a podcast and on a little that so I'll just give you at least one for today I was blown away because it up where I was in a trigger. That's where like the radio we actually send out the signal went from shepherd and so that he could people could listen to us and so I had it on 96.9 the old station that I used to host on and I was listening to the new the new people on there and obviously judging them as well. And

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also one of the guys named Tommy isn't now he's gone. He's gone. Okay. Yeah,

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so I think just siren le sound gripe is awesome. I'll see you about like, they're, they're at the point in their journey. And I'm thinking it's cool when you've like a city that's I was at that I was at their spot

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on my journey. And so it's like, the same path, but just ever, you know, they're on the is which, yeah, I was just getting, like, nostalgic and reflective, it's

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not completely it's not completely linear to juice see yourself what in upon reflection, do you think you were at a similar time in your life when you were doing it? versus what seems like they're doing

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Yeah, so I, I always used to think you, I think everyone's sort of sees ahead of themselves. So you're looking forward so much. And so you don't really stop and think about, okay, I'm here because this is where I meant to be on my journey. I'm not as good as someone in a you know, Metro marketer I'm not as accomplished is or you know, I haven't made it that far. Or I just haven't done that yet. So you're as good as where you are right now. And I think it's easy to get ahead of yourself thinking I could easily been a metro market but it was like I embraced and that's what I did and shaped I embraced the place that I was in on the journey and the learnings I had and so it was cool to think about that's where they are and that's where I was and then it could go you know, somewhere completely different after

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so I was kind of changed for me I'm not as in the the radio station does is it new imaging is that sounding different or does that sound the same? Yeah,

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so this is what I wanted to tell you about it all sounds very similar and they talking about similar shit I bet you there first week they did the topic of should you put pineapple on the pizza or not? There's fruit Milan Peters guys, but I didn't hear that they actually found a lot more relaxed in the normal women. I think I did but I'm hypercritical on myself but what I did notice was the ads and you never like anyone who's been lived in regional areas or country areas knows that like there's some pretty interesting ads Frank Walker's everywhere in Australia selling the tiles but what I did notice was a massive increase in podcast ads so the hit network which is where I was on in ship it and they own or they're you know they're part of podcast one they've got the I don't know if that's a separate business isn't it

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yeah so the SCI bought into podcast one and they may on the podcast one Australia yeah

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section and so there's these like 32nd ads spooking the podcasts that are on their podcast one network which was not around I explain it it had the host and now they use like little snippets of the show was like a fully produced 32nd ad alone a lot Ilana day I think they called it back in the day loaded in and so there were it was interesting though because it was like you know you women talking about like there's a podcast of these two girls that explore like health topics but it's so fascinating I heard like maybe four different ones across the weekend that I was there was like it's so funny like you steering people away from listening to you right here because I mean this is the thing I will get like the bug podcast by you go down the rabbit hole this hundreds once you jump on that app and then Eli hang on what else is that you telling me that is a show called serial that's all listen to that

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that was being Kim Kardashian to that moment last week but yeah so that was interesting that they really speaking podcasting

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in regional areas which is I think dangerous for them because people will force dangerous I mean what's the what's the what's the option what's the alternative that they don't mention they pretend that podcasting isn't there don't build an audience at all and get absolutely smashed and that

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well I think for the sales teams in these areas It's hard enough as it is to to get people involved and then I think yeah the be slipping away the audience within these markets would be slightly slipping I mean there is some prestige in the local radio and people do lovers I did also hear an ad for search it's like a searching for talent Do you want to be Do you want to host your own Breakfast Show and there was this girl Hi I'm it Hi I'm Ellie or whatever it was and you know I wanted to be on radio and I you know got my own show where now I can talk about whatever I want I say bullshit no you cannot

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talk about what they want you to talk about you know scoop lap

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but it was so what were they what so with a trying to evade already trying to recruit new a new Breakfast Show of what was not the deal no it's that is see I have a

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program called Hubble or something so it's like soup to nuts raw potential talent in so the ad directed people to go there saw it and it was a date we've got a two day event in Aubrey where you can come up and you know I think it just be people who want to be on the radio and so that they're searching for people within the areas which I've always thought those those towns should have like a ship Liberty like a local legend who is keen on you know being a superstar on radio and then have him in the town like it's it makes sense rather than the blowing yeah blowing lightning

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I think that I've been critical to SCI podcast one previously on the podcast specifically just around some of the language they use or the the messaging they have around what they're doing and maybe trying to spin it to be more revolutionary than it actually is however with this stuff I think that it's positive I think the idea that they going out to the regional areas and finding talent because I mean having I haven't lived you know in in these Rachel areas however I did live in Barrick so close enough. But the and I'm guessing that there isn't necessarily the infrastructure to help find talent. So this is probably the the only way that they think that they can get a podcast and it might start a conversation and get them into it and then discover that they can do it themselves. Yeah, yeah, it's

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an interesting shift. And is definitely notable from the time I was there, because I loaded a lot of the ads that I remember we used to push people to go and listen to our podcast from the from the show itself, which surprisingly people did back then. And just as your podcast still around. I think it's all down that's going right. It'd be costing the money cape, any of that data out there. They don't want any that bullshit. So the the ads that you've voiced, dear, what was your favorite ad that you ever voiced for the local station? Oh, it was everything from you know, shipping showcase jewelers, and it was like, you know, jewelry ones, nothing, nothing notable that I can remember but just basic basic sheet. Yeah,

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just fellow any local business, it'd be more just like,

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we did a lot of competition. So we didn't have the voice like, you know, come down to Rick's pool center to get your discounted pool just in time for the summer wasn't that kind of stuff, who would voice that

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know, that had a lot of that imaging coming in from somewhere else. I didn't actually see it. But it was it was more the competitions, the integration of the competitions that we we ran, you know, and then you try and do some creative idea in in.

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In hindsight, it's like, there was a lot we used to kind of compensate with some super creative idea, like, one we tried to get, it was like this animal thing, I can't even remember what the prize was. But we got people to bring down their animal. And then we ran them through this, like, you know, like a obstacles course. And I just, I've got video of it, and just someone bought this shape down, and now I just will reside and a pig someone wrote a pig Dan and so they're like, we like we even these pigs through this thing and like definitely a bit of animal cruelty happening just like put on come on, like they really want to win so they're trying to pull them through the fucking the hope of the tire and these animals is like hiding it

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and there yet probably one I mean, that's the thing that podcasting I wonder podcasting hasn't worked out or it hasn't yet fishing to that sort of area which is what radio does so well which is the community in local content like do you think that it's eventually going to get to a point where there's going to be actually commenting people with podcasts and they will you know create these integrations with the shopping center and be doing all of this sort of stay

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It is interesting I think half the audience is so niche you know like yeah you get Christian how's audience data to the shopping center it's like you know exactly who you're gonna get

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which well you definitely won't have any of those coals minis left because imagine it Christian how's audience at the shopping center that they've run out of caramel chocolate and someone just stab someone for the for the little down prices a damn finger

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it is something that I liked about it because regional towns like they get around the radio and the kids listen to but shout out to the Jarrett's if they are listening because I know the family I've stayed with that I went to visit on the weekend in Cairo bring

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some friends of mine You know Mitchell I know they do about a 25 minute drive every morning from Khyber motor, the high school in ship and they used to listen to styrofoam. And they still might, but I know they listen to our podcast

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while they're driving. So it's like it's changing my nothing better than learning about scams that might happen in regards to masturbation videos. And on the drive to school. Yeah,

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well, Mitchell just gone 18 and he's brother a lot younger. So we're, you know, bring them up to scratch. Good. chillin. What's happening in the Big Smoke? Yeah,

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well, talking about radio, it's actually probably good timing. overnight. We got an email from Kyle. He says, Do Tommy and Josh Williams call really enjoy listening to the daily talk show. I'm about to start a row at a radio station in Victoria. As a digital content producer. I like to think that I'm following you your entertainment industry. footsteps, I've got a few questions that I'd love to fire at you both. Are you ready for them? Oh, yeah. Yeah. All right. This is going to

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charity and collaborative. But

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this is talking about niche number one, do you find it difficult to switch your brains off content ideation mode, I'm always conceptualizing and adding to my personal content list. But I want to have the ability to switch off no chance ABC. Leon always be contacting Yeah, yeah, I don't, I don't think it is about switching, switching it off. I think that it is about prioritization. Working out, okay, what is it? What are your goals at the moment, and then having a mechanism to write down the ideas that you do have, because if they're in your brain, they're taking up space and attacking up, you know, capacity to actually do anything and death think. Whereas if you haven't been a pipeline, and you can we use a big trailer board, you could use something like that. Have a list of everything, all your ideas, and then be ruthless when it comes to filter. Yeah,

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you can have those ideas sitting there for ages. I have watched some Mikhail stuff shout out to call. Yeah, we've spoken on Insta DMC Sweden and then yeah I liked how many of these videos and I and I feel like I was watching them thinking that it was very I was very similar to the what he's doing now a few years ago and I remember like he's just I feel like he's given heaps of ideas a crack which I think he's probably saying Ryan that question because he's thinking about how much is thinking about the stuff he's doing and I think it's I think it serves you for a time where you are just obsessed and and always contending because it will slow down I think I don't think there's any you know like you look at Casey Neistat, a non stop blogging for a few years that wasn't ever gonna can, you know, stay the same, the same pace. And he's now like giving push back to the amount of what he does right. And so I think everyone you correct this you overcorrect. So you go real hard and then you slow it down and work out what you prioritize I don't think is any danger in just immersing yourself in especially for the role that he's going into it's just like you've got to be on you've got you know you're you're trying to prove yourself not and you know in some senses you're trying to land a whole bunch of ideas and somewhat stick but if you've got lots of them maybe it will so just go ahead sir ABC

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yeah and you don't want to be the donkey as I've heard which is here the donkey is sending was day one something to in this context where the donkey imagine that donkeys thirsty it's in the middle it's thirsty and hungry yeah it's in a middle of the field on one side is food on the other side is water and it keeps going back and forth and it can't decide whether to eat or drink and ends up dying and that's what can happen with our idea is we can be so we can yeah we can be back and forth and be you know questioning ourselves and then we don't end up doing anything I know when I was working at the radio station the biggest shock for me was I had this idea that I was going to do what I thought was sort of a nine to five job and then I was going to come home and have my side hustle when I was going to be creating all of these personal projects and I think the benefit of working for a radio station or being an employee of any company is you are you can give yourself permission to say this is what I'm focusing on and go all in on that use that as a mechanism to create focus and because I think that they could be a risk of their which I think that we all have done throughout our careers which is focused on our side hustle more than the actual job and at that point it's normally the transition you know you can probably have a runway of six months of being checked out of one job and focusing on side hustle before you actually want to take off right yeah but from day dot i think focusing on you know I think an extension on to this topic ease focus on who do Who was your boss who who you report to who actually is going to be measuring how you going because I know that I would you know in that whole distracted space think of hi impressing everyone and yeah the old a six people wanting different things yeah there was I remember the

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different different people from different shows us like requesting things and I'll do it and yes it does create great relationships that last a long time but it's if you're expecting just to do a great job thinking about the sole person that you're reporting to I think it's good as well

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and

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you still reporting to Jules land he still Yeah,

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I've been managing it. Yeah, I'm just texting him. Now I add question number two. Does it regularly frustrate you that through social media everyone now is a content creator because of this? I feel as though 90% of the content I consume especially on Instagram and Facebook is rubbish content? Should they be content creation license she need to earn before being able to post

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Yeah, it's when we do it for a job.

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I think I think people are more amazed at the quality of what sometimes I put out. But I feel like they're looking at me like a punter and I don't think that it's like, actually what I do. It's my job. But no, I think I think it's great that everyone can create, it changes the game for the people that are actually taking it seriously because they have to re look at how they are approaching it. Because if everyone can do it, you know, and yeah, you just got in early, there's no point of difference once everyone can do it. And so you have to focus in on what what that point of difference is

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that you should have a lot yeah, I think that definitely should ever lost. And

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I think this I, I think it's, I think it is good to, to use shit content to inspire like, I find that I get a lot of color medians will go to a shit comedy show. And that will actually spark them getting up and going to an open mic and doing it. I think that it's, you know, the democratization of all of the tools so that anyone can do it obviously creates noise, but it also creates an opportunity for you to do something unique. So I think I would deconstruct what people are doing and saying, Okay, what is it that has become the status quo, what is just the standard and then building from there? Yeah,

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it's

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what it actually has changed also is the fee that people would have I remember when I first started posting videos, not heap of people were doing it that were friends that I knew. And so there was those that feeling of and I kind of brushed it I kind of what you know, went in like a bowl and tried to not think about it. When I put out a video, you feel those little feelings of like, our faculty wonder what people are thinking, but I know for now, if everyone's doing it, you just another person that's posting content, so that has kind of gone which then allows you to focus on what you're actually creating.

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And maybe it allows you to kind of just 15 like, so you don't really stand out when you are in that really ship phase that everyone goes through and you end up getting better and better. So allows you to just, you know,

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blending and then hopefully I think it's to get better you can stand out.

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I think it's also a good opportunity to sort of stay humble. there's a there's a tool that I love referring to. Or it's sort of a theory that Dan Ariely. Dan Ariely, a organizational psychologist talks about or like a sociologist, I think he talks about the IKEA effect, which is basically they ran a study where they got people to make paper cranes. And then at the end, they had the opportunity of buying the paper cranes that they had made, or they could buy pre made paper cranes. And what they found was people paid significantly more for the paper cranes they made. And so their findings were that and that's why they call it the IKEA effect is we value things more when we have a role in making them. So for instance, when you cook pastor at home, when you make the pastor when you do that, that there's a thing in us that thinks that the the food that we're making tastes better than actually does. And so I think using the IKEA effect on knowing that the IKEA effect is there is a great way to stay humble. Because what it's saying, is it saying, okay, like, because I make this I'm already assuming a certain level of quality that may not actually be being seen by external parties.

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And then secondly, I think that the filter of no one gives a fuck is a really good starting point for content that you make. So yeah, and this is with the daily talk show, I think that our approach, you know, even in the tagline a conversation, sometimes with recording, we realize that we can, you know, have hits but a lot of misses, and we can be boring at times and all that. So, ship, but it's part of the process. I think that maybe getting comfortable with that can be really good, too. And then I think that

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you'll then feel less sort of annoyed by all of the other people doing shit stuff around you, if that makes sense. Yeah, that's good. Any any more from cowboy? What's happening? Yeah, well, we'll do we'll do one more. He says, American Hustle. A Gary van der Chuck preaches documenting over creating, I tend to disagree with this approach as it promotes average lazy and non thought through content. What are your opinions on this

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interesting, and I think I think it's that advice is for people that are stuck in that

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space of, I don't know what to create. And so I think there's a lot more to document then what, what people can then what, what people can create. So it's like documenting I think people like seeing processes of things and seeing how things work. And

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in the context of he, how he says it why he says it's like for business, you know, for real estate agents.

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But no, the reason I was a reality, but I think it is the, this leads back to his license, the content license, I think what Gary Vee is saying, you have a license, it's Gary V's fault. He's given the he's issued a lot everybody out there. And he said, just document versus create, I think creating can feel kind of stage stage and bit forced or over thought where he's saying, Don't overthink that just what's happening around you, and what's happening to you. And that's easier to tell it's more personable and more close to you. So come across, in some senses, it should come across more genuine then what would be if you were trying to, you know, come up with some concepts and, you know, forge some, you know, something, forming some concept and then executing it versus just what's happening around you and what what's going on your life which is person Yeah,

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I great. I think it's sort of taking that minimum viable product approach, which they talk in start up land, it's, you know, what's the minimum amount that we can do right now to test this idea. And for for most people, you know, the coming up with the creative is too hard, but working with what they have around them. You know, the, the best camera is the one that's on, you know, most cases that's your iPhone or your Android or whatever you use,

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like diary around to read every day.

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My backpack, you know, you know, rider doing they've got a smartphone. No, bullshit Red Red cameras. Yeah, well, yeah,

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they've got they've got a it's still it's been delayed a lot. I think it was announced last year in August. And it requires HD

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Yeah, it probably would it it's pretty insane. Actually, if you I think it's called the, the hydrogen the if he typed in the red hydrogen into Google. But it's a The idea is that using a screen that can do sort of, like holograms i think is what it is. It's like this sort of three dimensional so stuff but the idea is and why most people are going to be buying this phone when it eventually actually does come out like a bunch of people all the red fanboys put their deposit down already but

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yeah the apparently you'll be able to get really beautiful beautiful photos using it and if you didn't know red is like a cinema cameras expensive

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Yeah, yeah. Camera if you don't care about cameras,

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you know that

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I was trying to think about people who an awesome thing about myself that has no idea cameras

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that was more question was,

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will raise a camera, right? Josh

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Mason who was in the office yesterday was telling me about Gary V's team. And this is something I've had a bit of a gripe with, is when people compare Gary V's content to what they're creating for themselves and then want what Gary Vee has it right now. And Mason told me this yesterday for Gary V's personal brand. He has 26 people working on the content

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26 fucking people if they are on 40 grand he think about that. And if people are annoyed about having to spend 400 bucks on a on you know, getting someone to come out to film something. Think again. Because he's spending millions and millions and you're not gonna get what he has for 400 bucks. You're gonna drop a lot more. Yeah, yeah.

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Crazy. Yeah, I think it anyone that's getting annoyed at spending $400 probably should just buy a GoPro with it and do it themselves through, it's probably I am

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I am in a lot more and getting asked a lot more about products, what people should buy, like, yesterday, I was tagged in something like what, what stabilizers? Should I buy all of this stuff for Pharaoh Ponta it's like they're not even a Did you just tell them just a fact and use a steady hand too lazy fact did you

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actually didn't write back as I

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can be fact like I did a bit of a Facebook audience maybe 12 months ago where I just clicked read on all of my 99 plus unread Facebook messages like what the fuck you doing? I'm like I'm just like clearing it out. She's like, What are all these inches rating them and there were just people that I like went to school with, you know, 2003 being like Hey Josh, I'm thinking about buying a Mac Do you think that this would be that like the best approach or like it's so funny the the amount of especially through Melbourne geek and doing that belonged I do get the regular Facebook message it always seems if it's not on Facebook Messenger I feel like I'm way more likely to to respond yeah yeah if for whatever reason Facebook Messenger just feels like a bit of a call yeah well it's how you position yourself though you were the Melbourne geek so you are the go to for any had a caricature. I was on Melbourne talk radio which was a radio station which went I think it went bust but I actually if you search on Soundcloud Josh Jansen MTR you'll be able to find

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the segment that I that I did with Glen Ridge from siloed the century anyhow on me talking technology and answering people's tech questions oh yes we should get a little snippet to play at some point yeah I can be fun grants a daily talk show everyone I'm a bed go to bed so I can listen to guessing shimmer will be coming up soon that song you know another beautiful acoustic song know the Shema that tells me from the cold just when I was feeling shy yeah yeah

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yeah really everyone gets into the course

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what do you what do you have to do where you don't have to shoot it's currently 6:34am in the office better get ready to head off to film some stuff

33:44
perfect great Well hi the daily talk show.com is the email address Michelle wrote to us in regards to my concerning a male the blackmail email she said the black male a male is a fraud get one of those awake hackers get onto old forums and easy to act as a hacker databases

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yes so I really am a way that

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I had on the way to work this morning I was thinking about the episode name for yesterday and I was really annoyed that we didn't go with you met you You messed with the wrong winger

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that's right good the I did think maybe one of the things of trolling the dirt who emailed me was I was thinking of running back and saying hi I've actually front footed by releasing my own

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I've decided to out myself so you've got nothing on me now just completely disarmed them

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the that would be fairly shocking to say the least

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God go awesome. Alright Have a good one guys will say tomorrow. Hey guys.