Losing weight and all his money - Geoff Jowett

Geoff: Wait a minute! Crossface, the Daily Talk Show, a conversation sometimes worth recording with Josh Janson and Tommy Jackett.

Josh: It's the Daily Talk Show. Um, this is a, this is a pre-record. Um, we've got Geoff Jowett. How are you?

Geoff: Fantastic, great to be here.

Josh: Um, so it's so good to see you.

Tommy: We're in your hotel room here in Melbourne.

Geoff: And can I just say, you blokes have rocked in doing Melbourne fashion justice. It looked like two models bowled into the bistro where I was having my breakfast. Little Aussie battler from Sydney, 4 foot tall, no hair, and two dead set Gucci models bowl in. You blokes, no wonder you're killing it.

Tommy: We don't have the muscles you do, Geoff.

Josh: It's true.

Geoff: Mate, I'd trade them any day of the week for your boat race, AKA face. Mate, it's just, it's tough above the shoulders for Aussie Geoff, but he does what he can with his rig.

Josh: So if people are hearing the voice and they're saying, fuck, I know that voice, they might be like me back when I was 16, 17 years old. I would be watching morning TV and there was a guy and I would sit and just, for whatever reason, when the infomercials would come on, when this guy would come on, you'd turn it up and you'd hear him talk about cookies and protein.

Geoff: Mate, I was gonna say, well, protein bars, cookies, bites, and more.

Josh: Call now.

Geoff: What could be better than a Free Troll TV offer? This is 5 kilos in the first 7 days or it's free. You don't even have to send it back.

Josh: You, um, so you were the voice of a company that you, uh, co-founded, and I was also Dave, uh, Dave Hughes' love child, I believe, as well.

Geoff: I've been compared to Dave Hughes many times, and there's Antonio Sabato Jr., good comparison. Yeah, Dave Hughes, average. Yeah, but I know, God bless him, they're very, very good funny men. But yeah, I'm a knockabout. And the voice is very like Hughsy. Yeah, quite recognizable, probably for all the wrong reasons. But yes, it was piercing back in the day, early, uh, morning shows. The Morning Show, Mornings with Kerri-Ann, The Circle, 9 AM David and Kim, Foxtel. We did a huge amount of TV for Body Trim, which was my weight loss coaching programme circa 2007.

Tommy: Yeah, you mentioned before how many people signed up for your program?

Josh: Mate, there was a million.

Geoff: A million people bought the DVD.

Josh: And then how many people would have watched the DVD, right? Because like, I remember hearing you talk about probably 3 million people actually end up watching it because it gets passed around. Like, back in the day you'd have a DVD. Exactly.

Geoff: We did a study on it, and, uh, from the Jowett Clinic— no, there was no Jowett Clinic, but we did do a survey and Um, yeah, it was literally like 2.7 people for everyone who bought it. 2.7 people, yeah, watched it. So roughly, you know, 2.7 million people probably had eyeballs on the education that was Body Trim. And a huge amount, a huge amount of people lost, lost weight because it was, it was weight loss education based on hunter-gatherer diet. It was a bit before Pete Evans and, and paleo, but again, it was not as extreme, but it was like a modern-day approach to hunter-gatherer diet that not dumbed down, but just, just made easy, you know, easily digestible for people that don't understand food.

Josh: Yeah. And so it was a— describe what it was. So it was a program?

Geoff: Yeah, it was a programme that I came up with. I started working on it in '06 because I was in the fitness industry, loved that, did that for a bunch of years, did okay. And then I wanted to get into weight loss because a lot of people were coming into the personal training studios that we had wanting to lose weight. But really as a bodybuilder, I knew that weight loss was more food than it was lifting heavy weights and whatnot. So I wanted to get an education programme out. So, and I'd done a lot of seminars myself from a stage, so I thought, why don't I create DVDs? So we did. We created DVDs, and, and the first one was half— it was half a dozen DVDs and a reference guide and a book and a pedometer and a tape measure and a website. $150. And, um, we mainly promoted it, and it was great because it wasn't pills or potions or, or powders or anything. It was education. And it was Interesting though, because we had a big call center. We'd have like 80 people in a call centre in Sydney, and you'd just hear them, oh no, there's— and then most of them are Irish and English, and you know, no, no, there's no pills in it, like it's not the pills, it's the DVDs. And you can tell the other person, I'm calling up for the pills, where's the pills?

Tommy: So people are looking for that.

Geoff: Yes, you see, so in the ads I didn't— I never explained that it was DVDs because people want to Unfortunately, the human condition is one that they want the instant fix. So if I said, g'day, g'day Australia, Jeff Jowett here, have I got a product for you! You got 6 DVDs, you got to watch all of them, you can't eat them, you got to watch them, and I'm going to educate you about the role of food in weight loss— TV off. Yeah, no one's buying that. So I talked about speeding up your metabolism, I talked about how to melt body fat. Like, the big ads were melting body fat fast, how to get Hollywood thighs. Uh, all of the— it was a benefit, it was all benefit advertising. But the great thing was that they got an awesome product of education when it rocked up in the post. And those that watched the DVDs, again, they thought, geez, he's relatable, that's good. It was engaged, and they lost so much weight.

Tommy: Well, I told you, my sister-in-law's mum has lost a shitload of weight, and It's all because of you. It's all because of the Doo-Voo Doo-It. It was a saying around the house.

Geoff: Was it?

Tommy: Can you get the Doo-Voo Doo-It? It's— yeah, it's amazing. And so, I mean, this was very much before its time. Like, 2 million people now, people are getting on one video, but it's nowhere near the cut-through of someone getting a DVD and having to go through that process of putting it in and loading it up.

Geoff: Different times. And, and look, it It's all been part of the journey. If I knew then, if I knew then what I know now, and if I lived then like I live now, it'd be a different end result. We sort of mucked the business up towards the end, but early days we got amazing results for people and really life-saving, like thousands of, you know, lives saved. I wrote a book at one stage called Myths, Lies, and Exercise, and I asked for testimonials the day before it went out to print. And I got 572 testimonials overnight, and I put them in the back of the book. Yeah, yeah, it was like—

Josh: how much did that add to the book?

Tommy: Had to release another book.

Geoff: The book was a bit light for pages, so I thought I needed to fill him up a bit. But no, no, we whacked them in. We're probably in 20 pages of short testimonials. And yeah, very, very proud.

Josh: I remember, um, uh, we were up in Sydney and Tommy was catching up with you, and he came back from the catch-up and he said, man, this Geoff dude has some stories. And I reckon there's something, the thing that I, like when we filter who we want on the show, that type of thing, it's people who are interesting. It's not people who necessarily have the most amount of dollars in a bank account. It's the people who have had the actual experiences that we can learn from, that can that can share stories. What, what has been through everything that's happened? Where are you today? What's your, you know, what do you think about now?

Geoff: Sure, yeah. And it's good to talk about a lot of this stuff because, um, I think my journey, there's a lot of learnings for people, and I'm very open about it because we're all just doing our best. You know, back then, for starters, I wanted to be the best. I wanted to win. I wanted to compete. I wanted the biggest brand. I wanted the flashiest car. Oh, It was— I lived in ego the whole time. Now, I had a desire to help. I genuinely like people. I always have. Uh, I get more anxious sitting by myself than around— I love people, but I wanted the status. And I bang on about things now, you know.

Josh: Was that at the start, or where did that— because you, you have— you had Vision.

Geoff: Yeah, so what happened, I, I did Vision with my mate Andrew. We did really well. After 5 or 6 years, I probably got bored. Said, mate, I've had enough, buy me out. And then, um, he did. And then—

Tommy: and buying you out means you were— you— how many personal training studios did you open?

Geoff: We only had a couple by then. And it was funny, this is typical Jeff Jowett. He allowed to swear on this thing? Yeah, I said typical Jeff Jowett fuck up. Like, we've done all the hard work and there's me, 6 years in, I'm like, mate, I've had enough. Not hard, but we were clashing a bit. We're great mates now, but we're very different. And I was, I was still only 27. I started that when I was like 21, 22, very, very young. Always, I had massive ambition, but I'd had enough by my mid to late 20s. He bought me out, didn't really want me to go because I was more the, the front person for that one. And, and people very good with this, I had great relationships with the staff, but I was a bit loose anyway. But I said, look, we've had enough, I've had enough. Off I went and stuffed around for a year or two and then started Body Trim, but I wanted to prove myself because Vision had done well, but I left.

Tommy: Yeah.

Geoff: So I wanted to go out and prove to everyone what I could do.

Josh: And do you remember the last day of Vision for you?

Geoff: That last day of Vision, oh yeah, just telling the staff really. It was just— I've made some massive blunders in my life, emotional decisions. Like, if I get too emotional about things— like Andrew, my partner, they're wonderful bloke, champion. And, and we're great friends now. And but, you know, business partnerships when you're young and full of ego are very hard.

Josh: Yeah.

Geoff: And that's where I was back then. And I look back now, and I was saying this in a seminar yesterday down here, like Vision Body Trim, the big mistakes that I've made, and we'll talk more about them, but I— you don't see your part in them at the time. You think the other person's a dickhead, they're hard to work with, right? You think it's all the other bloke or the other, you the other person. But when your foot— when your ego is driving you, it's— you're there for every mistake in your life, you see. So it's not like, you know, I've been unlucky 10 times. I'm pretty sure I'm the person who's been there.

Josh: Well, if you see— yeah, if you see a bunch of people and they all seem to be dickheads, it's that whole thing of you might be the dickhead.

Geoff: Yes.

Josh: And what was it? And so, so you left, uh, you decided to say goodbye. Like, was it sort of— was it always a big crazy exit? Did you go out in flames or was it pretty controlled?

Geoff: No, that was— oh no, it was pretty, um, I don't know if it went out in— I don't know if there were flames, but it was, I've had enough, I just want to get on with it, give me some cash. It was just, it was just not thought out.

Josh: Was it, was it sad? Were you feeling sad at that point, do you think? Frustrated? What's the actual feeling?

Geoff: Look, I think back then I was relieved at the time because it was, was challenging, but it was challenging because of my own stuff. You see, when you're so I'll talk more about addiction. Addiction and ego are just— I can't tell people how bad they are. And most people have some of them. Everyone's got an ego, but it's awareness. The biggest takeaway from me today is going to be talking about awareness. And yeah, we're going to talk about humility and a whole bunch of stuff, but you gotta, you gotta have awareness about yourself, otherwise you can't see it. You think he's a dickhead, no one likes him, or whoever, whatever it is, but it's you. Everyone's got flaws. We're perfectly imperfect. But back then I was thinking You know, I was always thinking I was the victim. It was the other bloke, and it's too hard, and you're hard to work with. And yet, no. And you look back, and I learned this from— you know, I'll talk more about the drinking and whatnot later— but someone that I was doing a bit of AA with, he said, look, um, you need, you know, you need to know that in your life, the good and the bad, you've been there for all of it. You've got to own your part in it. And that's so important. You gotta, you gotta be able to sit there. And I sit there today said this yesterday, anyone could walk through the room now and I'd be happy to see him. I've got no resentments, none. And I've made the amends with the mistakes that I've made, and, and it's freedom. My definition of success is very different now. And I wanted to be famous back then. I wanted status. I looked at— I want the world to— like, I don't have that anymore.

Tommy: So you left Vision with the goal of creating something big to show these fuckers, essentially?

Geoff: Yeah, I think at the time I did. Tommy, yeah, yeah.

Tommy: And so you started Body Trim. I mean, I eat the cookies still.

Geoff: Yeah, that's why you're so trim.

Tommy: And so how big did that— from a financial point of view, how big did you grow that? And I mean, that's all fuel for your ego essentially.

Geoff: Yeah, it was.

Tommy: But I mean, it's, it's the record that you set for yourself.

Geoff: Yeah. So mate, Body Trim, we got it at its peak, was doing $35 million in, in turnover in Australia, and we were, we were, we were We had 100+ staff in the city. We, um, we were the biggest. We were selling a million protein bars a month in Coles. So it was a huge brand, a huge brand. And, um, but again, here's a bloke who, looking back, you know, in retrospect, always had his ego issues. And he goes out of insecurity. It's insecurity and fear, you know. So it's, it's how deep do you want to go? So ego, well, what, what's behind ego? Insecurity and fear.

Josh: What were you insecure about, do you think?

Geoff: My place in the world. Was I good enough? Had I been lucky? Um, you know, the list's as long as my arm, I think. And, and, um, and not being comfortable in my— in myself.

Josh: Not—

Geoff: hadn't really found my place and always trying to prove myself. And maybe my mum and dad were school teachers. I, you know, mum passed away many years ago, but I love— you know, I love them dearly, but they were quite, um, strict and, and quite I don't know if they're perfectionists, but maybe nothing was ever quite good enough. So I was always trying to prove myself and, and be someone. And I'm getting quite deep here, but I think a lot of it does come back to some of your earlier years as well. And, and even at Vision, like, Andrew, he'd been in personal training for quite a few years. I've got this— I had this ability to come into something and see a gap in the market and just attack it., and people got excited around me, and, and I was good at the front of the business— sales, marketing, growth. So I'd been a trainer for like 6 months, and Andrew and I teamed up. Yeah. So I had success— came very— I'll tell you, success came very easily to me young. I hadn't worked a lot. I got a uni degree. I'm sure I had ADD of some form, but, but, you know, I sort of got my way through a sports science degree, but We started the business only after 6 to 12 months, and I was a personal trainer for 6 months, and I was bored out of my brain because the repetition of it. I'm quite creative.

Josh: Yeah.

Geoff: So just 8 clients a day, bench press, squatting, 1 rep, 2 rep, 3 rep. Oh my God, I wanted to stab myself.

Tommy: Josh just fell asleep.

Geoff: Yeah, so, but they didn't. But, you know, so I thought this, and I stopped PT after 6 months.

Josh: Yeah.

Geoff: 'cause I thought, I can't do this. And then Andrew and I said, why don't we team up? And I did more of the sales and marketing, and he did the systems, and away we went.

Tommy: So Josh said that, um, he referenced me telling him about the storeys that come from you, and I was just thinking then, I think what is so amazing about all the things we've talked about when we've had coffee is that it's such a difference in the person who you are now. And so, you know, you tell me about, like, you mentioned something about, um, the office kind of being like Wolf of Wall Street, like that movie. It was wild. But then I go— and I'm so amazed because it's like you and I just chatting about, you know, life and stuff, it seems such a contrast. Does it feel like a different person?

Geoff: I don't want to— again, that this is— but even, you know, I don't want to give myself a massive compliment here, but like the change is so 180-degree. It's so different.

Josh: I—

Geoff: yeah, it was when that Wolf of Wall Street come out, pretty much A lot of the scenes I had lived. Yeah, I didn't have a boat that sunk and a whole bunch of stuff, but we made a huge amount of money. But the lifestyle, pretty much everything that went on in that lifestyle, that movie happened in my life almost. I'm sitting in the movies just like that, all that happened. And, and, um, it was just madness. And but what happened, what's really interesting, and this is a point on leadership for people, if you're lucky enough to be successful and you got people around, they get— it's contagious and they want to be around it. And you got, you know, people who are fairly conservative and you've got 100 staff, so you've got a duty of care. And we definitely neglected our duty of care, you know, that's for sure. Like, we'd have— might not have strippers come in dressed up as, um, as interviews to say it was Tommy's birthday. I'd call up a girl and go, listen, come in wear— look sharp, glasses, um, little briefcase. And now you're going to come in and interview for a production assistant role because it's Tommy's 28th birthday or 29th birthday.

Josh: Crazy.

Geoff: And the whole office would know about it except me. Yes. And we had two floors in York Street, and the finance was up on level 9. I won't mention the CFO's name because you'll probably get divorced. But, but he, um, but, but he's like, can we come down now? And I'm like, relax, relax, another 10 minutes. Any— relax, we're not ready yet, keep working. Anyway, did you have an HR department, mate. We sent them out to lunch back then. Yeah, yeah, we sent legal and HR out. The PA took them out to lunch on those particular days, and it filtered back obviously a bit later on in the day, but too late, too late. Damage was done. But, but yeah, anyway, but yeah, just silly stuff, silly antics like that went on. But it was, it was, it was sort of all in good fun. But I was, you know, I was drinking a lot of alcohol all the time, and deep down I wasn't happy. Deep down I wasn't really living my truth, but I hadn't fully worked all that out yet. And I got— it was fun. Yeah, I got— it was fun. The money—

Josh: it sounds like it's in this sort of quirky way, it sounds like you're also really generous. Like, I mean, just even the fact that you're— it's a Sunday morning, 7:30, you could be fucking doing anything, but you've, you know, invited Tommy and I to come and chat to you. Like, his generosity been something that has always been present? And do you think it started from a place of ego? Just talk about generosity.

Geoff: That's such an awesome question. So deep down, I've always— I know it sounds cliché, but I've always wanted to make a difference. I've always wanted— and that's Vision, Body Trim, they were, they were at the core great businesses built for the right reasons. Yeah, but we can get ticklish, and I got ticklish with addiction and status and, and all that. So you start— I wanted to start bodybuilding because there was obese people everywhere. They didn't know about food. I did. I was motivating.

Josh: You studied exercise science?

Geoff: Exercise science at uni. I'd PT of the Year. I'd done all the sort of the usual accomplishments.

Tommy: You won every award possible.

Geoff: I won a bunch of it. Where— and I wanted to really make my mark, and— but I knew I could help a lot of people. But, but then all of a sudden, and, and I'm not blaming anyone other than myself. The bloke I teamed up with at Body Trim, super smart, you know, had a fairly fast— has a— had a fairly fast lifestyle. And you can morph into that. And, you know, and, and great guy, taught me so much about business. He, he taught me how to scale and leverage business. And but before I knew it, the purity of what I was doing— because I have these evangelical ideas, but when I was younger I can— I could easily be, um, come— go off, off course, if that makes sense. Whereas now, yeah, 7:30 AM to talk to you guys and share a message, absolutely, because it's purpose. I think the two things we need are connection and purpose. And when I've lost connection and purpose, I'm gone.

Josh: And you've got a high amount of energy, so you can either use that energy for good or for negative, right?

Geoff: Someone said to me once, you, mate, if you use your powers for good, you'll change the world.

Josh: Yeah.

Geoff: If you don't, you blow it up. Yeah, I was at my hairdresser years ago, actually, when I had hair. And, um, but yeah, ironically, but it's true. And, but so for me, and I was saying this to the ladies at breakfast when you guys came in this morning, because a whole bunch of my members are here at the hotel and I stayed here all weekend. Make sure you take time for you. Make sure you take time for you. So listen, right now, no, right now my entire world is building the Jawett Method because this is, this is, this is what brings me to life. And I want to do so. I want to do something that matters. Like, I fucked a bunch of stuff up, and, and I did it. I fucked it up, no one else. And I look back at some relationships, I fucked them up. I did the wrong thing. No one else did the wrong thing. And even at the time when I thought it's this bloke's fault or her fault or whatever, sure, but I played a massive part in that. And I took, I took on their stuff, and I made it personal, and I got emotional.

Tommy: Is there a grieving process for looking back? And I think about this with you, and I don't think I've said this to you, but I like— you've got two of the businesses you've built are still here and making money. And I mean, what have you got from those?

Geoff: I've got a couple of good yarns.

Tommy: But how does that play for you now? Like, have you been through a process?

Geoff: Absolutely. So I was pretty suicidal, um, 2000, uh, What are we, in '18? Um, mate, '16.

Tommy: That was when I met you.

Geoff: Yeah, I was fucked. Yeah, I was fucked. Yeah, when I met you at Craig Harper's, um, thing, I was fucked.

Tommy: I said to Josh, even since I've known you, you've— there's been a massive shift.

Geoff: Yeah, thank you. And I was fucked. Um, so because what happened, typical me, I, I— after Body Trim, I came up with another— a good idea, poor execution. I did a medical weight loss company that exploded. Was doctors, it was blood tests, it was exploded in a good way, or in a good way, but it wasn't executed well. And I'm not a good back office guy. Yeah, you know, I'm great with the big ideas and getting things off the ground, but it wasn't tight. And, and it was, it was prescription medication, it was bloods, it was doctor consults. It wasn't tight in the back end. And, and, um, it come under scrutiny from some medical lobbyists, and they're out there And I think it was the best thing that ever happened to me, but it broke me. It broke me because I got— Channel 9 did a big storey on the news and made me out to look like a complete shonk. And I went into that business with the best of intentions, but I didn't have the skills to execute it properly. And it was public and it let people down. And, um, and that was around the time I met you. But, and then I just— and then so I was, I was playing catch-up in answer to your question then. Because I'd had a couple of things not work. I've been— look, medical weight loss in America was massive. I thought, you know, but I wasn't doing it for the right reasons, right? That I'm a coach motivator. I'm not a doctor, I'm not a pharmacist. I don't understand it. So I thought, I'll do coaching and motivating and the doctors will do that. I don't understand it. And then I was the front man, so I was the bloke who really come under the attack. And I— and fair enough, fair enough, because I used my profile and And a lot of people did actually lose a lot of weight, and it worked for people. Still message me, oh, I don't know what was in them pills, but it worked.

Josh: But speed— what was in them?

Geoff: Well, we actually had a compound from Italy that, um, well, they were stimulants, and we used metformin as well, which was good for type 2 diabetes. We had a bunch of different products that, again, if it was really tight and well executed, it could have been a brilliant business. But it wasn't. And but that was when I met you. We had to shut it down. And, um, it mainly came out of one particular medical lobbyist. He didn't like— he hated— he hates complementary medicine. So Swiss Blackmores didn't like Bodytree, didn't like any of us other than general medicine. General— if you're not a GP, you don't know what you're talking about. So it was— it's very conservative, and I don't want to be in that space. It was too hard. And that was around that you know, but Swiss and Blackmores have got deep pockets and heaps of lawyers. And I think they're great companies, by the way, Swiss and Blackmores. But the medical, um, activists, the lobbyists out there, they don't like anything that's not from a doctor. And, or, or if you are a doctor, you're meant to be in a, in a general practice. And it was just, it was very tricky. I didn't understand the landscape, but I jumped in, didn't do my homework. Yeah, I thought, how? Because I want to get back, I want to get back, I want to get back. Yeah, I should take my time. I've had a couple of things, I've left businesses, I've fucked up. Stop, breathe. But I didn't want to stop and breathe. This is the big— you know, we can talk about whether it was good or not. I didn't stop. I wanted, I wanted to be back on top, you know, and, and, um, I wanted to be making the money and living the lifestyle. And, and it was all ego, and I was defined by that, you see. So, so I needed to go to that next thing quickly. I didn't do my homework. I didn't understand what I was doing. And I think I got what I deserved. I believe I got what I deserved. I didn't look at the business. I didn't look at the category properly.

Josh: Yeah.

Geoff: And it was the best. And then, mate, it was the hardest thing that ever happened to me. From there, for the next year, I was depressed as fuck because— but that, for me now at 41, was the best thing that ever happened to me because I don't define myself— like, we're in these Converse shoes, great shoes, $99.

Josh: Yeah, very, uh, clean.

Geoff: Yeah, they're only a couple of days in.

Josh: Yeah, sure. Yeah.

Geoff: But for me, right, this— and because I've made— right now, and I'm— it's not a badge of honor, but I'm broke. I've got no money, and I just, with a snorkel, keep my head above water.

Josh: Yeah.

Geoff: But that's okay.

Tommy: I mean, broke for the person that has had a $35 million business, that it feels a bit different from—

Geoff: yeah, yeah. So I, I, I don't— you know, I lost everything. I rent a one-bedroom apartment. I've got two little dogs.

Tommy: They're cute.

Geoff: Very cute. William and Harry, two of the greats. Yeah, two of the greats. Can't wait to see them or something. But here's the gifts. And I don't say that, but I don't know. It's funny because people with me, it's so funny. Like, I'm not controlled by ego anymore. Like, I don't— I can— and I don't even— like, I've got no money, but I don't— I'm not defined by how much money.

Josh: But— and the funny thing is, even as you say this, there's not like one bit— like, I don't feel sorry for you at all because there's nothing to be sorry about. Like, this is like the journey, right? Like, this is the—

Geoff: and this is what I said to people yesterday. Like, whatever you're going through, it's— it's a pretty good chance it's meant to happen and you need it. I needed it. When Body Gym was flying, unless I was high or at the strippers or both, or pissed, I wasn't that happy. I was riddled with anxiety. I'd always had anxiety because I was a— I don't know, I'd all, you know, just— I was living in the future the whole time, and, and just— it was just not good. And I was always just either stressed or anxious or both. And it was just no way to live. So all that was— I wasn't that happy. I was excited periods in Body Trim, but I was— there was no joy. I wasn't happy. Just the simple pleasures, I was never happy with. Now, 18 months sober, mate, I am—

Josh: you can enjoy your Converse shoes.

Geoff: Sorry, I went back, I bought those the other day, and you know, I used to have to— I remember buying a brand new Maserati for nearly $300 grand, and then after I bought it The bloke down the road bought the 458 Ferrari and I thought, ah, this car's fucked.

Tommy: Piece of shit Maserati.

Geoff: You buy the gold Rolex, someone's got the Hublot. You buy the whatever. And I did, mate, disease of more. Yeah, so there's nothing wrong with making money and being successful, and I want everyone to do that, but don't do it for that reason. I say money never leads, it follows. It follows. You gotta chase purpose, not money. I was the poster boy for what not to do. I fucked it all up. Ego ruled my life. I bought these Converse the other day 99 bucks. And it's funny, I lay in bed Saturday night, I thought, I'm gonna, I'm gonna walk into Culture Kings, hang out with the kids, listen to the DJ, buy some new wheels. And I went, then I potted down to the Nike store, bought some Nike socks and some slides. You know, you can wear the socks and the slides.

Josh: Is that—

Geoff: that's happening at the moment.

Josh: Have you got— you got to wear long socks with those types of high tops, otherwise you'll give yourself a little blister, right? Yeah, long time.

Geoff: Yeah, boom, the boys have just checked it out for the listeners. They're there. So yeah, so but it was the simple pleasures. $99, right? I remember buying all the brands, all the bullshit brands, all the time, spending thousands every time. And it was even— that was, uh, it doesn't— whatever, get me two of them. There was no joy in it. Yeah, I'd lost the joy of everything, everything. And on drugs and alcohol, if you've got a problem with them, they will rob you of joy. They are the thief of joy. And, and my ego was fueled by my addiction, fueled by my ego, and then you get a little bit of profile, then you want to hang out with famous people because you think they're awesome. Like, it was just a clusterfuck on clusterfuck. So, and I was the CEO.

Josh: Yeah, yeah, CEO of Clusterfuck. That will be the title of this— CEO of the Clusterfuck.

Geoff: Yeah, tomorrow we have got the CEO of Clusterfuck, Aussie Geoff Jowett. Yes, if you think you're struggling, if you're feeling down, ladies and gentlemen, listen to this, you'll feel real good.

Tommy: Is there power in You know, saying that I'm broke or saying that I'm, you know, at the very bottom— do you find power in that moment of being able to verbalise that freedom?

Geoff: I find massive freedom, and it's beautiful because no one else can label you.

Josh: You've said it, like you've put it out there, right?

Geoff: The best thing is people still once or twice a week, someone will, hey Jeff, just reaching out, I've got this idea, um, you know, blah blah blah, whatever industry it's in. I'm looking, you know, I thought you'd be great with your knowledge and maybe, maybe investing. Uh, I still get—

Tommy: and send them a picture of your conference.

Geoff: I just, I just— thanks, buddy, I've got no money, wish you all the— I just— but I just bang. Yeah, but I just— no money, I've got no money, I'm broke, wish you all the best, hope you do well, bang. Oh no, what? Like, there's— I have— there is no bullshit. If you hooked up like Truman Show vibe for me. Yeah. There's no contradictions. There is not one contradiction in my life now. Like, mate, I spent— mate, I spent fucking probably millions of dollars in brothels. Yeah, I had an awesome sex addiction as well. I did it all, mate.

Josh: And which came first, the money or the sex addiction? Like, what's the— like, how does all that play out? Do you— were you taking drugs before you'd got the success? And what was it that actually caused it? Was it the people that you were around?

Geoff: Well, definitely environmental made it worse, but it was always in me. So the environment— and that's why I'm so big on environment. You've got to be. So you just can't compromise that because you, you're gonna morph sooner or later. But, but I look, before I had Dough, there were, there were, there was, um, a bit of that. There was, it was always disease of more. Yeah, like fat income.

Josh: So had you stepped into a brothel before you'd made, say, like your first million?

Geoff: Yes.

Josh: Yeah, yeah, yeah. So it's not like you become a millionaire, it's like, I've got all this shit.

Geoff: It was always there. There were all the that stuff was there. They're probably just better brothels. I made a bit more dough. But, um, yeah, I don't know, it was, it was, it was crap. But I look back, but it seemed normal. I look at my life and it was fucking hell, mate. It was like— and but there's— and, and this is where I do get a bit, I guess, um, the end, like spiritual, I guess, like my path. It's such a good path. I needed all of it. To get me on where, where I am now. You, you know, having— I know this sounds a bit fluffy, but you can't have sex with someone if there's not a connection. It's wrong on every level. Like, the energy is so— it's just wrong. It is morally, for that other person, like that poor person working in that place, they don't want to be there. They've got their own addict— it's, it's fucked. The whole thing is fucked. And I was literally balls deep in it.

Josh: What do you think about, like, what, what's your take on the adult, like, you know, you're saying it's fucked and all that sort of thing, you know, uh, you know, what's your take on it?

Geoff: Pain. They're in pain, you know, and it's wrong. We live in a fallen world, you know, humans are defective products. And, you know, if they— if, you know, I don't want to demonise alcohol, but if someone invented alcohol today, it'd be illegal. Yeah, it's fucked. Alcohol is fucked. There's nothing Now creatives might say, I'm more creative when I'm pissed. Maybe, maybe. Doesn't make you a better person. Doesn't— no one's better on alcohol, no one's better on drugs. Like, so for me, I stumbled across Dr. Wayne Dyer. He's dead now, Wayne Dyer, but great spiritual sort of guy, motivator. Died in his 70s. But I listened to him years ago. I thought he was a dickhead. I just wasn't ready at all. I thought he was just knob. Brilliant.

Tommy: I can't— spiritual.

Geoff: Yeah, but he started out in science and he was a lecturer and, and he got very spiritual down. And my— and he had some addiction stuff as well. It's because a lot of the ladies in my weight loss community said, you got to listen to Wayne Dyer, he reminds us of you, or you remind us of him. So I started listening to his stuff and yeah, really, really interesting because it's, you know, energy is— and, and, and the how we— our vibration, you Alcohol, drugs, all that stuff just lowers your vibration and you attract what you are. I want things that elevate my vibration. So I was doing everything I possibly could to make myself feel shit and fuck up my life. If I look back at the sex industry, it's fucking terrible. Even, even strip clubs and the girls, because I've got a lot of friends out of that industry, like they're fucking in pain. Do you think a girl wants— and this is when you watch blokes, that chick, she does not want to be working there. She gets addicted to the money. This is fine, it's just fucked. So why is she working there? Because she makes 3 grand a night.

Josh: So what's your mindset? Is it super primal in those situations? Are you not like going into a brothel, having that experience, what goes on in your mind? Is it just like you just want to fuck? And that's basically—

Geoff: it's such a good question because I've thought about this a lot. The more— and I believe the more conscious we become, the more we can move away from those primal urges. And I know that because I feel it myself. Like, and they talk about awakening, or, you know, Buddha talked about enlightenment, but I talk about the awakening process. And it's really interesting now, like, my love of animals, horses, all animals. Like, we're all equal, we're all connected. You can't hurt other people and animals. This is a really weird storey I'm going to tell you, but once you start to wake up, you can't stop. So I was in the gym a few weeks ago, and you're going to laugh at me, and everyone does when I tell this story, but it doesn't mean it's not true. And I was in the gym, I was actually sitting on the can. Yeah, like 5 AM, 5:30 AM. There's a little cockroach on the ground. I'm just sitting there, and he was just on his back, sort of fucking dying. And, uh, and I just looked down and I'm like, this little fella's fucked. It's fucking cockroach though, like it's a cockroach, you know. In many ways it's the lowest thing of the low, but it's still a— it's still a living thing. And I, and, and I found myself— I've tried to flip him over and just give him a little tap with the foot, just get him going again. It's fucking cockroach, but everything to me, it's a living thing. No, no better or worse. And that's why— so that's, that's what they talk about. Wayne Dyer talked about this in the awakening process. When you start to wake up, good or bad, there's no, there's no going back.

Josh: In some ways you missed a protein. How do you reconcile the, you know, protein?

Geoff: So what I do— great, I love these blokes' questions, they're fucking good. So I don't eat much red meat anymore. I eat a lot of eggs. Yeah, nobody died in that process. Um, fish. I apologize, but I do eat you.

Josh: Yeah.

Geoff: And free range.

Josh: We don't have many fish listeners.

Geoff: Well, we don't know. Yeah, yeah, well, you never know that. Yeah. So I don't eat much red meat. Uh, I don't— um, what do I do? I eat chicken a few days a week and just fish and eggs and heaps of green vegetables. Oats. Oats.

Tommy: Protein powder.

Geoff: Protein powder. Yeah.

Josh: How do they make whey?

Geoff: Oh, it's a— it's a derivative of dairy. I don't have a lot of protein powder anymore now. Um, Yeah, it comes out of the waste product making cheese.

Tommy: Cheese.

Geoff: Cheese.

Tommy: So you said 2 years ago was when you were at the, the bottom. Yeah, is when I met you. It seems like a short amount of time to kind of pull yourself out.

Josh: I mean, are you out?

Tommy: Are you out?

Geoff: Well, personally, I'm out, um, emotionally, spiritually, physically, financially. I'm, you know, what have I started at the bottom and I'm here, you know. Someone said I'm still here, they come to the bottom and I'm here, you know, I'm still here, right? So mate, yeah, no, funny, but this is the thing, good things take time. And we were talking about the hockey puck analogy, or the hockey stick, right?

Josh: Yeah, hockey stick, right?

Geoff: Hockey puck.

Josh: Yeah, no, the hockey puck's what hits you.

Geoff: Yeah, that hit me in 2016, right in the balls, I think. But, uh, no, no, yeah, the hockey stick. So what I'm doing now with the Jowett Method, I build a weight loss, uh, community, and that takes time because it's organic and it's word of mouth, right? So, um, where am I now? Oh, look at who I am now. And it's— fuck, it's, it's awesome. Like, I've got, you know, I've got great people in my life. And I said this yesterday at my seminar, like, when you do life right, it takes longer. Like, good stuff takes time. I've built businesses overnight almost, and they blew up and they blew down. Yeah, and I— and you compromised your values and you did— you didn't do anything illegal, but you know, you didn't have the— you didn't have the customer service team that you needed. You didn't have the support. You didn't have the this, you didn't have that. It was all— was all bottom line stuff. And it goes up, it goes down. There's no joy and fulfillment. You know, I meet these ladies and gentlemen over the weekend and the joy and fulfillment. And where my life is now, what's possible— I'm 41— where I can be when I'm 51. My dreams now are not to be famous, not to be— have status. If I made some money again, I'd buy a little hobby farm, get some horses, do retreats. Like, mate, and, and, you know, if I'm— I don't even have a car, I've got a GoGet. So flexible. Let's just talk about, like, it's good. And so occasionally I pull out my GoGet card and I go, do you take GoGet? Just take the piss. But like, so y'all use a GoGet because I live in the city in King's Cross in Sydney. And but even, um, but even that, so I just, I live in King's Cross, like, you know, um, a few years ago I would have said I live in Rushcutters Bay or live in Potts Point because it's all simple, right? Fucking King's Cross, mate. You're living in King's Cross, just near the Coke sign, the shift. Yeah, yeah, right. But it's those little idiot, there's those little things.

Josh: What's the cut like? What did it look like? You know, you had the fancy car, fancy house, I'm guessing. Like, what's the the, uh, you know, what did it look like visually in the sense of is it getting towed away in front of your eyes? Like, what was the, uh, how did the—

Geoff: when it went pear-shaped, it was just— it was like, um, what's a good analogy? It was just—

Josh: it was quick, probably its own good analogy.

Geoff: Yeah, it was just— it was just—

Tommy: so you know it's fucked and you know you're sinking. Yeah.

Geoff: And you can't get no way out.

Tommy: You can't.

Geoff: And you're trying and you're scrambling.

Tommy: Yeah, how quick is that from the time that you had it all and then you got nothing?

Geoff: Um, well, at the end of it, it's real quick, but— and then there's not many people hanging around at that point either. It's pretty lonely.

Tommy: I've jumped off ship.

Geoff: Speaking of hockey pucks, so when I was flying—

Tommy: hockey sticks—

Geoff: so, you know, but this, this is the hockey puck. Yeah, yes, yes. Uh, you know, my mobile phone looked a bit like the Christmas tree. New Year's Eve, it was lighting up all the time, wasn't it? But, um, but when it went pear-shaped, I had to call Telstra to see if it was still working.

Tommy: No one was.

Geoff: No, I was pretty lonely. And but that was part of the journey. Good, because I, I didn't have— because I was a fuckwit. I was a fuckwit. You see, this is what people got to realize. If your life's not working, I've got a really good process. I've got a two-step model. Step— go walk into the bathroom look in the mirror and repeat steps 1 and 2. Yeah, it's that fucking simple. If you like— if your life's not working, own it. So don't fucking blame everyone else. I was a massive wanker. I look back at my— I wanted, and I had massive— my whole life I was hanging around massive wankers, you know. It was, it was just— you attract what you are, not what you want. Look at the people in my life now, the people coming back around. They're fucking awesome. They're good people. Getting the Jout Method started with no money Like, I looked at my bank account the other day, and— but here's a good one for you. $64 in the bank account I had, right? Yeah, here's a good one.

Josh: You're using ING. Have you read Barefoot Optimizer? Yeah, Barefoot Investor. Yeah, that's a good book.

Geoff: I gotta read it. I've got a bit of cash.

Josh: I've got a good— I've got a copy. I'll give you a copy. We'll send you one because, fuck, that is such a good book. You have like different—

Geoff: okay, please, that'd be good.

Josh: Yeah, it's great.

Geoff: But what was I saying? We're talking about looking at the bank account, $64. Um, oh, the Jout Method, getting going again. So mate, so getting— I believe in what I'm doing so much. And for me, I said this because someone, one of the girls in the conference yesterday, she said it would have been so easy for you to just keep drinking like everyone else does, but that's not acceptable for me. Like, I want to raise my standards, right? So that's not— I'm not— it's unacceptable to be a I don't want to be a fucking alcoholic for the rest of my life. And in Australia, there's a lot of people who are. They won't own it. I don't want to live my life through a drunk lens. I want to— I want to live more. So now with the Jout Method, people like my graphic designer, the photographer— like, there's about 7 people who are all at the top of their— they work for free. They fucking do it for free because they believe. Yeah, my designer's probably worked he's probably done about $30 grand worth of work that just— he just believes he wants. My old media buyer, the— these people that, you know, in some ways I really let them down years ago with a lot of debt.

Tommy: And, and, um, but maybe you weren't such a fuckwit.

Josh: There's some people coming, people are coming back.

Tommy: And I guess generosity, the— you're right, yeah, spirit that you've got.

Geoff: There was always a good spirit and energy and drive, um, but there was just a big ego around it. As well. But yeah, I appreciate that what you say then, that is true, because people aren't coming back if you're, if you're actually real. Yeah.

Josh: Would you, would you worry, say, with building the Jowett Method and all that sort of thing now, do you worry and have moments of saying, uh, Jeff, are you going back to your ways?

Geoff: All the time.

Josh: Yeah.

Geoff: So not, not worry, but like, I'm very vigilant. So if I ever made a lot of money again, mate, I'd never buy a flash car. Now what? Nothing wrong, because I'm so aware of my traits. I don't want to go down that slippery slope. I don't want to— comparison thief of joy. Yeah, you know, I'm just so— I think it's always under the surface. I've got to catch myself. I catch myself all the time, like someone doing really well and I'm still really struggling. No, be happy for that person. And I am happy for them, but I can still get that, oh, 'Come on, Jeff,' like there's that.

Josh: And it's all— and the interesting thing too is the observation is like you, there is still that next thing. You still like, there is that level of forward thinking. How do you control— how can you be forward thinking and contain anxiety?

Geoff: Another awesome question. So these are daily work-ons for me, right? You're— I think you're inside my head because for me with the JOUT Method, you know, as a few people go, 'Look, I'd like to invest. I'm really in successful people, but I don't think I'm— I'm not ready to get married.' I'm again. I don't think I want a partner. Um, so yeah, it's, it's— and I'm very good— I'm not great at details, so I'm having to do a lot of the stuff myself that I'm not great at. But I don't want to go down the same path again, so I'm, I'm, I'm hyper-conservative now about— I'll keep the handbrake on. And because I just don't want to get— I just don't want to fuck it up again. And I—

Tommy: you told me you're doing all the admin shit and it was doing your head in. It's almost humbling though, it seems, for you.

Geoff: Um, it's very humbling and rewarding. Yeah, like I'm learning how to use these on like this, uh, Kajabi course building platform thing that limiting beliefs I used to tell myself, I can't do this, I can't do that, I don't have the detail, I don't—

Tommy: I do.

Geoff: Just fucking put the phone down, lock yourself. I get up, I'll tell you what I do, I get up at 4 AM Monday to Friday. Well, most people are like I got my— most people can't get their head—

Josh: what time do you go to bed?

Geoff: 9.

Josh: Okay, about 9.

Geoff: Yeah, yeah. So Mark Burris, so you'd probably know, right? So Mark trains at City Gym. I really admire Mark, and we've got quite a few mutual friends. And, you know, he's actually had a really big impact on me in the last couple of months because he talks a lot to me about his routine and what he does. And, you know, I'm like, mate, if fucking that's what you do. So I seek out people I want to be like. Yeah. And I— and I— poor bloke, I probably harass him a bit at the gym. He's like, fuck, and here comes that prick again.

Josh: Fuck off.

Geoff: G'day, mate.

Tommy: How are you?

Geoff: Hey, Champion, what's doing? But I learn a lot from— I, I, and I tell him.

Josh: Yeah.

Geoff: So we've had some really good conversations because I, I lead with my, you know, vulnerability. And he— I just put him on such a pedestal of strength. And he's even said to me, he goes, mate, if I don't go to the gym every day, I struggle. I'm like, what, really?

Josh: You?

Geoff: Yeah, absolutely.

Tommy: Do you think you've done it almost backwards? Because I see people who it takes years for them to get success, whatever that looks like, but they're going through all these moments where it's— it seems there's been a bit of a reverse. You've hit it big early and now you're learning these almost painless things.

Geoff: You've hit the nail on the head. Yeah, because I did. Because what I do, I, I, I— it's such a gay— it's such a wanky word. But I'll use it anyway. But like, I've always been that sort of visionary. Like, I can look at an industry and look at it different and get it and find a gap and get it to go. You know, we did that with Vision, did it with Body Trim, did it with Medical Weight Loss, you know. So, and then I'll find the— and then I'll find the execution team, I'll find the, the people to, to get the detail done. So big idea, get it going, write some ads, get excited. And not learn all the basics, man. I hadn't paid a Telstra bill for 15 years, mate. So when I went bust— so I went bust previously having full-time PAs, full-time cleaners, full-time everything. To me, literally— and I was engaged, and that, you know, ended as well. So, um, fuck, mate, it was pretty lonely, me and two dogs. If I didn't have the two dogs, pretty sure I would have fucking pulled the plug.

Josh: And so the relationships that you had along— like, you Obviously, talking now about you and your journey, obviously there's a lot of people involved. If, you know, you're in a supermarket and you see some of the people who are in your life at that point, what's the feeling that you get when you see someone? Is it, you know, do you feel embarrassed? Have you accepted what's happened?

Geoff: Oh, now?

Josh: Yeah.

Geoff: No, all of that I did for so long. Now I don't, because it's— I don't. And that is freedom. It's not power, it's freedom. And I guess that— well, I guess that creates power. But I, I'm proud of the person I'm becoming, you know. I'm living my values. I don't just— I don't just talk about them. And the quality of people in my life and, and people that I'm attracting and the friendships I'm building and the way I live my— so now Um, and I own— yeah, there's no one that— it's a really nice feeling. Like, there's still— so the only fear for me is I've got to pay the rent this month. I've got to, you know, really basic stuff, which I know in time will improve. But I've also got a probably a bit of PTSD because, yeah, you know, everything that did go through a lot. Yeah, it fucking buckled me, mate. You know, like, for a period there when the fuck— when we had administrators and all that stuff going on phone rang or whatever, and you fucking anxiety, and oh God, it was horrendous, it was horrendous. And I made a lot of sort of rookie mistakes early on. I didn't understand the finances of business either because I jumped in. My Andrew, legend at Vision, he was an accountant, so I did my bit, he did his. Vision went through the roof. Yeah, the next, the next business we had CFOs pretty much straight away. I had no fucking idea. So I was blind to a lot of that, and then it comes crashing down and it's on you.

Tommy: What do you think about the entrepreneur landscape now? I know you— have you just joined LinkedIn? Because you messaged me.

Josh: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Tommy: I got a message. I thought, oh, Jeffo's on LinkedIn now. But like, you look at LinkedIn, Josh and I talk a lot about it, and you're seeing the promotion, the self-promotion, the almost everything you're talking about, this highly successful world, money-driven It's all what people are selling now.

Geoff: What do you think about it, Tommy? I'll tell you, it's a really interesting topic. I, I cringe. I cringe. And it's funny because, because I'm— I'd go one step further, like, if I could make money— I hate self-promotion now. I fucking cringe. And I'm having to put myself out there to try and build this community, which I believe is for the greater good of helping the members. But everyone's like, fuck, you know, mate, there's just Everyone just wants their 5 seconds of fame out there, and, and some people should have it. Like, it was funny with you blokes. I met Tommy back in 2016, and I just really gelled with him, and I thought, fuck, this guy's got the right— it's good. You gotta— you got good stuff to talk about, and I really think it's funny and engaging, and I watch your stuff. You guys should be doing what you're doing. Yeah, but 99% of people should just get the fuck off social media with their bullshit. No one gives a fuck. You're not talent.

Josh: Yeah, well, you just— I think that you need to come with it with purpose. And for Tommy and I, it's about, you know, scaling friendship and mateship and realising that, you know, we were, you know, two business owners doing our thing separately. And it's a lonely path when you're, you know, when you're doing— when you're a small business, you're a service business, you're doing it on your own. And so, this started off with just something that we could do every single weekday to have a chat., and then all of our other mates who are sitting at their computer, graphic designers doing their work, they can listen to it. And so now we're, you know, slowly—

Geoff: the difference with you blokes is, again, this is where I think that the talent piece— like, most, most— there's a lot of, like, it just breeds narcissism, the social media, a lot of it. And people just want to get themselves out there, but you guys are adding value because it's entertainment. I'm watching, I get entertained when I watch what you, what you guys are doing and all your skits that you do. It's like, this is fucking really— actually, it's very clever.

Tommy: It's clever. Maybe it's the runner or the kid who wants to be a, you know, under 10-second 100-meter sprinter. They can't do any more than 15, any less than 15.

Josh: Well, I think so.

Tommy: They're trying to be this person that they're not.

Josh: Well, I think it's— I don't even think it's that. I think what it is is—

Tommy: Oh, he's gonna one-up my analogy. No, he's got good ones though, don't you worry.

Josh: Because I think the thing is that I don't think it's about them necessarily not being the talent or being able to do it. The thing is that they're rocking up on the first day of going for a run and trying to run a 100-meter sprint in a competition, and they haven't done any of the training and the work and the vision and asking the why. And so because we were able to lead with the why and what we're doing, then it helps us filter around why we're doing it. There's some of the things we're not— Tommy and I say that we're not— this isn't a radio show, which means you don't have to be these 2-minute fast breaks where you just say something funny and go to a song or whatever. We can have deep conversation, we can be authentic, we can be honest. And with having time, having an hour to speak with you, we get to know Jeffo through the whole storey rather than getting the quick 2-minute bit of you. And because of the other thing too is people are really good at talking 2-minute bites. Your 2-minute bite would be doing your gear about, you know, the morning show and the protein and all that sort of thing. And we fucking had that fun, but then we can go into the real honest, authentic stuff.

Tommy: You get a real sense. Of who you are.

Josh: Yeah, from that.

Geoff: Yeah, no, absolutely.

Josh: It's good.

Geoff: So entrepreneur landscape, I think, um, mate, everybody these days supposedly an entrepreneur, and it's just a funny— it's just, it's the world's gone mad. Like, it's fucking madness out there. And because at 41, like, back in the early days when we were starting the gyms, there was no social media. There was, um, you know, you, you had to really chisel away a lot more. Now you're whack an ebook together and whatever, and people are— it's just, it's just different. And everybody, everybody thinks they can be killing it overnight. Yeah, but here's the thing about that. If you do kill it overnight in business, you haven't done the work on yourself, so you're gonna fuck it because the business will expand and contract back to the size of the leader.

Josh: Yeah.

Geoff: So if you haven't done the work on you, you are gonna fuck yourself. One way or another. Now you might end up with heaps of money, but you're going to be miserable because you got— so you can't, you can't— the universe, it doesn't work that way. You just can't do that. So we live in this microwave society, instant success gratification, all of that sort of jazz. And people are— their expectation is, I'll just start some sort of e-commerce, be rich in fucking 6 months, and sell it to, I don't know, fucking Google or something, and, and there's a billion bucks. And it's just— and so everyone, I don't know, the whole thing's It's so different now. And look at LinkedIn, and I can't get my head around any of it. It's— I'm like, if I could make it to the point. Yeah, like, I love helping people lose weight, but I fucking hate advertising and marketing these days, and it makes me cringe. It's just, it's all bullshit.

Josh: Well, what did you think about what you were selling? Because you talk about the— some of those words that you use to describe, you know, getting you know, fit or losing weight, you know. How do you reconcile that now when you talk about purpose and you think about what you were— how you were selling?

Geoff: The good thing back then, what I was selling was very genuine. So I used— you got to use a lot of benefit words in, in one aspect, otherwise people aren't interested. But because it was DVDs and coaching, the end product was very good.

Josh: So you had to, you had to get them in on the 'you're going to look great' and it's a vanity piece, and then it's like all right, strip that all away. Now let's get serious.

Geoff: You had to get them in on, on benefit because no one wants to do the work. And that's where it's interesting with what I'm doing now, because it's like, you got to do the fucking work.

Josh: Yeah.

Geoff: And that's— so it's not going to be a massive product because you've got to do work. You've got to— what, you've got to cheque in with live coaching morning and night? Like, most people aren't going to do that. Most people aren't going to step into their mistakes. Most people aren't going to own their shit. Most people are just going to blame others for the rest of their life. So, but I'm not compromising that anymore.

Tommy: And if I can't get this to work my way I will—

Geoff: I literally, I've already put feelers out there to go and get a job like working with horses or something. I'm, I'm done. Yeah, I'm, I'm fucking done with the bullshit. Yeah, I am done with the bullshit. And that's not a, you know, I'm not, not a depressing thing to say, but the hype and the madness that is out there these days— and good on Facebook, you can't do before and after pictures Yeah, on Facebook.

Tommy: What do you mean?

Geoff: You can't— when you do paid advertising on Facebook, uh, they won't—

Josh: they won't let you—

Geoff: because everyone's a fucking shonk.

Josh: Yeah.

Geoff: So my before and after pictures— and I will go to the grave with this— every single before and after picture that I used at Body Trim and I use at the Jowett Method— did Body Trim, does the Jowett Method— they're real. But mate, 90% of people on Facebook, they were fucking bodgy. So Facebook, good on them, they're like, that is good, no more before and after pictures. Paid advertising. So, but for me, I've got a woman, she's 67 years old, she lost 95 kilos with me over 5 years. I can't use her images. I can use her after photo, but I can't showcase how powerful this is visually because of all the shonks out there that actually do the wrong thing. That's, that's kind of the world we live in.

Josh: Yeah. With the 2 years ago to now, what has what has helped you get out of that emotional hole?

Geoff: Um, probably AA in the early days, because it made me look at myself and just stop, stop, stop trying to compete with everyone. Come back down, connect, help other people, just take time to breathe. I was always in a hurry, gotta get back up, gotta get back up, got it. No, you don't. No, you don't. No one cares. Yeah, no one cares, mate.

Tommy: I even got that vibe from you when we first met. Yeah, you'd had 7 coffees. Yeah, you met me for your 8th, and it seemed like, yeah, you're ready for the next thing. Yeah, it's very interesting. I mean, how do you quit? How do you— when you're in— when you're an addict and you're depressed and you got nothing, how do you then quit booze at that point, or then quit drugs?

Geoff: Um, It's a great question. Why? I think I was ready to neck myself. So, um, it's either neck yourself or, or, um, pull your finger out.

Josh: Yeah.

Geoff: And I, and I ended up in AA, and I did that for a while, and, and I just, I gotta, I, I stopped. I got off myself. So you get into those rooms and you start looking at other people and you just, you just sit with it. I learned to sit with where I was at and, um, without so much judgement and guilt and shame. And just, yeah, I'm just— here's where I am. And mate, it was a slow process. It was get up, fucking go to the 7 AM Stanley Street meetings for Narcotics Anonymous, and away I went. And, um, but mate, it, you know, at the end of— at the back of that is, is magic and joy. And, uh, but, but how do you— I don't— if there was not one thing, it was a desire. I think there's a spiritual piece to it as well. Like, I'm not, um—

Josh: was that from AA's stuff that you got that spiritual thing, or did you—

Geoff: I think that—

Josh: I don't know, because it's like got a religion, it's got a whole Christian power stuff to it.

Geoff: Yeah, yeah. Look, I'm not Christian, um, at all. I'm not religious at all.

Josh: Spiritual?

Geoff: Yeah. Yeah, I'll take— I, I study Buddhism. Uh, I, I like a lot of the stuff in the Bible, but I, you know, I'm not Christian. I think Jesus Christ was awesome. Don't know if it was— if he was God's son, not sure about that.

Josh: But did you ever do one-on-one therapy or anything like that?

Geoff: Yeah, I did. I worked with a lady in Tasmania who, um, Yeah, she was very, very good. Sort of a life coach. She helped me with some stuff.

Tommy: Yeah, I said to my mate who has gone through AA, still— I mean, he's still a part of it— I said, I sent him a text the other week and I said, you were the person that you're meant to be. He, the way he acts now, it's like he's so in a line with who he— a true, the true sense of who this person is. Do you feel that's something that you're doing?

Geoff: Yes, I really do, mate. And, and even now looking at maybe, do I do I partner with someone in this? A lot of people— I don't want to shitcan business people, but like a lot of business people, they're all about the buck and that's why they're good at business. And I just can't fucking be associated with that anymore. So for me now, I'd rather have it really small and just scrape by but not compromise anything. And, and it's a really different operating system for me compared to what it was. And like, I ride horses on the weekend up at Glenworth Valley in Sydney. And but the feeling of riding horses and then standing with the horses and they come and sort of look, you know, you've got this bond with the horse and he comes and rubs his head on your back after you've ridden for an hour. And you can't put fucking— you can't put a price on that, you know. And I'll look at it, you know, Mykonos, Ibiza, fucking blah blah blah, great, lovely. I couldn't think of anything fucking worse. Yeah, just give me peace and calm Give me some animals. I just— it's so fucking different. Yeah, but, but I, I don't think without a spiritual awakening I couldn't be where I am, because it's— there's more to what we— I believe there's more to what we are, you know, spiritual beings having a human experience, as the saying goes. There's more to this than just the meat carcass that we get around in, you know. We, um, I don't know all about what happens, but I do know that there's more going on than we see. And I think for whatever reason, I was open to that, and I've started down a path of that.

Josh: Do you have people who were in your life when you were going through hard times that are still hurt, who say things like, 'You're the same fucking Jeff,' that type of— and how do you deal with that?

Geoff: No, it's real. No, no one really, because it's, um, it's probably a good thing. Yeah, no, no, because the people— again, I get out of AA, so all the people where I believe I was in the wrong, I fucking called them up and said, listen. And it's funny because like even at Vision, Andrew— and he wouldn't mind me saying this— I text him and, you know, I put this fucking really long-winded text together and I'm like, I'm sorry for fucking— and Andrew's like, what are you talking about? Yeah, fucking mate, we both fucked that up, that partnership, and you did heaps of Vision wouldn't be around without you. You stopped being fucking— so it's interesting. I probably, I was probably a bit addicted to that process as well. I went and apologised to fucking every man and his dog.

Tommy: No, so did my mate, right? Yeah, it's a bit over cathartic for, for him though. I see that.

Geoff: Yeah, it was good. But, but now, but literally even, and I, I could, I can clearly see the part I played in all the big fuck-ups, whereas I could not for quite some time. It was like, this bloke fucked me. This is, yeah, mate. But, but you know what, everyone is just doing their best at the time.

Josh: Yeah.

Geoff: And you know, when I— he fucked— he's just doing his best. He's got his own— he's not doing it to fuck you, he's just got his own stuff. But I took it as ego.

Josh: Yeah.

Geoff: How could you do that to me?

Tommy: Yeah.

Geoff: But I look back and it's so obvious, you know. Wayne Dyer says, I can see clearly now. Like, I can see clearly.

Tommy: Isn't that a song? Who sang that?

Geoff: Yeah. I can see clearly now, the rain is gone.

Josh: Now we're gonna have to to pay some sort of licencing or whatever.

Tommy: Jeff, you've had a fascinating journey, mate.

Josh: It's been fun.

Geoff: And at 40, I feel like I've got an amazing platform to do something great with my life for the right reasons. For the right reasons. And it's— I, I say ambition, not ego. I've got the ambition, but I'm not doing it. And it's really— he's— I'll say this quickly, that good— a mate of mine from the party days, here's a good one, James. He lives in, in LA now. He married a movie producer and he's a really, really charismatic guy and still partying, obviously lives in LA a little bit. But, but, um, yeah, he parties. Yeah, he does. Yeah, he's not teetotaling like me, but, but he's not an addict, you know. So people who can party a bit, good luck to them. Yeah, if you want to blow the doors off once a month, good luck to you. I just can't pull up. Yeah, but you know, there's a month, boom, I'm into the mountain. Yeah, but He reached out to me on Facebook because I do a lot of free videos, and I did, and he's, and he's like, you are a different person. Like, he goes, mate, we had fun together, he goes, but fuck, this is awesome what you're doing, Geoffro. His name's James. And, um, and so anyway, he's like, mate, I want to get some of your stuff over here because he is, he's quite Hollywood, and, and he's, he's a gay guy, married a movie producer over there, and doing— he's great, a really nice guy. But it was like I had zero interest in any of— I'm just doing what I want to do. But because it's authentic, right? Because, mate, I believe what you said. That, yes, you know the difference now. He goes, when I watch your videos now, I believe you. Really powerful, right? So because you always had the chat, but I believe you now. Something— a lot's changed. So, and he knew me from, from back in the day. So he, he went off and chopped up a showreel and started shopping it around over there. And I've had I'm sure— I don't think anything's going to happen, but of it, but I've got no— I'm not interested in that anymore. When I wanted to be famous, oh, that'd be my dream.

Josh: Yeah, yeah.

Geoff: If anything ever does happen, I'm not chasing anything. I just want to help a few people, do my best, ride my horses, walk my dogs. Mate, these days, you know, I'd love the idea of actually having a relationship, getting married, and having some kids. I could never cobble that together back in the day.

Josh: Yeah. What do you tell yourself every day? What do you remind yourself?

Geoff: Um, to stay present, not, not to cave my head in, like let go of the past, just let go. Because for a long time it'll be like, how did you have a $30 million business and go broke? That was just— how have you fucked it up? How am I here? And every time I had to do admin, how the fuck am I doing this?

Tommy: Fuck, fuck.

Geoff: It was just, mate, get over yourself.

Josh: Yeah, it's beautiful.

Geoff: Yeah, so that was a— that took a year. No, that took Stuff takes time. That took a year to get over that. So what each, each day— awareness, humility, patience. I have to tell myself that every day. Alignment.

Josh: Like, like, um, do you do this in a controlled way, or are these just like— do you, do you journal? Do you write things down? Do you say it in the mirror? Like, how do you actually make sure that you—

Geoff: what works? That's why I have to get up at 4 AM. I have to have a routine, really, really good routine. So I don't drink, obviously don't take any drugs, I don't hang out with dickheads. Like, I— there's a whole bunch of stuff. And if Jeff Jowett does that, he's effective. If he's not, he struggles. So I get up really early, I've got a 24-hour cafe just down the road, I go and have a coffee, walk down to the gym, I train, I do a live coaching session at 7 with my members, I walk the dogs, and then I just— it is repetitive. It is everything I used to hate. Now it is just the repetition And, and, but I find joy in, in moments during the day. But I have to do like, I'll sit down first thing in the morning with a notepad and I'll map out my day early, and I'll just— I want to get up early and get going. Like, I've just got to do a lot of things right to stay good.

Tommy: How hard is that?

Geoff: It gets easier every day.

Tommy: Is it?

Geoff: Yes. That's a good— like, mate, what do they say? What starts out hard gets easy. Repetition's the mother of skill, all of that stuff. So it was really hard. Now I sleep in Monday mornings 4:30. Like, it's— you get good at what you do. And I couldn't get up at 4 AM. I want to have a fucking good life. I don't want to be depressed. I don't want to be anxious. So that's what it takes. Like, it takes time to build a quality life. And you gotta— I wanna— yeah, Matt McConaughey talked about this in an Oscars speech years ago. Like, he, he wanted to— he was his own hero 10 years from now. Like, what would 50-year-old Jeff do now, and you've got to be that person now, otherwise you're never going to create that life. Like, everyone wants that life, but they don't do the work. They cut corners and they compromise their values, and then they wonder why they got shafted. Well, because it's fucking what you do. Yeah, you get what you are. So you've got to live with integrity, raise your standards. And but none of it's a chore anymore, you know. And if I look at my— like, me not drinking, going to bed last night on a Saturday night in Melbourne at a conference at 9:30. It's just fucking what I do.

Tommy: Did you get up at 4 today?

Geoff: No, week, because I'm a bit crook as well at the minute. But I, um, 6.

Josh: Yeah, 6 on a Sunday.

Geoff: Yes, I get up at 6 on a Sunday. It's Saturday, so I pretty much get up at 6. No alarm, I just wake up.

Josh: Yeah, great.

Geoff: I'm sleeping at 10, like. But even when you, when you, when you're an alcoholic and you got alcohol withdrawals, and that fueled, like, my alcohol withdrawals, I used to sit in hotels I'd have withdrawals. I'd drink the minibar dry just so I could go back to sleep.

Tommy: You've got alcohol in this room?

Geoff: Of course, yeah, I don't have a problem. No dramas. And the thing is, imagine that though, drinking the minibar dry but just to be able to stop the withdraw— that was the life I lived.

Josh: But it was— it's relatable in the sense of even like, um, being overweight and food, right? Like, I remember having those same vibes with— but instead of the booze, it's the M&Ms.

Geoff: And yes. And that, that point is, is so powerful. So the Jowett Method, this new weight loss community that I've got, is all— if I wasn't an alcoholic, didn't go bankrupt, didn't fuck everything, there'd be no Jowett Method. It's all come out of my pain and my learning, because food— so I say food, alcohol, drugs. Russell Brand, same. External feel-goods medicating internal pain. And the internal pain comes out of not living your values, your purpose, No connection. Pain you medicate with food, alcohol, drugs, gambling, sex, all of the above. And there's no joy, there's no long-term in that. But food addicts, emotional eaters, comfort eaters, they're medicating pain. Alcohol, I was medicating pain. I wasn't connecting. I didn't have purpose in my life. I'd compromised my values and a bottle of Johnnie Walker made it okay.

Tommy: We could do a whole episode just on food and—

Josh: yeah, absolutely. Exercise. And we've got to get you on again at some point. I'd love to hop up to Sydney for a little trip. That'd be great. Jeff Jowett, thanks so much.

Geoff: Thanks guys, you guys are inspiring me. I love it. Thank you.

Josh: It's The Daily Talk Show. Send us your emails, hi@thedailytalkshow.com. Catch you later.

Tommy: If you've got any, uh, um, questions for Jeff.

Josh: Yeah, because we'll, um, for next episode. Absolutely. Have a good one.

Tommy: Ciao.