#110 – Your emails/

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Cross face

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conversation sometimes worth recording with Josh Johnson and Tommy Jenkins Episode

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Episode 110. I was struck at the start. Yeah.

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How are we good, man? Are you going? Yeah. Yeah.

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Good. That's good.

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I sound like a piece of shit. Why? Because your voice just minnows and I couldn't I lost my voice over the weekend that that was weird. Isn't it? Interesting? Like some people have that as their constant voice? What? Losing your voice? Yeah. Like the especially. What is it about like, like, cycle like, you know, the, the people who sit at the like, stand at the front of cycling classes or aerobics. They have that, like croaky spirit. Yes. Because they yelling Yeah, you know,

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I used to get a lot when I got on the way can get paste and then feel horrible. And Monday that must have been yelling in bars. You've never had that. No,

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I mean, it was worse when you could smoke in nightclubs. Yeah, that was a rebel man. I remember being in Romania. And you could they could smoke everywhere in do what you want. Yeah. And I just I couldn't handle it. It was like, right. Like, I wouldn't go to these venues anyway, like, in a normal like setting outside, you know, in my own hometown. But yeah, it was Christ and we have it. Well, if you're listening for the first time, we've got an email address high at the daily talk. show.com. Man, it is gone off in the last week. I'm not good. When it comes to email. It's one of the things that with my trip, I want to like have a big reset. And what do

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you mean good. I had to find good it. We're in a Skype. I had lying. Yeah, I had 140 unread emails last week. You send me a screen grab of your phone and had like 200 and I've and I've written back and gross before to you. But you said it was a different email account probably is how many emails addresses have you got? You have

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like six or seven. So some of them are coming from like the, the Melbourne geek days, like PR people saying, hey, Josh, we test out this product. But no, it's the the high at the daily talk show. email address. Well, if you send something through, we sometimes we we don't get back to you on email. But we get back to you on the show. Yeah,

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we get back to everybody on the show.

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Because we haven't had any because we've had the guests on, we haven't been doing that. So for the last week, we haven't done any any sort of, not shout outs but sort of referencing the email. We get

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a really good one from when now. This is someone you know, yeah. You've told the story of how you met randomly. I don't know if I have. Yes. Is the one from San Francisco. No, it's no it's not.

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It's not that one. No. So San Francisco that Sara Lee that you're that guy went and I met at a lean filmmaking meetup. She was working at the time at map which is Melbourne Uni startup acceleration program. Aren't you glad you asked? Yeah. Well, I remember you telling me and I tuned out and just assumed it was the friend Sarah No. So no, but I thought that was when ya know. So when wins in Canada now. So she's Australian grew up in Melbourne. And she's doing like, a year or so in Canada. But she pivoted from doing the whole startup thing just like screw this, I'm going to do video so that gives you the context in which well she sent through and the title of it was binge listening. Women in radio gamble on strategy. Yeah.

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And I mean, that was quite a download episodes, women radio. That was someone in Australia in the radio scene. Female wrote an article and we kind of just chatted about it, but it was kind of before it really blew up. Yeah, that I wouldn't try to take credit but we did discuss it likely discuss most things Josh and I, but I just want to read you this email from when I think you have some good thoughts around it. And I know that we have a few people that listen that are kind of in the creative space. Sure. Hi, Josh. And Tommy. I just had a two hour binge session of listening to your show was playing Candy Crush, really enjoy it. Thanks for the therapy. The women in radio episode made me think about a strategic gamble I've been pondering specifically related to unconscious bias. Yeah, which we've got into in a few episodes.

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This week, I've been doing some camera operating work, the Banff world media festival trade showing the Canadian TV industry looking around at all the media crew I'm literally the only woman in AV and one of maybe half a dozen Asian people on the entire crew of probably almost 100 at the same time. All but two people producing programming and PR teams a women are across junior and senior roles. Maybe they just the ladies are smarter than having to stand up all day boy camera, I think I think naturally Yeah, a lot of the PR roles and stuff like that. It's a very women sort of focused industry female focused. Yeah, so she said, coincidentally, I had received advice from a Docker director in the form of an off handed comment to not let them push me into a producing role. And to stay behind the camera in a technical role. Here's the catch. I don't particularly enjoy camera Ops, I find that pretty boring and find it's mostly mindless, manual labor. However, for the purpose of product differentiate differentiation and scarcity. myself as the product in this field that is increasingly offering more and more affirmation affirmative action initiatives to women, I'm thinking that I should stay in a camera roll and market myself as tech crew, I think it will get me more sit hours more quickly than I'm going to get down the producer side. And I'll have less to compete with meaning less than other women, less women to compete with, I want to I want set hours to understand how the machinery the product works. So then I eventually can go back to producing and work and not be on the ground doing physical labor. So essentially, she wants to be a producer. Yeah, but she's thinking maybe I take the gamble and be a Av. Yeah, video person wins. very strategic, I think which you are, too. So I think this is why she's reached out Yeah, I think JJ support network

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Well, yeah, I am. I want to preface with whatever I saying, as I

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know, I've started hating shows that are just advice driven, where people that like saying they've got all the answers and all that sort of thing. This is a really interesting, Pat, regarding unconscious bias. I find that men a puzzle to see me behind the camera and have low expectations, which then makes my job easier because it's not hard to exceed their expectations. And then she says that the show runners are also curious as to you know, her being there as a camera operator, and when a higher or two Yeah,

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I mean, I think that it's a

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an interesting place to be, I reckon, it's, it's not a thing of, you know, if you go down the normal path, there is the regular path that people expect and I'm all for doing whatever is the least one is they say least try to try and or whatever they say, what's that word? least walked past Yeah, let you know. Let's break it down it Yeah. But I think I think it's a great idea doing the the sort of technical stuff because once you build up the technical sort of thing, you can then have empathy in a producer role. So I think that it's uh, yeah, people obviously they'll go the real obvious route but all when is it like putting aside or the unconscious bias stuff the female stuff it's just like, it's the question actually use around like, you know, the opportunities that are available and it's like, Okay, if you have the opportunity to work within a company it's like we talked about with radio stuff all the time where it's like people who go into a certain role with the ID that they're going to somehow end up on air well at

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Korea I mean over the years industrial use and then like doctors and university like a clear pathway is what we're saying to a role like a doctor do you need to you hours get you you know, degree and become a doctor creative roles a father few and far between, even if you think it's a, the, the path that you need to follow to get to that creative endeavor might not be the path but it's like what Amy said about this might not be the theme. This might be the thing that gets you to the thing that you want to do. Yeah.

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And so there's there's no 100% on his stuff. I think that the main there's, it's a very hard balance because you don't want to just be doing it because, you know, because of that reaction because of people saying it's unexpected. But there's definitely I think if you put that aside and just look at it purely as a question on Should I take this opportunity? Yeah, I think that that sounds like a great idea why I struggle doing I struggle being that calculated, I would struggle to be in the role if I didn't like it. And I would struggle to how to think, okay, I'm just gonna stick this out for a year or two to get to their what I don't even think the other thing too is, I don't think it's like a year or two strategy. I think it's like a six month strategy. Like, you could find out a lot and learn a lot in the process. And then be I think that if it was a completely different if it's if, when said, are these these opportunities in the catering section, you know, in unit or whatever it is, and I you know, I'm thinking about doing that, then you'd say that from catering to the producing might be a weird jump, but I think that there's a Yeah, there's definitely something in that sort of going crazy,

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like you learn a lot from the School of cowboy Yeah, we jump on and you got no settle and Yeah,

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and I think that's the thing it's the

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as when said it's a great opportunity anytime that you're

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people don't have high expectations put you especially in the learning phase put you in this awesome place. This is just slightly off topic. But I was speaking to somebody about delivering more than you say, you will just kinda like I guess exceeding their expectations of what they're going to get from you. What's under under sell over deliver. But I but I had this moment where I was like, if that is for everything, is there a diminishing return on over delivering all the time because then you feel bad if you're not over delivering? So I was like, for someone I'm working with at the moment. That's what I said to her. I'm To be honest, I'm putting in a lot more than I probably should or wonder, you know, what we've decided on and it's like, I have identified the problem with myself that I put it on to everyone I work with, so I almost feel like it can suck a lot of time out of you by trying to over deliver for everybody. Yeah,

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well, I think you need to communicate it and sort of be really clear when you are going above and beyond because if it becomes because what ends up happening is it becomes the norm. Your actions become the you know, the selling bitch because they're sold on what they got last time versus being like hey, I I've done this thing. This is extra. Yeah. I'm delivering it for this time, and then that rather than it. Just sort of you not mentioning it.

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I mean the thing about a Goldner who is a is established is quite amazing. He's amazing filmmaker. We went to high school together I remember he went to university Swinburne to do film and TV dropped out yeah but was working on films every single weekend Yeah, for free just he was so driven he's like obsessed about the thing he wants to do. Yeah, and he ended up going back to teach kids at that film and TV course Yeah, later on, because he worked his way up to be

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you know, a do pay so like head guy shooting the sheer The thing is the it's being comfortable with the ambiguity of what's happening. So it's like being comfortable with the fact that there is no pathway and I think that this so many things apply you can as an Australian go to a new market and sort of be the shiny new thing and so that's the other part like taking yourself out of the normal environment gives you an opportunity to look at yourself completely different and that's probably the like that's what I love about going to like having traveled to remote parts of Indonesia or Pakistan I enjoy the feeling of the novel like being a novelty it gives you It gives me some Dutch courage yeah all of a sudden it's the same thing with an F was spoken about on the show it's like people who go to London may work in fashion for you and they go from like being an assistant role and then they come in as like the director back email

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readings director back you know, because like I've done yeah, wait, London the bloody Oh, London. They must be good. sang sang all my spare money on pilot. Yeah.

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So thanks. When for the email. Don't know if that was at all. I think it was good. It's awesome. Getting getting emails. We've also we got one from Matty, he he was just basically saying that we shouldn't be so hard on ourselves that were good looking guys. And he found us a found just recently through listening to the the minimalists podcast I gave you a shout out. Yeah, so that was that was that was good. And we also got an email from Danny who is a train driver who discovered us through Trevor Trevor lungs. What I

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love about people emailing is it's not like anyone's giving us the life story. Hi, I'm this person. This, this is this. But we're slowly working out that Danny. You said. Oh, yeah. I suppose. wine. No, no, no. So you know, wine is a wine wine. Also a man. Okay. So you're hearing these little bits and pieces like it? I'm gonna try and drive up. Yeah. Listen to you on the commute. Yeah, it's it's so good. You don't want to mention wines. A male does

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it? I thought that

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was why neither one talk about swearing. Or is that Danny? So Danny? Danny said about the train driving. He said that

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basically not to not to endure. You swearing when I said I'll turn it back. Yeah,

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he's not into it. Because I was affected by saying

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mission. Please keep up with the swearing. I'm a trained driver. And it's the only language I understand. Fuck. Tommy swearing. Ben. I

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if you've listened to the Craig Harper episode, and just giving context of who wrote this, but Craig put something on his Instagram account. And he's one of the most proficient swear as I know my world and he successful so fuck off. But he would have a post on his instead of the other day if I swear, and Bill is offended. But Bobby is not. is the official a byproduct of my swearing or bills, thinking Yep. It's fucking Bill

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Nye like that. But obviously, we're connecting and you might lose a few back. Yeah. So wine wrote through and he was He's my He's my relative from July. Yes. Yes. Good. Good. Memory.

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train driver. Yeah, you've you mixing any item one style

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wine Episode 1040 dark 30. I was mentioning that I got on a summer be lot and deep dive watching some documentary. It was saying that in military terminology, using 24 hour clock 9am would be 09 hundred hours or just 09 hundred. And he said from his experience zero. Dark 30 was a general reference to any time between midnight and don't like during the doc out was he said that often when someone would die? What time something was meant to be carrying. We would also use Oh, too early, or if it was really early, like two or 3am. Oh, to fucking early as a generic time reference

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was in the army. Yeah, you know,

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I don't know anything on that. But yeah, so

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in trade in

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May. Well, this is this about awesome. We're getting all these emails from Iran. We got an email from still saw as well. Okay, Steve,

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he said that saying it's national toasty day on June 28. Maybe you guys can talk about your favorite feelings in your toasty.

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Maybe it's him? And he said, maybe it's Sam and cheese? I think it means him. Yeah.

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So and also today. We also had

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Kareena who works in the office next door came in and said, Listen to the show. We start talking about stickers. I'm trying to get stickers for the talk shows. Good.

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Kareena Thank you. You've put a rocket up. Josh has asked. He's been on a sticker website all morning. Trying to trying

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to buy these days where we're going to work it out. Finally, George emailed us last week about this panic button, also known as the right way. So which we spoke about, I think maybe a week and a half ago. Well, I

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came into the office and I saw her on Riley who works out of here. I saw on a bag. This thing's a little dongle. Yeah, what is that? What's that hanging off your back to this? And she pulls it

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You're like a really glad you said right? whistle Yeah, yeah. And so my, my instant reaction at a time was like to apologize. The fact that she had to have that song it on you. I was trying to get you to work out what are these and you got it

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straight away. Like it's some kind of either not hold up or a panic button which I got it well so the thing The way it works is rather than it being a button like you pull it for the siren to go off but anyway, George was

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a mountain and he said that he's girlfriend was wondering way Get up from because she does walking around Brunswick, and it was that was only a couple of days before you're a DC Dixon was raped and murdered in Melbourne. And so like we were talking, we spoke on Friday morning before we recorded and will and will reading the articles and just to just have the night before dinner. Yeah. And so we'll just in this place where we were thinking like you're saying, how fucked up it is, you? You know you like I was thinking

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about her. And she was a comedian, you know, up and coming comedian. And I'd recently been to open mics where, you know, watching people perform, I could really sort of, you know, paint that picture. This is a person that we know these you know, we would probably have mutual friends. This is close to home or date. Yeah, the details make it really, really real. When you say that she messaged you might say I'm nearly home. Yeah,

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I'm nearly home safe. Yeah. And then.

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And so I don't think like so to answer George's question. I've emailed him back, but we I asked her Riley

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last week. And she couldn't remember she

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pulled off a Facebook ad. Yeah,

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but I've found a on Jay car. Like I typed in the description of what it was. And I found it so it's cold that 100 day Bay which would be like decibel red mini personal alarm with torch but yeah, it's it's that like, brain has been over the weekend just being seeing all of these things pop up on social media. well as in people talking about what happened. Yeah. And it's,

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um, well, if you're not from Australia, and maybe even Melbourne. I don't know if this travels to Sydney, like, I'm sure they're hearing about it. So I'm like, Well,

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I guess Lisa Wilkins has moved to Melbourne. Yeah, I mean, things are definitely proximity, like, you'd be hearing about it more in Melbourne. Yeah. And, and thinking about a lot more. But if you're from overseas, there was a woman years ago named jack Ma, who a similar thing happened where she was raped. And it was it was murdered and murdered. And there was thousands of people protesting down a straight I mean, they will just suck a vigil walking down a street, and it made a lot of noise. And, and I guess people are feeling the effects of, you know, it's something of similar nature happening again, in the same city? Well, I think the, what I take from it is just this,

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this need for change, and not not necessarily knowing the answers, like not knowing what and realizing the Yeah, and we will, we spoke a lot about it around the privilege that that we have, and that was in the sense of,

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I was walking this morning, you know, 6am in the dark in Collingwood. And the light didn't turn green for me to go on huddle streets, I ended up walking down sort of a smaller, straight and I was thinking I'm like, you know, this is a privilege that I have that I don't have to walk in the light in the main street that I feel like, I can walk down a side street without being raped and murdered. And so yeah, it's a, you know,

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you reflect it back to

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your own sort of world. And, you know, you're a DC was in our world, she was sort of, you know, in the same suburb, a kilometer away from where we are, it's that weird thing of not knowing what to what to do.

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I mean, we, yeah, we don't know what to do. I think that's the signs of everyone is like, we don't know what to do all these people and some fucking asshole went to where it happened, where all the flowers are left and grew something on the ground. Yeah.

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And I think that it's, um, I would I take from it is the, it makes me look closer around in the community of the people around us. And it's, you know,

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I think that the, the thing that happened in the media, which was really bad was it sort of became this sort of women's problem, which was like, okay, like, don't go out at this time. Like, no, like, we need to create a community where anyone can go out and they don't feel like their life is at risk.

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So, yeah, it's a, and I think that it's the reason that I, you know, we, we spoke about it a lot on Friday. And,

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and it was that whole thing of, you know, what do we have have to say, what do we, you know, what, you know, the, one of the things that you're really hyper aware of, through being in radio is, you know, talking about something, just for the sake of talking about it and coming across as tokenistic or trying to relate it to you in a way that just doesn't

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what's the job of the media and that was what we were encouraged to do is like if it's topical talk about it. Yeah and that doesn't take into account if you have anything to add so then you become a regurgitation of information which is what I heard it happened last Thursday and on Friday night driving home yeah I heard a lot of people doing that but I think that was what was coming through is outrage and information that is I don't know if it's adding to it or not but yeah it definitely is just how it's dealt with in my point was I don't yeah I'm always concerned about what are we bringing to something and he's the opposite you know not ignoring it but just bringing light to something like on the show is that more beneficial for people and I think the

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problem is I think that reflecting on it all actually it was on it was Thursday night was Thursday that we had the conversation that we had the conversation

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I think that it was the the thing that I've come to realize is it's like it's not a comfortable conversation to have it's not but the thing is that that's how that's the privilege that we have which is the fact that we you know we could say our This doesn't affect us and we can walk the streets and for that reason that you know I you know let's not let's not rock the boat let's not bring it up we don't need to talk about it but the thing is this know this

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we need to to be doing something and I don't know what that I think that the hard thing is that it's we don't know what that is but we don't need to you know I saw some guys comment on some social media posts being like our don't put men all in this you know this basket you know there's good blogs out there but you know this is what was that on though what was the article about you know these uh. These uh. You know it's conversations around what happened right and the thing is that it's not if that's the conversation that you're having you're missing the point because we don't have to worry about being raped and murdered on the straight and so

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within our community there are people that do it's our friends it's our families it's our neighbors it's our partners and so

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I think you know people want and I feel this way the media have a fucking you know something to answer for in terms of contributing to this outrage culture and and what I take from you and listen you're teaching me is around maybe it's not the time and place to bring it out when a woman's just been raped and and I do my bit for outrage culture on in media I talked about it a lot I think but what you're saying is those dudes writing comments on a piece that about a woman regardless of if there is trigger points in that thing for outrage.

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And I think there I think this is this and this is the the bit that gets missed or the the bit that I think that those comments like it's it's not I don't think that there is any like there's no there's no reason within that context to be trying to, to worry about men's exactly my point is the thing my point you know,

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totally not the right place to live in the right it's not that it's not the right place it's not the the right thing to be worried about. Like the thing is that this it's not a thing you know, you know, I talk about things getting out of hand and but I can guarantee you that it's never like I am never worried about that something's gonna go so out of hand something's going to affect me the only thing that could go out of hand is that we somehow solve this like solve this problem I think you're a part of one equation and there's a lot of people out here that are worrying about how far things will get which is okay and i don't agree with us also writing on fucking posts about what about us like that's rich like I get that Yeah,

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I fucking idiot if you do yeah but I think that it's it's the I think that the idea that this is a women's a thing now problem is bullshit. And the thing is that the privilege that we have, you know, doesn't like it's so it's very hard for me to articulate what I'm trying to say

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and this is what you're saying right? And this is why like we didn't speak about it last week was because it was sort of like

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I didn't want I didn't want it to be some sort of show where it doesn't feel like it's it's done any good but I think that what what I'm trying to say is that

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you know, whatever if they if there is like we have a lot of blind spots with all of this stuff so and we've got an audience diverse audience of people who listen to us which I love like I love that we have everything from you know train drivers to having Kareena you like a huge amount of Michele. Yeah, Michele, we've got so many different people who listen to the to the show, I know we just listed three, but we do have more than three got Steve as well. We've got when Yeah,

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look, you know, you brought it up last week about should we talk about it, and it's 100% on people's minds in Melbourne. And so it wasn't even

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should I talk about it? I think what should we bring it to the show, we decide what we're talking about in the show. Yeah, it was it was a question around, I've read all these articles. I've said, I say this, this person, I've heard her story. And I think that we need to say in it, I think we need to say something. And the uncomfortable nature is we don't i don't know what it is that we should be saying. But I'm trying to realize that my little bit of discomfort now. And not knowing what to say doesn't come close to the discomfort of being out on the streets at night, or trying to get home from a gig or trying to, you know, make a life for yourself as a comedian and having to worry about whether your life is on the line.

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So we went there anyway. So we joke around, like,

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I think that it's, um, I think it's important. But yeah, as send us an email high at the daily talk. show.com if there's, you know, around this topic, we we know, Tommy and I both know that we don't have the answers to these things. And, you know, I,

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it has been on my mind constantly, every time I'm walking, I saw someone approaching someone else over, you know, on Sunday night. And I felt like it was sort of a weird situation. So, I just hung around. I don't, it's this weird thing where it's like, trying to work out what, you know, what are we meant to do? And so it's a bit any, any extra perspective and these types of things. This is, um, you know, I want to be I want to be schooled, I want to, I want to know how I can help I think, yeah, we don't have the personal experience in a lot of these areas. But hey, we're

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not over here trying to say that we know we have answers. So

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and I think that the the other thing too about this is it's like it's that friction of you know, there's a current affair shows or there's like, you know, a panel shows in Australia that talk about these issues, and they go from this like, talking about this crazy, you know, horrendous thing to have happened, and then be able to flick a switch and be fun and all that sort of thing. And I I find that really difficult. Yeah, I feel like it's disingenuous. I mean, I think that it's you know, I don't know how to come compartmentalize. I can, I could never, I could never say that we could talk about this topic, and then all of a sudden flick a switch and be like, All right, let's, let's talk about some fun shit. Because I think that this is

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where you're setting yourself a massive trap. Because then we're still no way I think we're done. I've showed on it. Yeah, we're

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done is shifting through 30 minutes. Yeah,

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it's been over 30 minutes. story about the sauna.

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I think like, No, no, I think in all seriousness, like, you know, I think that it's, um, I really do mean that that it's a

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when you look at

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you, you're a this Dixon had a career had a life had friends, family relationships, and that was, you know, that was taken away. And, you know, I know that there's not much that we can do now. But what we can do is put light on the fact that she fucking existed and she was someone who didn't deserve to pass away and you're, I appreciate the sensitivity that you have. Because sometimes I lack those thoughts. Well, I think that it's and I I'm definitely not perfect and I realized that like, I cringe so myself hearing me talk about this stuff and we do have this desire to bring lightness and joke and all that sort of thing but it's a

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it's Yeah, I think you just need to whenever you put that empathetic land or that you know that lens on it's um, yeah,

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well if you want to send us an email Hi, the daily talk show.com we've got some good guests coming up because you're you're out of here yes on

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next week. Yeah, so I leave on Tuesday June 26 to Europe so we're going to be doing the show remotely there'll be a new show which will be you and I talking Monday to Thursday so this sort of style and then we're currently doing pre records with guests for Fridays we had a great chat with a guy named Jeff Jarrett yeah he's a really interesting guy he's someone who who's really changed his life gone from you know this dude who described his life as a bit of Wolf of Wall well he

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had he had a company that was generating $35 million a year revenue yeah to nothing and he's done it multiple times and yeah and a lot of life lessons in addiction along the way so that will be a really really interesting so just again that Jay car if it's the 100 day Bay red mini personal alarm

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with torch is the thing it's 10 bucks that you can get

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Yeah, thanks for listening everyone. It's always it's a it's an uncomfortable I What do I do when I get uncomfortable? I just kept talking so I'm just gonna finish and now I have a good one everyone. Bye.