#548 – Campbell Walker, Struthless/
- December 16, 2019
Campbell Walker, AKA Struthless – Artist
Campbell Walker aka Struthless is an artist who cleverly combines art with political and social humour. We chat about how Struthless started, the difficulty of creating when you become your work and delusion.
On today’s episode of The Daily Talk Show, we discuss:
– How Struthless started
– Creating content with an audience in mind
– The difficulty of creating when you become your work
– Creating longevity as an artist
– Campbell’s first 9 to 5 job
– How 2019 has been
– The street vs digital art experience
Struthless website: http://www.struthless.com
Struthless on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/struthless69
Email us: firstname.lastname@example.org
Send us mail: PO BOX 400, Abbotsford VIC 3067
The Daily Talk Show is an Australian talk show and daily podcast by Tommy Jackett and Josh Janssen. Tommy and Josh chat about life, creativity, business, and relationships — big questions and banter. Regularly visited by guests and gronks! If you watch the show or listen to the podcast, you’re part of the Gronk Squad.
This podcast is produced by BIG MEDIA COMPANY. Find out more at https://bigmediacompany.com/
The Daily Talk Show Episode 548. We've got Campbell Walker in the building Yes, triplet 69 clap as well. Fellas, how are you, buddy? I'm just a lot food here in Melbourne town flew over on a plane this morning stepped off into a clear blue sky which say intended to a clear grey sky tended to a dark grey sky. And now it's blue again. I feel like I'm watching one of your videos.
flying at the story quite quickly in the debates. Yeah, I, I first started following you. I reckon a couple of years back around the time where you made the video about how it's cheaper. If you planning on doing five bags of cocaine in Australia, you might as well fly to Mexico for the weekend. That was my first video to ever get a million views. That was that was a place in my heart. But it also told me that people really care a lot about both money and
I just thought it's clever, because it's like it. It makes so much sense. Have you found Has anyone actually done it? One
Guy claimed to have done it, he did slide into my dams and he's like, check this bro. And it's like, he'd taken a photo of his computer screen and it was a plane ticket with the return date. So whether he did it or not, whether he even came back, you know, five bags, man.
It was a one way ticket accidentally. So yeah, so it's Friday you leave you can get back to work Monday I am and in that time have gone to Mexico. It's cheaper. And it's changed, which is the incentive. So were you to be doing more than five bags here. Because obviously cocaine is that the price is quite inflated. Yeah.
For the children out there who are looking to get into business. Yeah, so which is kind of worked out when you were a kid? Were you always drawing like, yes. Until I got sort of dismissed quite harshly by an art teacher. And then I took a 10 year hiatus. Really wait till you realise that they're not taking.
The guy was like a fucking stoner with some shit car and I took him
Word is gospel Fuck you, Mr. McLaughlin.
Could you turn make a name of him and
was bad advice, honestly. Man, it was it was a paycheck house a more dented a devious box.
And so then, because you've got a very specific aesthetic, sort of this, how would you How would you describe it because I like my illustration. It's kind of childish, I would say. very colourful.
Detailed without looking detailed at first, which I love, and it looks effortless even though it isn't. But yeah, it looks like something which I don't think would be out of place and in children's book, which is why I like putting in jokes that would be out of place in children's books with them. Love it, so do so your 10 year hiatus. Why do you have you come back? What did someone give you some words of inspiration? I almost I was living in
In a house with with house man says What does
and one of them was really, really into drawing and it was just a classic star in a house where you just stay home and do you know, just little things here and there and he would always just get smart bombs and just start drawing and I was like, You look like you're having fun. So I'd sit next to him and just copy him which at first was really fun and he was kind of flattered cuz you know, when somebody does like an impression of you at the pub, and you're like,
come on, do it again place. Yeah, you know, and there's kind of like this like, self indulgent side to it. So I think he kind of liked saying his drawings done by someone who was a bit shit.
And then I remember one day we were there and I went to draw like, it was just doing the normal thing. I was just kind of copying the way that he drew and I remember you just go, bro, stop fucking doing that. And I was like, all right, maybe I'm onto something
that brought you back to life.
junkie Joel's nights. There's a guy
there's a guy at the front
pedobear You know, there's a junkie Joe who's like, they're always doing heroin. Always chatting, but it's actually true. Yeah, but this is all true. But he's, he's made because Joel gets a bit fuckin aggro, but he's made will shoot up and then he has a pen and paper and he just draws just quietly sort of does that at least it's that. Yeah, exactly. Yeah.
Punching up PayPal, PayPal, Apple you into graffiti when you were young? I'm not saying I mean, I was into vandalising I guess,
not necessarily in an artistic way. Yeah, well, I think it's like I remember I used to hang out with crews it would be bad
but I think it's like should be young right? Well, you're not needing to make any money doesn't really matter. scrapping a few dollars together to get testosterone
You just want to break shit getting ready. Well, that's what it was like, right? And so you see the progression with those kind of people with a, actually a job. And so it's really hard to make it as an artist. And I feel like you've found this thing where it's, you're essentially what a real artist is, and you found different avenues to put your work out into the world. Like, do you think it wouldn't have happened? Like your Instagram that and the brand if it wasn't for the illustration? Or do you think you would have come in through your video style stuff? Or I think the illustration helps because I wasn't good at it at first. And I think that kind of
lowered the barrier to entry. Or maybe maybe it gave me an excuse that I didn't need to be that good to be producing stuff on mass. I don't know if that makes sense. But there were things that I was sort of better. I think at the time I was a better musician, and I think I was too precious about music.
Because I knew that I could play instruments. What instruments do you play? A bunch back? Way, way, way worse now, but at the time I played, you know, guitar piano trumpet, little bit everything
was oh boy stuff. Yeah, I mean what it sounds like it's like it's artists. They're trying to find something that sticks. Some people would like transfixed on being a canvas painter and it might not stick for them and so would the advice that I got. So at the roundabout that same time I was working for this guy in his art studio. I didn't even really have dreams of being an artist or anything like that. I was just working at his studio and he was a sculptor guy named Mark Shatner, who I don't know if you ever seen they're really quiet.
They're both artistic but also very commercial. What they put out which is these beautiful sculptures of like Adonis, like Leni Riefenstahl type photo bodies, you know, just these gorgeous bodies, but they've got dog and rabbit heads. Yeah, LA. Yeah. You say in Sydney?
Sydney? Yes, yes.
From double back, yeah, so I was working in his team. And I remember one day I think I was complaining, which is often what young men do. And yes, young
man, I'll grow into that Tata one day, Mama dog with his ears. So I was there and I was just winching. And he's like, you know what your problem is, one day you'll write a song The next day, you'll write some frickin poem. No one's ever gonna write, then you're going to draw a picture that sucks. And then you're going to write a song again, and none of it builds. He's like, you know, what you need to do is just do the exact same thing every single day. Not unlike what you guys are doing, I guess. Yeah. And he's like, if you do that, because he's like art isn't about creativity. It's about a brand in somebody else's head. Which is such a cynical way of saying it. But in my idealistic brain, I don't think I'd seen it that way. And to see him from the perspective of a guy who had a studio and all this money and all these outworks I was like, Oh, shit, yeah, you know what, you're the authority here. I'm going to listen to you and
So what does it mean to you? Like elaborate on that? Or do one thing I told around that the brand what he's advice to you, I took it very literally. So I guess it at the same time I was sort of I mean, everyone who is everybody who I like is into some form of experimentation, or self experimentation, however you want to put it.
So, yeah, Jackie Jo, yes. 30 Day Challenge going wrong.
Sorry, if you are struggling with drug addiction, this isn't the shaming. But um, yeah. So I was like, well, maybe I'll experiment with just doing the exact same thing. And he's like, why don't you pick an image? And why don't you pick a medium, I'll pick the medium for you drawing because you need to get better at that. And some are, I got it, and he's like, now just pick an image and draw it every single day. So I was walking home through Hyde Park, and they were just heaps of ibises around. And I was like, You know what, I'm just gonna take his advice and just draw episodes for a year and just reassess after that sky rats, otherwise known
Otherwise known as yeah one of those you know there's long baked birds the quite a big I assume they'll flowers
yeah been chicken yeah been Chicken Chicken so white you spent a year drawing them yes every day every day, multiple times a day and so what we were using like pen and paper because you know using everything because you know you It feels like the very popular thing to do nowadays is to buy an iPad and then say historical a 69 like but I think that people see the types of stuff and under appreciate how much effort or talent is actually involved
is the So were you using all different types of stuff? Yeah, I guess cuz I had an image. So I started a started to understand what he meant about consistency and how consistency actually creates a creative career as opposed to just being creative. So I think that the thing that I was missing was focus and that image gave me the focus. So I sort of acted
experimented a little bit around with you know, it was a drawing was that painting at one point I remember you know those hammer beads that you put in the white things that poke up and then you get baking paper and I am
old school Yeah, go on and then Mr. Ice even told a story or one of us did where someone put them into water and they dissolved and then someone drinks and then they like he's he says yeah, how'd it like a psychedelic effect of something happened his job.
And so you did this every single day? Do you end up with a portfolio or something? Yeah, well, this was the start of my, I guess life on the internet because I started putting them up just on Instagram. And after a few months or even just a month it was it was quite
quick. I realised that I
can constantly drawing the same picture was really boring, which I think that pretty pretty guessable conclusion. So I was like, Okay, how can I make this slightly more interesting and so awesome.
Adding jokes to this one, I was character. And then I was like, Ha, I can make these jokes, whatever I want. As long as I keep the is the same, it's gonna start looking like a comic strip. And then I was like, Oh, that's kind of cool. And then got to this point where I think the Ibis got in the way of the jokes. The jokes became such a focal point that they I was felt like it was obscuring it, and just making it Oh, what's that weird surreal element there. I don't know if I like that. So I took that out, replace it with humans kept the jokes and what I realised is that the consistency of putting of doing the exact same thing every day leads you to where you are going to be so you can't start out with say, a brand or some identity of what you want. The the work leads to that as opposed to the other way. What about the platform? How much like so putting it on Instagram? Yeah, what does that do?
I honestly was just because it's visual. Yeah, that was that was literally it was such a such a non film.
Out thing. Yeah. And so was it something where because I guess there'd be a lot of people trying to reverse engineer it's like I'm going to start an Instagram account. I'm going to post now hashtag and all that sort of stuff. Did you actually see the platform like would people be engaging with with it? Yeah, yeah. Yeah, for sure. And I did use hashtags at first we were all kind of just goofy ones. You know, they weren't whatever, but I guess that got people but honestly, as a mechanic, I didn't really I don't, I've never really seen its value.
Maybe to correlate or search some weird shit. But other than that, yeah, I don't think that particular one helped getting re posted. Definitely. I started saying traction when I would do something that was maybe relevant to something and then everybody would be like, oh, shoot and go around the internet. And then all these people be like, Who did that? And because I never signed any of the works either, which maybe I didn't want to because I didn't think they were good enough. And I felt like saying a signature next to a ship cartoon is kind of like laughing at your own jokes.
Yeah, it's like just taking yourself real seriously. And I was I just thought about that. And so I probably lost heaps of stuff on maybe overthinking. But mostly, I guess it was just when the content was going to just get reposting because there's an image you know, it's not like there's not much effort, like reposting a video is kind of hard. Better picture. Yeah, I guess that's how it started. It was Scott started snowballing with an audience in mind. Ah, gronk
Yeah, yeah. They feel very sad. I feel like your audience based on the types of content you create, it is a smart audience. Because of what you have to actually like, get the joke. It feels like all of your work is playing in that in joke which is why I think especially I feel like it would go very well in Melbourne because we all like to be like, Oh, yeah, we're on that we get hot. We get that type of thing. Does that put more pressure knowing that you've got a smart audience? Yes, yeah.
Yes. Yeah, thank you, man, I really appreciate that. I'm more pressure. Sometimes I definitely put a lot of pressure on myself, which I don't think is healthy. And that's something that I'm trying to alleviate at the moment just by fasting from the internet, and I don't mean fasts, all that kind of stuff. What's the pressure? Is it to post is it I guess it's like,
just when you've set a standard for yourself being able to hitting that standard every single time, which isn't difficult, because it comes naturally. But it does get difficult when so much of life gets in the way. And I mean, the way just how these social networks are structured, is I feel like, often when you've got somebody online and like that's like a sliver of them, like, you know, this show is one, like 1% of your personalities, and then the rest of it is all offline and it goes into it. Yes, but it's foolish to assume from that 1% the 100%, which is
Why head is a stupid? Right? But it's also why prize is kind of stupid. Because it's like, well, you don't know, all we know is the work. And if all we know is the work and there, we know that people are deducing the human from the work. I feel pressure to be the work, man. I think that's kind of what started fucking with my head as of late and just stepping away from them being human again, is it? Do you think it's what you have to grapple with? If you are doing something consistent? Or, you know, applying yourself consistently do something? Yes, yes. And then I guess that's the other thing is that there's a lot of
conversations around consistency, being an integral part of any kind of social media venture, which I think is kind of messed up like I read this article that's kind of stuck with me about the this guy who he's a writer on the internet and he talks about having a social media offseason in the same way that sport has a social media offseason.
Mike Yeah, they do rest, they do recover and then they can come back and play hotter and hotter and hotter. And I think like with me, like, I've been drawing comics for three years now with just my foot hard on the accelerator, and now I'm just like, Whoa, maybe I need to step off the field for like, a month and then come back. Do you feel like you just need to take every opportunity? Yes and No, cause there are more opportunities than I could take. Definitely like I think it's at first Yes, I felt like I had say yes to everything and now it's at the point where I can't at all and so I think I've just got to say yes to the really really big ones and that's been like a weird thing that I've had to scale up quite quickly on because once again, it's like I mean, sometimes when things go well for you, you don't expect them to take over your whole life or like but I'm so opportunistic, you know, say like an ice cream shop oh here like grains leaves in the background on my fucking that's dinner.
In jokey get hard.
When your audience gets bigger, big on, like empathy, I guess right. So as the audience gets, so say even like talking about Joel being, you know, a junkie, a good, good example, there, as you mentioned, there are people struggling with drugs. Yeah, I lost a close friend today I went to LA this year, it was fucking horrible. And so you can't like the ease of the other side of every story, right? And so if you think about from a comedic point of view, there is something in the US and then which I think, you know, everything, like a lot of comedies is based around that, does that get harder from an empathy point of view when you're creating the work massively, and I wish it didn't I wish it didn't play into my head that I don't want to make anyone feel excluded. Because I think that's the other thing like with all this, think it was I've been listening to like, could be like Tim Ferriss show or something where they were, they were talking about how, as you start achieving more goals that you have been set, so
elements of your personality, exaggerate or get amplified, which is why we have phrases like absolute power corrupts absolutely. But it's also why some people become philanthropy because they already had that charity element. And as they find their success in life and as they find it fulfilment, that that element amplifies and I think from mine, weirdly, have sort of, I think compassion has probably is probably one of those things. There's a bunch of others as well, maybe a bit of self indulgence, he knows. But all those elements have kind of bubbled to the surface and it's made me want to be less edgy and less angry and less outraged and less combative, which I think I elements that I used a lot maybe like, a few years ago when I draw comics, but not ones that I really like using anymore. And I wonder if it's a good thing to lose that edge, or if it's a bad thing, I'm watering down my style. What do you think? I don't know, man.
I don't think I want to put any more toxicity out in the world. And I think I've done enough and
what is out of your content? Is, is the cocaine video? Is that more on the edgier side? And that's that's just what does it for you that probably like the political stuff like I used to a lot more political satire. And I just found that the comment sections would just get so dirty so quick, and I would have to grapple with the idea of being like, I created that like, if I I mean, I didn't create that that conversation will be going on without me. You started. You started the campaign and now everyone's around the campfire. Yeah. And now there's a bunch of people who are hating each other, we're probably going to have a shitty day about this. And no real change came from it, if anything, or the only change that came from it was I found my way into new people's feeds, which is inherently selfish, and maybe I swayed some ideas but yeah, I think it was, yeah, I kind of regret that. I think it you know, I just
direction music is pretty clear. So Kanye West, Madonna are old albums, he's new album that it's a Christian. It's an album, Jesus is God and the one guy who likes it. I fucking love it too, is actually the unmastered I'll give it to you after my mate sent me the YouTube link to yandi which is the original album, which is now Jesus is God. And Jesus God is very time late. Yeah, so but the other one is, like, more inward like it's it's more original Kanye but he did the shift to produce something new. I see that kind of an artist and go. He actually fucking knows where it's heading. Because every album he's done I've thought is unbelievable. After listening to it for six times, I'm like at the start. Is there a thought from your side where you're going? Who you are is is the art. It sounds bad because it's like you don't want to be your work. But as an artist you like what you want to put out into the world is what you want to put out. Yes. If you
You don't want to do that other political celaya shit. Yeah, this is the newest ruthless Yeah, I'm gonna like it or not when she died. And it's like, it's Seth Godin talks about, like the change you seek to make. Yeah, like, if you think about that, even though it is a 1% representation of you, it is still the 1% that you're choosing to put it out there. Yeah, Yeah, Yeah, Yeah, Yeah, I would agree with that. And also, that's, like that kinda thing. I've been thinking about that a lot lately, just in the sense that because it's like, as as somebody who makes art, but the way that art is received now is like, instead of being cold, like an artist or a cartoonist, you just called a content creator, and content creator has all these weird connotations of this is what you do. And it is very much like one of those put in a box type things. And it's like, if you can just be like, this is what I do now. Either you're here or you're not, which is, yeah, definitely something that I subscribe to as a belief system. Mm hmm. What's an example of a piece of work that you've done that you've since regretted? Or
Me ever think
you would delete Byron Scott who needs to archive
something today like I archive all the time, I just like to remind myself that I'm in control.
Something that I regret. Um, I guess it just like an opportunity to because I think that's why we like daily is because we can show up the next day and be better and yeah, I guess I like the incremental Oh, I remember one yeah. So I made this video and I just watched all these like stupid fucking bro science documentaries. And that was just so dumb like, you know those health ones that are like, unless you're eating a pound of fish, you're gonna starve.
Chill out. And so then I was like, I could make a bro science documentary. And so I did and the whole idea behind it was it was sort of back around the same time as that can be
I was like, Alright, so I'll make one about a different drug. And I kind of did this really, really, really shit. But if you didn't know anything about science, it would be convincing storytelling about how, if you're vegan, you will have a much better high on ecstasy. And I called it vagon for the pinions.
And it was like this massive shitpost. And I got it. I thought it was funny. There are a few people who also thought it was funny, but then there were a lot of people who did not find it funny at all, I guess, vegans know, because I'm vegan. And I thought it was hilarious. And a lot of the vegans liked it because they're like, even if this science is wrong, so the people who got that they're like, it's still making a slightly more pleasant conversation around veganism where vegans don't look like these preachy fucking hippies. And if the science is right, awesome, we get a better ecstasy.
You got really a fan.
Did where actual science like bro science guys say the actual frickin meatheads out there who just thought well no this is this is fucking stupid I started getting fucking death threats was no joke I would wake up and then like, you know when you look at your phone and you know, you know and then it's just a frickin like list of death threats bro You shouldn't be putting that shit on the internet and what like my one regret was being like hey guys this is a joke, but fuck them fuck them, you know I don't regret it
drugs. When I was a kid I feel like I've opened my mind a little bit when we went to California, I did edibles for the first time. I haven't been one to drink much. I've always felt that this sort of drugs and drug culture have had sort of a net negative sort of view on it. It seems like things are changing with like marijuana and stuff like that. What's your perspective of the whole culture Wow.
It's a big question. It's a huge question. I did a lot of drugs when I was younger, I don't do drugs anymore. And that's very much intentional. Flat Out nothing. Yeah. Every now and then I'll slip up like maybe a birthday or a music festival and always just hate myself the next day. But otherwise, it's cold turkey, which has been much better than what it used to be. So I feel like I have had an intimate history with them. And I think around about the time that I started making stuff, I found that the less drugs I did, the more stuff I made. And so that was my reaction was off drugs abuse me for so many years. I'll use drugs, which is when I made that cocaine video. I'm like, how can I use this culture instead of me feeling like, you know, it's frickin friend in prison.
Yeah, I mean, it's, I thought the same is does it do you think it's, do you think it's true that once you're often your work, or you just seen the correlation
Because I'm always trying to work out i don't i don't think quitting drugs necessarily will make you motivated. I think it does the opposite effect to a lot of people.
But I think if you are motivated, you can quit drugs, I guess. But I mean, everyone's got so much so much shit going on and if like yo named Dave and drug addiction like that what I just said it's gonna sound like absolute bullshit. Oh, yeah, I mean, this is non drug addicts speaking. It's because it's a serious thing for people to come off Is it because drugs are always short term? Is there any long term strategy to drug use?
I think it opens your mind to a lot of stuff and not in the like classic psychedelic like your minds open bro. I think more just that other people have a lot of pain and that this is their way of healing it and which is which is sad that that's that we don't have a more open discussion about closing pain or ending your trauma or
Sort of actual medication instead of self medicating. So I think it sort of it probably gives you a bit more empathy. I think when you look at dude screaming down the street or if there's like a viral video of some guy harassing a cyclist, you know, like, he's got a looks like a junkie or something, like, maybe gives you a bit more empathy. They're like, okay, that guy's a human and he's doing drugs for a reason. And those reasons were things that happened to him and he is a victim of something. I mean, we're all swimming in our own thoughts. Like every human is experiencing that. Thoughts just flashing every second constantly hundreds of thousands at die. what's what's your so like mental health and your art? When you struggle, I could assume most people have times where they're struggling. Yeah, what does it do to the work you're creating consistently? It becomes very depressing. And I can map it because I
Like, I don't know, I think I'd sort of over the three years that I've had of drawing comics. I was like, I'm not going to ever, like, skip out on too many days. Although I have lately just with this new onset burnout, but every time I do get depressed, I'll say like, the cartoons just gets so dark and so grim, and so nihilistic. And then when I get manic, everything is just chaotic. There's like eight new ideas going on at once, and I just upload insane amounts. So I think it's Yeah, I couldn't
map it with any. It's just so easy to map with accuracy. Yeah. How do you create longevity as an artist? In what sense? So I guess like some of that, the roller coaster and all that sort of thing. Yeah. I'd say that it all the burnout. Yeah. And then we're all sort of. We love Matt de velas. Yeah, staff and what he's producing and I guess it's a lot of that self development.
Hmm, trying to you know, not burn the candle at both ends. Yeah. How to put the candle on the side to do that?
Well, you know, it's like a T shaped candle. Yeah. And then sorry, ends and
yeah, maybe some toothpicks out there. Yeah. So how do I overcome it? Um, I used to be very bad. I think my coping strategies were was shocking for a long time, which is what we're talking about before, but since not using those as coping strategies, I've actually gone to therapy, which has been quite nice. How did you find a therapist as in like, way dude, like, physically? Yeah. Um, what was my mom, I was on the phone to my mom, and she was saying you should get a therapist. And then she's like, Oh, my friend goes to this one in Stanmore. And so I just ended up going there because I don't know I've had a lot of bad run ins with mental health professionals before. Just when I haven't been old there when I was 20. I remember complaining
To a mental health professional to the point where I got sectioned and sent into a like a mental hospital and it was I was it was it was hectic and say I was just like I just made up my mind that mental health professionals were bad people and that I wanted to see action you do have certain types then that you sort of vibe with Have you worked that out? It's like I don't like science I want this type or that. I think I was less demanding to be honest because I was like, I think I've resigned to the fact that I've might not gel with everybody and maybe I'll gel with nobody. So if in the potentially likely case that I gel with nobody. Then I'll just lower my standards. So I just lowered my standards a bit as lowered expectations. Yeah, yeah, exactly. We expect to jail with nobody and then someone you jail with the positive Yeah, jackpot. And so do you when you go in for the first session? Yeah. What were you expecting? Um,
Did it catch you on a good day or a bad day? Like a good question? Well, I just sort of complained to my mom and my fiance about some pretty gnarly childhood trauma. And so that was the sort of instigation of it that I just kind of kept my mouth shut on forever. And my my plan was to take said trauma to the grave, just never burden anybody with it. But then it just came out one day in a conversation with my mom, and I was like, which is when she's got to go get therapy. And so, yeah, that's exactly what I did. I and then I just told the therapist about that. And yes, it was really nice. tried a bunch was good. Felt good. And so was it something that you felt like, okay, like, did you go into the whole like the mental health plan? Yeah, yeah, to go to a GP. I went straight to the therapist for a few sessions. And then she said, Oh, go to do the mental health plan, which if anybody doesn't know about it, you can get your 10 sessions by just getting a mental health plan for Use coupon code strength. Let's see. Yeah, swipe up.
was there a sense that you just wanted to talk about the previous trauma? Was there any discussion on like, how that connects to the current day? There was a lot of discussion on that, so that I know there were a bunch of traumas so that's kind of how it started. So started out with like, a really obvious one, and then it led into all the other ones which I mean, we've all got damons It looks like you lead with the problem. You think in it. There's actually a bunch of others Yeah, exactly. They haven't raised Yeah, yeah, I could then these days is this stuff you didn't realise that you're fucking
You don't know it's Yeah, yeah. And it Europe and it's actually controlling your operating system.
You want to we did you want to push back on anything that this assumptions that they were
I think I'm still sceptical of personally being medicated, which I mean, that's my strap.
I know some people thrive on medication. I think I'm just scared of chemicals in general, which is such a naive thought, and I totally respect that. But that's probably the the one bit of resistance that I have felt, I think to therapy. And so when they if they do prescribe that sort of thing, is it a? How do you work through something like that? Well, I don't know. I haven't done it to psychiatrists. Right. Oh, yeah. I mean, logistically, yeah. Well, I'm just wondering, like so say, like you, you go to a therapist, and they say, look, it sounds like you've got this type of depression. You would benefit from this and then you think in your head, I saw that Netflix can have all the answers
with MD and so
if you if you see a therapist and they suggest maybe you should try this type of medication either that's a psychotic Yeah, that was a good say, Yes. Then has to make that decision. But she did say she's
I think you would definitely benefit from medication. And I think you should go get it. So that's the that's my, my current. That's like, happened last week. Yeah. And what do you think about that?
Like connecting that? Because I guess there's a lot of a lot of artists that think, if I take medication, is that going to change my personality, which will then change that? 1%? Yeah, there was a brilliant documentary about something similar with like Stephen Fry, and Carrie Fisher, where they were talking about bipolar disorder in creatives and whether or not Yeah,
reducing the bipolar disorders. Hold on, you would reduce your creative output, because a lot of the people would be like, oh, when America puts incredible Kenya, yeah, yeah, yeah, precisely. And like so many, so many, so many awesome people. And, I mean, I don't know like I haven't experienced
anything other than extreme emotions. So I don't I don't know what a middle ground would give
Me creatively, but honestly, probably be okay. Yeah, it's a weird scary feeling if you've had a certain operating system. Yes, it's like you've got your phone and you think fact is iOS 13 going to slow everything down. Yes, the battery is gonna be fucked up. Yeah, I'm gonna freakin get some Nokia vibes.
How much do you connect? Sort of the work in the success whether it be for comments or likes or money you're making to the mental health stuff like, is it directly like the the dive main loop of of people telling you that they love you? I mean, all of that. Yeah, it's all this external stimulus. Yeah, it is actually play on your mental state. Yes, yes. But hopefully not for too long. Like I just live and die by that you'll never as bad or as good as they say you are. And so you can sort of detach yourself from the comments, but I guess and then I mean, that that's been worked together. Cuz at first it's like, sick people think I'm cool. You know, but then after a while, you're like, Okay, like three people over there.
Thought you were cool. What does your best friend think? What does your mom think? What does yeah you girlfriend thing? That's all that really counts which is way higher order than I thought I'd answer that question. What's the what's the same in Australia? Like I saw that Logan Paul KSI
fight and I was hearing some people saying yeah the who's who of YouTube were there I thought it sounds fucking horrendous
all day. I'm pretty sure they say crews, but like I agree on to YouTube crew was there I was like, good luck. Yeah, I mean, is there a way you haven't entered any scene really yet? In Australia? Is there like an Instagram? Are you getting invited to anything like a fuck Jerry style like parties? I think I saw you on a boat once on an Insta story and I just assume now that you're on a yacht, so let's
carefully craft this brand or
it's like I mean, I think
I've made a lot of friends through Instagram and that's in the same way that I think me and my my girlfriend now fiance got together about a month before Tinder came out. Or maybe before Tinder hit mainstream so I never got a chance to really meet people online and I think now with Instagram I can yeah just made so many friends through it and it's just people who are doing the same thing that you're doing and they might happen to go on yachts
just having delivery on the corner and just wanted to have a beer well I think it also Josh is like the bubble sets the the art world I've got a man who has a gallery that's I know that that's a bubble that he's in where in this fucking podcasting, create a video create a bubble. Steve, do you seek? Do you see time outside the bubble or do you even know? Do you identify that it is a bubble there's a bubble community is a community Yeah, there. That's the funny both of those words are very funny. Yeah.
What you can leave
The community the bubble gives it the zoomed out perspective that you're actually fucking in the community inside the bubble. And there's a life outside of your world. And so you can give yourself a perspective shift if you just look outside to someone who doesn't give a fuck about what you do Yeah, you do stuff
even netball is we had a specific sport Yes, it's another it's a culture it's a community. It's a real fucking bubble is
I think I get lost in the bubble too much. But not in like a community baseball I think I just lost in my own bubble. I think I just live in my own world I don't leave the house hates I'm just used to leave it alone anymore. Not a fan got two dogs and just hang out with them. So I think I've made my own bubble and and that is where I live. Yes, it's a modern day right it's like you can living the dream
you're living your dream. You can live in my nightmare. Sorry What we leave the hospital
Go on a yacht. What would I leave the house for?
Taking the dogs out?
Getting some groceries or Fagan, baby.
Do you like what do you do now? Phone calls online or something? No No idea is like a block away. Yeah, but yeah, now I'm become really introverted. And then they'll be like,
I still say friends and she was graduating a little bit. Yeah, but my weekend, probably would have stayed home. Yeah, I love that. Like I'm very much like that. Have you ever thought about living in a regional area? So you have my yesterday I used to so I mean, Sydney's only, like, we only moved back to Sydney maybe about a year ago. But before that we were in Tamworth. And then before that, we were in stopped in and stopped into a weird town. I don't know if you guys have not know it's technically a suburb of Newcastle but because there's so much water in between and you have to catch a ferry. It's kind of in the same way that galapagus has developed a time space. He's it's really developed his own culture, but it's not connected to the mainland. No, not connected to the
No, it is it's like a financial low coming from the south side from the north. But it's like right next to like all the cool stuff. So it's just a mining town population about 4000 were like, well, it's cheap. So So what were you doing? So you were talking about doing the the artwork and doing the well that that was exactly what we did because you're like, have you thought about moving to a regional area and just grinding? I maybe that's I've invented the end of your sentence.
Um, yeah. And so that that was kind of it. So that's sort of what we're doing with that. All right. Well, could we have a cheaper standard of a cheaper cost of living and live somewhere next to a beach so we did exactly that. And then while I was there, I'd catch the ferry and each day and I was going to introduce you to Newcastle Linux today was really relaxing. So you like that lifestyle? Yeah, it was nice. I wouldn't mind getting it back again. I think. I mean, maybe it's maybe it's the race in air quality and Sydney that's made me a bit resentful of the city. I don't know.
But yeah, so does the city when convenience
Yeah, um, I guess doing like your collaboration? Yeah, collaboration. Yeah. I mean, and also just like clients in general, because I mean of the work I do, you know, we're talking like 10%. Next online like most of my work is freelance illustration, which I don't really post about or anything or freelance video editing or something like that. But it's so much easier when you can just go see a client. So that's where the CD wins. I guess its financial decision. Yeah. What do you as a business person, how would you describe yourself?
Yeah, yeah, I think I like being independent.
I think I get very, I get real allergic reactions to certain certain aspects of business. You know, at some point, my, my frickin laid back. Mom kicks in, like the voice in my head where it's like, you know, yeah.
So that kicks in, but then
I get maybe another voice which is I want to be rich. I wanna I want the money though. Yes, I don't know maybe conflicted conflict is that sabotaging to project Do you think I think?
Yes yes yeah official bullshit like because I could imagine you in a setting of a corporate environment where they're like like I'm one of the big four banks been like we want to be cool Campbell that make us do a fucking funny meme on us you know about saving money and in this fantasy What do I do next? Yeah, that's what I do. So I think that it's you could go one of two ways. It's either the voice which is like, the love money, like just do it. But there's also the one of like, you guys don't actually get me or understand you just trying to do what you think is Yeah, and then I flipped the desk. I have Yeah, I've done I've definitely done but for those. Yeah, for sure. Man. I quit a job so I can
that wall bridge bridge. That's why Sydney
Yeah, that was that was the bridge. Yeah. Which and I apologise, you know, here we are now. Yeah, basically yeah that that bridge was the end of the cigarette man. It was fucked. But um, yeah so so what you do and you burn the day this is so bad. I've never even told this story because I'm embarrassed but I was working at an advertising agency as my first job out of uni. And you know, fuck it if you're from that agency, listen the fuck up.
How about I would have been in 23 I want to say yeah, 23
God, I hated it. I hated it. So fucking much, man, everyone that just felt like the antithesis of who I wanted to be in this world. Just like vapid yuppie scum. Which part of me is there? Is that part of me? And I think you know, yeah, you're right. Like the fucking like the side of me that wants like millions of bucks and just to be a boozy con. But like, yeah, like this. I said, we got this vapid, yuppie scum, right. And like, you know, I'm going in there day in day out and it's like, what is he
first job, you just oh man, like you're confronted by so many things. One of those things is how many hours you work right? So it's like nine to five Monday to Friday. All right, so it's a when's when's the holiday is
it's not fucking holidays, the weekends the holidays and so, like I say, this is seriously what everybody does. So I've got a little bit of that going on, but I think maybe in another office that would have been maybe suppressed by how much I felt that people could be cool but
there was this one point. This kind of relates a little bit to Matt D Avella because like I had all these clothes and I was like, I just want to get rid of them and so I've checked them on Facebook right? And I was like, just yeah, I'm just gonna write for sale so I write this like, hates pretentious thing. I'm like, Hey guys, I'm going to go live a minimalist nomadic lifestyle. Well, I don't need any possessions. You know, just like this absolute, like, just shitpost of like, why? why I'm putting these jackets online. And then one of my former friends I shouldn't say
Former a girl who I was friends with happen to be a journalist. And she saw that and she's like,
Oh, hey cam talking about minimalism is in my quota this week, can I interview you?
And I was like, how do I keep this going? And I'm like, Yeah, let's do that. And she's like, really? And what I should have said is No. But what I did say is house Cheese Day. Cheese Day rolls around, right? And I think I've had so much coffee that day, you know, United ice
bucket, or a fucking fuckhead inside there. I am just like, you know,
up here, and she calls me and
I don't know, you know, is the first time I'd really been asked in depth about something that I didn't believe in
this character, and I'm like, Yeah, man, minimalism is all who I am. And she's like, wow, but what about your job? I'm I hate my job. And she's like, oh, Dr. And I'm like, Yeah, I hate it. You know why I had to
Because everyone here is a fucking yuppie who's intoxicated by that job title and that quirky fucking sucks.
next minute front page of news.com.com is a big photo of me smiling like a
3pm on a Friday writing time for everyone to just start working and start scrolling the internet and who did I say? Oh, that was a fucking new kid who doesn't like us? Watch this. He's publicly said he doesn't like us. Oh, man, I thought it was in fucking deaths that day. And I was like, Tim,
I don't know. I can't remember. I think I was just so so crushed that the whole thing was a blur. I got in so much trouble. So many people who might not have I might have like escaped them having an opinion on me. Now they hated me. And so I was like, shit, I quit. Very
Say enough to that did I did the boss cool you know your manager yeah all my manager he really locked me out a good relationship with him and he was like my I love you but this is reckless
he's like you You need to get that down and part of me was like no
this is still unused
not I ended up taking it down there was an Italian version of it somewhere so I'll send you that yeah. Yeah, it was brutal, man. Yeah, but then like the exact you know, you know what these people they like straight up frickin movie stereotypes you know we don't say we hate you but you know Fuck you.
Like those are the people that are now sitting in you know, the bad room with and that is like talking to me. They're like
I think in their head they're just like, if we PCM off you know how they're always playing a chess game these corporatize Yeah, I think that will like if we try to approach this aggressively. Maybe he'll he's recording this or something and he's going to get another news. com article or they'll be like some filler.
work I haven't I didn't realise that until later because I was like the first question that one of them said was Why did you do it? Are you not happy here? And I'm like that is the most empathy I've seen from
Forever flat out definitely spoken to an HR consultant yeah
could have hidden behind it's just I was just taking the piece that's what I said. And I said laid it
out it's just the news
go I mean, you've read the news a bunch of like the junkie and the pedestrian the quick batch. Yeah, well, I mean, this the type of stuff he's Oh, it's like very much their audience. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. This sort of Yeah, the the the, the hipster persuaded? Well, yeah, that works. So you get the giant but then you've also got the corporate Yeah, yeah, yeah. The on the weekends party, and locking the escapism because they say the true which I think
I like having them as my audience as well, because I mean, firstly, like, the passionate enough to be jaded, because I think jaded only comes from like idealism, right? You're like, Ah shit, the world could be better. And when you recognise that maybe that's when the cynicism kicks in. And also they've got money. They can buy my shit. That's fucking awesome. Where did streetlights come from the name the name. I was honestly just mashing words is just what I was doing one night in the pub. And that was the first night I actually drone on this because I was like, I'm gonna draw this so I made an A like a name to put it on. And my my girlfriend now fiance was working at the bar, and I'm it a pen and some paper. So she gives me like the keynote pen. And then the dog is betting pifo she's like, it's blank on the other side, go crazy. And say, yeah, that was my first cartoon was on the back of that. And they all still there.
Got physical copies of them. You know, I reckon I do actually. Yeah, that's
Probably be in my my like shoe box of paper documents. We went to the the herring in best way
exhibition on foot last Friday night. Yeah, the crazy thing is we're better out of place we don't know
because he's getting a nice bag
audio listeners but on the on the on the night I went to a studio 54 party of the day. And
so that's the photo sharing and basket of us for the memo, buddy. We're
good buddies all the crazy thing about them and the stuff you saying there?
I mean, those guys died very young 2730 or something. Drug overdose and AIDS. This stuff now. Like that. They're using his art, his stuff that's just like handwritten notes and it's fascinating because you can't, you can't work out right now. What will be
In the future the thing that you said is static is so bizarre so it's just like you do you and those guys didn't get to see the full potential of the impact which they are actually sad and you wonder as well did the death make the art better? Exactly that's what I'm I would as I asked one of the key right I said with a as popular then or as they are now it's like they had a big following, but it wasn't our ag that were getting arrested pushing the boundaries so they weren't understood that whereas now it's time it's it's very understood. Do you see Do you do anything in Iraq where you're like, this is for the future? No one's gonna fucking get it now. Maybe if I die My will get bigger. Yeah. Well, no, no, no, no. Do I do anything where it's like, yeah, I'm like, mock my words kind of stuff. Yeah, no one's gonna get this. Oh, yeah, maybe there's some stuff that I definitely put out. And this this might have helped me one day if I ever need to reference this
school uniform just in case you like really
Yes like this box just cold How big is my ego today? Every time I move house you know, do I add or subtract to
it? No, but maybe I should
Yeah, but I guess it makes me feel bad
Captain fucking bad
do you think you need a healthy dose of delusion as a creator? Oh shit. Yeah, yeah, but also no um yeah, that's that's a great answer. Okay, so I'll explain where my delusion comes in, I think getting tunnel vision which is back to that you know singular bubble of one because if you get the tunnel vision for long enough you can create good enough without questioning why you're putting stuff on the internet but when you've got just a little bit more time to get
existential and think about life. That's when you're like, why why would I do this? Why would I even put my opinion out there? Why would I draw? Why? And when you start getting those wise I think that's when you become less diluted because honestly like Why?
I don't understand why. So the delusion helps battle for me nihilism, which I think is a more realistic place to end up on then optimistically putting out content to connect with people. So, again, like just nothing that is
what do you think of 2019 It feels like if you read social media, and everyone feels like, when's this year going to be over or whatever? I don't know whether that's sort of the bubble that I'm in because Mercury's in Gatorade. Yeah.
Yeah, but seriously, what that but yeah, so what is 2019 for you, just not even looking at the world and all that sort of thing, but for now is 20
19 being for you For me personally.
So me and my buddies or when the year started, we had a joke that we were calling it 20 grind team, which was kind of us pretending to be like entrepreneurs or rappers you know How real is that, bro? If I can make it you can make it. Like, you know that kind of cringe. We just said that before we got here.
This is this is my first and last appearance of the
community is torn apart and my mouth is torn apart by my foot.
I'm sorry. Yeah, I guess we go to 20 grinding and we're just like, okay, let's let's just start here. And we'll see where we end up at the end. And it's like a TAC crew of us. And we we've all to our, to our credit. We've all what's the past stands ground?
Yeah, yes, that's been kind of nice. And I reckon I grew up like as if quite recently, I've probably ground I'm sticking with it. I'll probably ground all I can grind in 2019 so
I feel like I have grinded to a halt i have i've grinded to a very sad and house which has been pleasant. See coming? Yes, yes. Oh, so many points so I think I took on I kind of done a little bit Yes man for a few few projects and there was some big ones that really took it out of me like I animated my first music clip which was way harder than I expected it would be doing certain podcast stuff with like, like a collaborative podcast, which I can't talk about now. That was so much work, but that'll be out later. I'm just generally creating video content in general and I don't know I broke my hand as well earlier in the year which meant that I couldn't draw for a couple of weeks The doctor said six but written cost of after three cuz you don't own Meet Dr.
Jerome? No, it was one of those like, New Age car. Really? Yeah. Is it in your box of goodies that are going to appreciate? gonna burn?
Yeah, but like it says one of those
Guys like I think that's when I started falling more in love with video and video editing and just talking on camera and not having to rely on drawing so it was weird that even breaking my hand didn't stop the grind. So I think it's just been a lot of 16 hour days no weekends for the past 11 months and now I am a sleepy sleepy guy is about to go on a holiday speaking to the artist at Rumsey Is it the dog dog heads with the human body. Oh yeah, I'm Mark shadow Julian Moksha. Now Yeah. What do they see you as now? Ah, well, I tell you the start. Yeah, they time to start and then we sort of drifted apart after that. And I saw them at a cafe maybe a couple months ago. And I ran into them like, hey, how I know just like, love it looks like everything's going great kind of stuff. So it was it was polite. They were proud.
Is it I mean, they were old school artists are they are I would say that mid. So they probably they piss off a lot of other
Let's go on as well because they make their art
what would you call it? Like
you know how like art from the art world which God but if you're in that world Go fuck yourself
I'd be listening to be honest
yeah what is the old school what like you know like to fucking pay millions of bucks for a painting like you know the ones where they like glorify What about the gaffa typed on the banana the banana yeah yeah that kind of angry like but also like that that can be maybe a comment on the angry so who knows if I can circular well kids at fucking starving in other countries and God damn it I hate that shit right but it's interesting because there is a class underneath that of people who want that but because I can't afford the things that might hang in you know the NGV or whatever there are artists who are catering to that and the authors of the class above. Like I mean a frown and anybody below them which is I mean what a friendly move right one cool painful imagination.
values. Anyway. So Mark and Jillian Mark would cater more to that aspirational type. And so they would come in the form of Yes, like art on the wall, but also homewares, which made them a lot of money. Because they were instead of, you know, selling one $1 million painting to one person, you know, you can sell a million of one to a million people, right, make the same amount of money. So there are more going for that commercial. Right. So I think they're a bit frowned on. So just to clarify, yeah, I mean, do we Where do you see yourself fitting in our way low, like lowest of the low, like complete low art, which is where I want to be I live and die there. Do you get to decide? I hope so. I don't know. I I'm definitely not high art, but I would love to piss them off. And one day being one of those galleries. That's bucket list shit. Yeah. What's the difference between being on the Internet and on the like, straight into, like in regards to mirros? Yeah, like the artist experience when you say something
In a feed versus on a wall oh
I'm the welcome a bit frustrating because if you want to tell somebody that they've done a good job you can't or it's like there's a few steps in between you and complimenting somebody for that work. So you thought about painting a comment section.
Smile Yeah. Like a whiteboard paint and then you give it a little pin and they could just Yeah, yeah, I like that. Perfect. Yeah, that's that solves the problem. I think that's why we can do it. Yeah, the internet's been so good digital screen where you can actually right onto it and it takes the fade with a sin and actually logs the Oh, that'd be kind of fun here. On the On the flip side, they
just think it's two digits.
Shop digital. Damn, man. We're solving the world's problems but I'm the flip side of that the good thing about saying in person when there is no context of
million people like this or whatever it is, is that you can make up your mind for yourself. So it's a lot more of a personal relationship and you can really focus on what makes the awkward as opposed to how many people tell you what makes the art good. So that's kind of nice. Yeah, I don't know. Still come to grips with the idea of being an artist. Yeah, I mean, we got to give credit where credit's due. You've got truthless.com I think it's a great domain. Thank you. And we need a sound effect for anyone who owns a good
domain. That's one thing we appreciate it. Good quality domain. Man. That's what I
was asked to tell you that. That's really solid. So if 2019 was grinding, yes, 2020 Oh, hopefully I'll have a holiday it'll be more grind 20 me that just what do you want to I guess it's almost like deep work. So yeah, yeah, it's a bit more. I'm, I think that's it. It's a little bit more. Instead of like frantically say yes to everything and realise that you can't break
And that you haven't fed your dogs until it's sunset.
Sunday Yeah. Sunday, not to be much money. Fuck. Yeah. Yeah, like instead of like neglecting your health and all that kind of stuff, I think I want to live a little bit more of a marathon approach to everything, which is a very influenced that thing to say. What is it? What is brought woody Brian? grind teen due to relationship so I don't think it was that bad on my relationships to tell you the truth I think the i think i don't know i'm a bit of an extrovert in that says where I really put relationships on a pedestal like if there you go everything else goes I think I still kept a lot of my friendships and still called my mom all the time, which is a key pillar for who I am. And yes, yes, I think that was good. What's your favourite you Android? Yes, what's your favourite app or get apps on Android
God he sent me screenshots
Thanks Dave. Now, my favourite app
is what's the deal with sinking with an Android? How does it go? So you put them in notes and then sync using just like potentially just found out what sinking is say? No, no, I'm Android did that backwards? No, I guess you'd have to get like a separate one like Evernote or something like that. No, but you're literally just using the notes and yeah, that would be my most used my most favourite.
What do you What are you running? You know what to buy from the shops? Yeah, I'm still do poetry. Yeah, I like poems. Like not I mean, the word poetry we need two words for poetry. I mean, it was for poetry that takes itself very seriously and words for you know, just fun things that happened to rhyme. I like things that happened around that are fun. Yeah, yeah. So I like I think I like that sort of stuff. And yeah, definitely still do write it. And electronic note section. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, it's me. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, for sure.
little fun Can you bring your bum bag up as well like your comeback? You sell these?
These These are my buddies bum bag so one of the guys who was saying 20 grand a lot with me fanny pack if you're in America yeah Yeah, yeah so his brands Elton wanted shout out.
So it's like it looks different under the
sun was a glow in the dark lot. Oh it's reflective say 3am reflective reflective light if we've got like a flash shy letter it's gonna be crossing Yeah. If I put the torch Imma do it No, it wouldn't know usually flat yeah. yeah give it give it a
nice ID right so yeah, force the flash. I'm forcing the flash on me see
the fight. I'll be the play by play for the podcast. Alright, alright, so we got just trying to work out how to do guaranteed flash. Yeah, he's doing a couple of taps he's holding. He's holding
these are wive actually my
torch. I can use torch nice and easy, but I feel like the flashes where it's at night so lightning bolt on you go. All right, here we go. Wow, I know he came up on my phone. Yeah, it'll come up on your phone as though I'm putting turning the torch on. Here we go. Yeah, there you go. Yeah, that's sick. You can't see it on not. It's the it's the instant flash that doesn't blink like that sick. So yeah, so if you have any lights maybe like if you're a cyclist. That'd be crazy. Yeah, I've seen an artist in hozier line do it. You take a photo on this wall. And it's like a garage door. It's got all these holes in it. And it's
silver, new flash flash it and you see the art that's at its faculty. That's awesome. Alternating as nice as the whiteboard.
Yeah, if I can get a good poem. Oh, my God. Does it is it does it? Do you write it lock it finishes or is it something? Yeah, just putting things down.
Let me grab a moment.
have you done like a poetry read before? Oh man, this is this is it? This is this is number one. Really? Yep. Have you ever done slam poetry? I would love to I think that's a dream of mine. Yeah, it should be cool.
Yeah, here we go. So we were talking about when content gets sad.
right we'll make this a snippet on Instagram. So this is Campbell Walker presents the house plant blues.
My house plants are dying, and I'm feeling uninspired. I can't stop drinking coffee. And I can't stop feeling tired. Next week. I was last week I was high on life. Next week's up to chance but this week I'm a piece of shit enclosed by dying plans. I love it. Thank you fucking real good. Really? Cuz I can really relate
to healthy look real? Yeah, yeah. very relatable. The drinkie like I'm just tired. I need more coffee. Coffee makes me more
Yeah, and also like if you don't, you've said that you're a big water drinker. We haven't sort of kept it. Now that's filled up. But yeah, I mean, dehydration from coffee is real right? No gland. It's like that what it is? Yeah. When you when you've exhausted
you drink too much coffee and it's when you drinking caffeine does not lead to
your drain Oh gland mice just looking it up and saying hydration. No,
no No but it's the cut the coffee thing.
It even if you drink water, it's still you still fact. diminishing returns. It's also a diuretic. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. Can you have the coffee then you
can't. You can't drink enough water. Yeah. It says Oh, yeah, that's one of the big things with ecstasy. Isn't that like, you get thirsty and then you fucking drown? Yeah.
I remember when we were growing up. It was like
Take ecstasy pills and you will drown because you drink so much water is not true. It's not true. A party's a Bane to me.
Yeah, exactly. Yeah.
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, it was I think that was the skate technique of our generation. Yeah.
Drinking water is real. Yeah. Yeah. That's a daily talk show. I can tell ya. Thanks so much for being on the show. Thank you so much for having me. St. Louis. 69 on Instagram. Not that you really need any more. You probably got enough followers. Not until I hit a million then I can be happy.
I really appreciate that. I wasn't gonna say
yes, but on a talk show. Hi, the daily talk show.com is the email address. If you enjoy the podcast, give us a five star review on Apple podcast. Otherwise, just keep it to yourself.
Say tomorrow. Thank you.