Bianca Chatfield - The Block & Netball

Tommy: Wait a minute! Crossface!

Josh: The Daily Talk Show, a conversation sometimes worth recording with Josh Jensen and Tommy Jackett. The Daily Talk Show, everyone.

Tommy: Special guest joining us, Bianca Chatfield.

Bianca: Hello, boys. Yeah, yeah, am I working?

Josh: Yeah, yeah, we can hear you working.

Tommy: I thought you meant like, am I working? Am I on?

Bianca: Yeah, you're not getting paid for this, so, uh, so I'm not working. Just having a chat.

Tommy: But on the time that we are recording this, this is the first day that you've actually been able to say that you're on The Block.

Bianca: That I am on The Block. Do you know what? I feel like it hasn't even happened. Like I've wanted to do this for so long. I'm one of those obsessive people about the show. I've always watched it and I've always thought, you know what? I reckon I could do that. But obviously playing netball, you can't really do that.

Tommy: So I know someone who went up against you in a challenge for an audition for The Block. Previous year. So not the Gatwick, which is this season. So yeah, they hate you because you beat them, I think.

Josh: So for people who aren't from Australia, is The Block international? Like, do they have versions overseas?

Bianca: Well, they do, but also this series, or the Australian series, goes to air in 40 different countries.

Tommy: That's insane.

Bianca: So apparently even like we get translated into different languages.

Josh: You have like your own voice and shit.

Tommy: I do want to know who the translator is. Does that sound a bit A bit like me, really deep female voice.

Bianca: Yeah, Bianca. So back to how it all, what you have to go through. People think just because I'm a netballer that I just put up my hand and they're like, yep, you're on. But for this series, 45,000 teams applied.

Josh: And there'd be a lot of sporting people that probably—

Bianca: Apparently there is a lot of sporting people. We don't know because they don't ever tell you who else has applied.

Tommy: Plus you don't care 'cause you're on.

Bianca: 'Cause we're on. But we thought we were gonna be on last series and we went all the process. So you gotta go through all these interviews and then you've gotta do a challenge, which is where I met your mate and his wife. And we had to do that against each other, sort of trying to compete, but you gotta try and work together. And it's just a really odd environment. And then you go away and you just sit there waiting for your phone to ring, like for someone to tell you whether you're on or off. And when it came to the Elstonwick Series, I think we got told 10 days before we were meant to start start filming that we weren't on. And so when you kind of get that news, you're like, oh God, is it worth like waiting again for another 12 months to find out if we get on and going through this same thing where you got to give up your job and anything that you're doing just to take this opportunity?

Tommy: Well, the reality is there's people out there going, we should hold off having kids because we might be on this. Out of that footstool, such a big thing.

Josh: Didn't you like get to some level?

Tommy: Yeah, this was the year that they didn't do The Block and we entered because they never said that it wasn't gonna be The Block, but it was another show. Probably didn't get on because it didn't do too well.

Bianca: What was it? It was Renovation Rumble or something.

Tommy: Yes, I think it was that, but I don't know, nothing happened with it. But yeah, we did a few interviews and we met Lucky, who I'm sure you've met.

Bianca: Yes, Lucky is now a very good mate of mine.

Tommy: Yeah, so we did, but yeah, my wife was really keen on getting on. She probably still is. Yeah, I don't know how I'd go on reality TV. Like, I think about myself, but maybe I'm— I always think maybe I'm too media trained, if you will. Like maybe 'cause I've trained to be a presenter.

Josh: You definitely have a presenter type voice. Tommy and I have done shoots together where all he has to do is like ask a question to a beauty blogger. And he's like, so tell us, what's your favourite exfoliator?

Tommy: And I always think reality shows, they want loose units. How did you go?

Bianca: They do. Well, I think that's where I'm probably gonna be a bit of a disappointment 'cause I wasn't overly loose. And at different times they would try and say, come on girls, don't be like you're sporting type when you're getting interviewed after a game.. But you know what? There's plenty of other loose characters on the show with us this season. So they should provide all the ridiculous entertainment.

Tommy: They might be channelling the loose units that were at the Gatwick, which is the building that The Block's on this year.

Bianca: Do you know that was the hardest thing going in because you felt really sad because they still had all their belongings in the rooms, in the old hotel rooms. They had the old mattresses and the wardrobes and some clothes in the wardrobe. And you just were going through thinking, oh my gosh, someone lived here. And it's their photos on the wall.

Tommy: For context, the people who don't know what the Gatwick is, I grew up steering clear of it. It was, it's, am I right in saying that a woman inherited or her family owned it or she was rich and bought it and she almost was like someone looking to help people in need. And so they were cheap rooms.

Josh: Is this the one in St. Kilda?

Tommy: It is in a really lovely area that they, people could live in. And so there was a lot of drug addicts, and yeah, a guy got murdered out the front of it.

Josh: Yeah, was it like a halfway house? Is that a thing?

Bianca: So it used to be like back in the '30s— look at me, I've got all the history here— used to be a luxury hotel. So that's how it all started, and then it became, I guess, worse and worse. And yeah, the two sisters that inherited it just wanted to help people, and so let everybody in and obviously didn't charge a lot of rent to live there. But that there were people who were obviously very affected by drugs that lived there, but then there were also apparently a couple who had lived there for 30 years just because it was cheap rent and they loved the area.

Tommy: I know someone that was not doing too well and they went with somebody who was scoring heroin from there, and he was not a heroin addict. The person he was with was, and he said that he shat himself going in there. Like, so this is when people are living there. Yeah, he said people would be standing at the doors looking out and just like giving you these faces because they're like, who's this person? Is he a cop? And so it was like totally eerie, but on the other side, it's in a very expensive area and it's a grand old building. So it's like the perfect, perfect reno building.

Bianca: Well, it is. And probably the thing that made us feel good about what we were doing was that all the neighbours in the area would come up to us and they'd be like, if you need a shower, come to our house. Like we want you guys to do this. We want it to change the area. We need it to change the area. And they were all for it. So even noise complaints, I don't think we had too many of those throughout the whole series.

Josh: So was it bought, like how does it work? Was it bought by the producers or Channel 9 or like what's the process in this?

Bianca: Yeah, so Channel 9 buy the building, then they obviously get all the architects to come in and work out how it can be made into apartments. We go in there and do it. We're given a cash budget to do it and vouchers and whatever else over 12 weeks. And at the end it goes to auction. So, it goes to the auction at the end of October. And whatever the reserves are, which we don't know yet, anything that we make over the reserve, we get to keep. So—

Tommy: So, you're 100% gonna walk away with something if— We don't know. It's to say that—

Bianca: Like if it sells for exactly what the reserve is, then we don't get anything.

Josh: 'Cause wasn't there uproar in previous years where people walk away being like, "I've made absolutely nothing for all this time." Yeah, there definitely is.

Bianca: At different times, you can see people's reactions. They're either like super happy or they're disappointed. Do you know, I'd watch those auctions and I'd get, I'm not really an emotional person and I'd get so emotional watching it for them. And I can't even imagine sitting on that couch now in 4 months' time and actually having to see how it all plays out.

Josh: So the idea is that, how many teams are there?

Bianca: So there's 5 teams.

Josh: And they're all renovating a separate, it's like a unit apartment?

Bianca: Oh yeah, we've all got an apartment each.

Josh: Okay.

Bianca: So 3-bedroom, 3 or 2-bathroom and a powder room. So they're quite big.

Josh: And so have you got experience in renovating and stuff previously or what?

Bianca: A little bit, I've done 2 apartments before, but like little apartments, nothing like this.

Josh: Yeah.

Bianca: So it's kind of like a fake it till you make it mentality.

Josh: And so who did you partner up with?

Bianca: So I did it with a great friend of mine, Carla, who's also another netballer. So 2 girls on the show, both 6-foot-2 tall. So you can imagine all the tall jokes that are flying around every single day. But yeah, we just, We both knew we'd have the work ethic. Like we knew we'd stay up all night if we had to, to get it done. Whereas some of the other teams that, you know, the guys were trades like builders and that made life a lot easier. And the girls would sometimes go to bed at 10 o'clock at night and not stay up painting, whereas we had to.

Tommy: So whose idea was it to actually go on it?

Bianca: It was mine.

Tommy: As a team, you roped her in?

Bianca: Yep, I roped her in.

Tommy: She should be thankful.

Bianca: Yeah.

Josh: Well, depending on the outcome.

Tommy: Oh yeah, true, true, true.

Bianca: We probably hate and love each other at different times.

Josh: And so it's not like this is This isn't like a celebrity version or anything like this. This just happened. They just—

Bianca: Just your everyday people. That's who we are.

Josh: And so you're a netball player in Australia. When did that all finish up for you?

Bianca: I retired from the Aussie team at the Comm Games in 2014 in Glasgow. And then I retired from Melbourne Vixens the year after in 2015.

Tommy: You were captaining there?

Bianca: Yep, captain the Vixens, vice-captain of the Aussie team. And yeah, my body, I was 33, I think by the time I'd finished and my body was just dead.

Tommy: So you've been playing since you were 11 or something?

Bianca: Oh yeah. And 18, I made the Australian team as an 18-year-old, which is so young and in hindsight, probably too young. But yeah, I'd been smashing my body. I think just 'cause you're not really ready. Like your body's not really ready. I physically probably was, but your joints and everything, if you're on the court, Training every single day, it just takes its toll after a while.

Josh: Yeah, like knees and stuff.

Bianca: Yeah, my knees. Yeah, terrible.

Josh: Is that like a common netball— I feel like, uh, my experience is playing mixed netball for Envato, a tech company that did sort of lunchtime netball. That's sort of my career.

Bianca: What position did you play? Uh, oh, look, you'd be a wing defense, I think.

Josh: Yeah, absolutely. Always, always sort of, uh, definitely not a goalsman. Yeah, definitely not center.

Tommy: Goal shooter.

Josh: Where did even netball come from? Because Like you speak to, I feel like I've had international people come over and I'm trying to explain netball and they're thinking I'm talking about handball. They're like, do you mean handball? Do you mean lacrosse? I'm like, no. Basketball?

Bianca: Yes.

Josh: So where did netball actually come from?

Bianca: Well, it used to be called basketball. It was from England and they used to call it basketball. And then when it came out to Australia, we changed it to netball.

Tommy: But what was basketball called?

Bianca: Well, I think it was all just the same sport. And then it kind of like came to different things. They said the girls Yes. can't run.

Tommy: Yeah.

Bianca: No running.

Tommy: No traveling.

Bianca: Stop. Yeah.

Josh: Is it a female sport? Like, is it?

Bianca: Predominantly.

Josh: Yeah.

Bianca: But there is a men's Australian team. We used to play against them all the time with the female Australian team because they're taller and they're stronger and they're fitter. I mean, I hate to admit that, but they are. So we used to play against them quite a bit just for—

Tommy: My uncle owns Albert Park Indoor Sports Center. So that's the closest I've got. Indoor netball center.

Bianca: Yeah.

Tommy: I used to work there as a kid and hand out all the bibs.

Bianca: You didn't put on a bib yourself?

Josh: I never did.

Tommy: No, no, I used to play footy and stuff for club and school, but never did. I was there to make the bacon.

Josh: So what's—

Tommy: 12 bucks an hour.

Bianca: You don't get that playing netball, do ya?

Josh: What is the business model behind an athlete that's playing netball? Is it a full-time gig? Is it like—

Tommy: You're on the block, you don't know if you'll get money until the end.

Bianca: You don't really know what's happening. Well, when it all started, it was just a hobby really.. And I had to go to uni. I did a teaching degree at uni. Like you really have to have two parts of your life. Like you can't just rely on being an athlete. But fortunately for me, by the end of my career, so probably my last 5 years, I was a full-time athlete because sponsors are the ones that pay you more than what you actually get paid to play. And probably the most ridiculous thing that people don't realise is for us, we get paid more to play for your club than you do to play for your country.

Tommy: That's crazy.

Bianca: So you get government funding to play for your country?

Tommy: Well, the Olympic Games is a business in itself, isn't it?

Bianca: So the—

Josh: Yeah, but Melbourne's not, no.

Bianca: Melbourne's not Commonwealth Games. Melbourne's not Commonwealth Games, not Olympics. It's not in the Olympics. No, so yeah, you get more to play for Melbourne than you do to play for Australia. So then, yeah, I would make most of my money to survive just from sponsors.

Josh: Do you think that keeps you more grounded? Like I guess in some regards, there's other, people go off the rails when they finish sport. Probably having that balance, do you think you're less likely to sort of, you know, you hear the swimmers all go crazy?

Bianca: Yeah.

Tommy: Shout out to Thorpey.

Josh: No, no, Thorpey, I was thinking, you know, I remember when I was like, I used to be 120 kilos and I used to love, I used to love watching the swimmers get really fat after a career 'cause I just felt like—

Bianca: Did it make you feel better?

Josh: Yeah, it was a little bit of relatability. I'm like, you know what, maybe I could do this whole swimming thing. Maybe I'm all right.

Bianca: I'm fascinated by this. How did you lose the weight?

Josh: Oh, yo-yo dieting. No, it would be good to say that there was some, this is the opportunity for me to show one of my fat, like I look like—

Tommy: Yes, I love comparison photos. Paint the picture, Josh is 89, 88 now.

Josh: Yeah, I was probably 87 at the beginning of the week, probably 89.5 now.

Tommy: By the time you get back from Europe, 4 months.

Bianca: Oh, so you're in trouble.

Josh: Here's a photo from a few years ago of me there.

Bianca: Oh my goodness.

Josh: That was a Thailand trip. And sort of I'm on a boat there and I would have, I was wearing 3XL t-shirts, that was the best thing. But then I even had this more recent one, which was only 5 years ago.

Bianca: Oh my gosh, you look so different.

Josh: Yeah, it's like in the movie.

Tommy: You're a little American kid.

Josh: I look like I should have like a motorhome or something.

Bianca: What was the light bulb moment for you that triggered it?

Josh: So I, a bunch of things. I used to, I worked on a, I was a community manager on a film called Fat, Sick Nearly Dead, which was like a juicing type film.

Bianca: Is that on Netflix?

Josh: Yeah, it's on Netflix. At the time, it was the biggest documentary on Netflix before it came to Australia and all that sort of thing. And weight was always a big thing, but it was definitely, I used to be that, that's like, it was sugar. Sugar was 100% the thing. And so for me, it was realising that I would never feel satiated, and the reason was, was because I wasn't actually eating food, like I wouldn't eat meals. Yeah, so I'd not eat all day and then I would have like heaps of chocolate, which would have been like 200— sorry, 2,000 calories I'm probably eating in sweet food, but there was actually nothing in my stomach. So I think the biggest shift I made was going to 2 meals a day.

Bianca: Yeah.

Josh: And, um, I think that the other thing that was counterintuitive was I wouldn't have breakfast, like I, I would used to have breakfast and it was always really unhealthy, 'cause the whole storey is you should have breakfast and it was at a time where I remember mum saying to me, well, it's better, I remember being in like Vanuatu on a holiday when I was a kid and I was having doughnuts and she's like, well, you know what, like doughnuts is better than nothing. And I really don't, I don't stand by that motto. I think that's a motto. So yeah, I lost a bunch of weight and so it's been over the last few years is keeping, you know, I keep it off and I definitely, Tony Robbins calls it zigging and zagging, which is sort of going like, it's sort of, I'll have a day where I'm maybe eating more calories and then I'll have a day, it's almost like the 5:2 diet if you know.

Bianca: I really like 5:2 actually, 'cause I feel like, now I've gotta change my eating now, I'm not playing, but yeah, I like to be able to have a couple of days where I just literally have the bare minimum because you don't need that much food.—

Josh: I think it's a good reminder too, where it's like you can do without. Like I used to think that being hungry was this like really bad feeling and I would straight away eat something versus like feeling it out. And 'cause what I find is that like the hunger lasts for a really short period of time. And so the other big thing was just thinking about things like insulin and like spot and realising that, oh, like if I have something sweet at the beginning of the day, if I have pancakes in the morning, that's gonna like throw everything else out.

Tommy: If you think about your body, you're taking in this stuff like sugar, it's actually then working really hard to regulate you. So it's like your body's under pressure when you're eating all this sugar.

Josh: But the biggest shift I think, 'cause I've done every single diet you can think of, I've done ketogenic, I've done Whole30, I've done slow carb, everything, I've done juice fasting, and so—

Tommy: Lemon detox?

Josh: Yeah, I never did the lemon detox, but the thing with the juicing one was horrendous I was the community manager of this film. And so there was this whole thing where you'd say juice on, like you drink juice and there was a 2-week juice fast. And the first video I made was me filming myself saying, "Hey everyone, it's Josh, the Australian community manager, juice on." I would have been 20 at the time. And I started drinking and I vomited up the juice because I put too much ginger, I love gingerbread, not the same as putting ginger into this. Fresh ginger. Yeah, so I put like, they said put a thumb in, I've already got a fat thumb. And so I put a lot of ginger into this and sort of burn that, but I basically did 2 weeks of drinking orange juice. Like it was so bad, it was so like, and I got a DEXA scan done and I'd lost like, I'd lost in 2 weeks, I'd lost over 15 kilos.

Tommy: Holy shit.

Josh: Yeah, but it was like 7 kilogrammes of lean muscle. I was literally like dying. You're meant to have vegetables and salad and sort of plant-based stuff to sort of go back into eating. And the first meal I had was a curry with coconut rice. It was like the worst, just horrendous.

Tommy: Much chicken, you mean?

Bianca: Did you do much exercise? 'Cause this is what people think. People think that you lose weight because of exercise that you do, but it's like, we've always been told it's like 70% nutrition and 30% the exercise that you do that can help you be whatever you wanna be.

Josh: Well, I think that's the stage I'm at. At now is, so the way that I lost it too was 'cause I had two herniated discs. So my back was fucked. So I was like, I'm gonna, so I started walking a lot and that was a big thing. I'd walk 10 kilometres a day, 5 kilometres to and from my work at the time. So that was really helpful. But the thing that Tommy is trying to instil now, and it's very much the Craig Harper sort of, you know, life philosophy. Stop fucking around. Which is correct. Which is fucking lift some heavy stuff.

Tommy: And 'cause I haven't done that, I think when you got the food right, which you do now, it's more under control. It's like then if that's your normal now, let's then add on something like normal exercise, make exercise normal.

Josh: Yeah.

Tommy: How different when you left? How much weight did you gain? How much training were you doing? And then at what point does it cut off?

Bianca: Like, would you mean when I retired?

Josh: Yeah.

Tommy: So from a pro athlete to—

Bianca: So we would train every day, like whether it be strength training, court work, keeping fit, all of that. And I think that your body gets so used to that kind of training that as soon as I retired, I actually got leaner because I would lose all this bulky muscle that I had on me and I would just get like skinny arms. And I was like, oh, this is really weird. I'm not used to being like this. But I would keep training just doing cardio 'cause I had this real thing about, I've spent so much time lifting weights, I just don't wanna lift weights anymore. I don't wanna have my big swimming shoulders and I can't stand it. So yeah, then I actually got a lot leaner and found that exercise for me became something I kept doing most days 'cause it mentally made me feel good. Like it was time away from my phone and yeah.

Tommy: Did you enjoy training more, taking it from a job to a thing you're just wanting to do?

Bianca: And you know, some days when you're like, I just can't be bothered going, or I just wanna go and, like fluff around on a cross trainer and watch TV at the gym rather than do something that's really intense and really hard. And that was probably the biggest adjustment, going from absolutely flogging your body where it makes you feel good, like you've done something, to then just exercising that's good for you. It's not needing to flog your body all the time.

Tommy: I feel like mom's cooking when we left the house, she actually enjoyed cooking rather than having to cook for 3 boys.

Bianca: Exactly, that's right. There's something you find the love for it 'cause it's different.

Josh: Group training I can't stand.

Bianca: Why not?

Josh: Oh, come on, mate. I just, I can't do, like I can't do with social situations already.

Tommy: Everyone's pussy and panty, you don't need to talk about it.

Josh: But the thing is it's social situations and then putting something that I'm not good at. It's sort of like a panic attack waiting to happen.

Bianca: You would hate F45 then. Yeah, well I do that a lot, you would hate it.

Josh: Well, I've tried doing, I've done so many different types of, I've had so many PTs over the years.

Tommy: I get frustrated having conversations with Josh as you can tell. Tell the themes of them, but it's like, how would you suggest for someone to find something? Do you even need to go to the gym?

Josh: I think like, I think there's something weird about driving somewhere to then get out of your car and to exercise versus just like go, like actually doing the exit, like going like for a run or like doing something that's self-contained. I just feel like the—

Tommy: Yeah, I feel the same. I used to be a PT, yeah, banker, and I would always say if driving to the gym is the thing that gets you to do the thing, that's fine. Because if you're at the, you know, Bayside, you know, muscle gym on the beach and you're doing chin-ups and stuff and that's your thing, then that's cool. It's just about removing any of those barriers. Oh, it's too cold outside, we'll go to the gym.

Bianca: Well, that's the thing. I hate the weather and if it's cold, I ain't going outside. So F45 for me, I like it 'cause I go and you sign up You don't know what you're doing. And when you get there, you're just locked in. Like you can't leave once you see how hard it's gonna be. And so you just have to do it for 45 minutes.

Tommy: Sounding like a cult.

Bianca: No, it is kind of. You're there, you're locked in. But it's social, like it's fun. And I just feel normal rather than people seeing you as being an athlete. 'Cause I can fluff around and do nothing if I really feel like it, or I can train hard. But I like the fact that you gotta go and you're locked into a time.

Josh: Yeah, well, my girlfriend Bray, she's like, she's got like a certificate of the most, like she's attended the most classes at her training. Over 600 in a row or something. It's quite insane.

Tommy: Josh and I talk about the bubble of radio. We both worked in it.

Josh: Yeah.

Tommy: And when we kind of, you know, you're so in it and everything's about radio and you leave, you're like, there's life after radio.

Josh: Yeah.

Tommy: Is that the same for netball? What's the bubble of netball?

Bianca: You know, that is the same for netball. It's the same for The Block. Like, it's like you're in this bubble and you can't even see outside of it. You can't even understand that there's people in the world that don't care about it when it consumes every thought that you ever have. And The minute I retired, I almost found it, I think I thought to myself, why did I play for so long when 1% of the world, probably if that, care about netball? It was really weird. And I keep saying it to players now that still play. I'm like, don't worry, when you finish, no one even cares. And I don't know if that's a good thing or not to promote.

Tommy: You're speaking Spanish at that point.

Bianca: Yeah, it's crazy.

Tommy: I remember hearing that stuff.

Bianca: But it's also nice to know that there's so many exciting things to look forward to. And that's what I think the difference is, having a balanced kind of career as a netballer or female athlete, we've gotta have other stuff to do. When you do finish, you do have plenty of options. And when shit's going wrong in netball, am I allowed to swear on this thing?

Josh: Yeah, absolutely.

Bianca: Great. When shit's going wrong in netball, you can go to work and put your energy into something else. And it helps you kind of recover from the average game that you played on the weekend. Where if you're in that full time, it's just so consuming and you can't escape it.

Josh: —so do you get good at working in teams? I feel like that's the other thing about this whole gym thing is like, I think I would, I'm good as an individual doing stuff, but it's the sort of team stuff that I think dynamic. I remember when I was, 'cause maybe I'm hashtag triggered from when I was an overweight kid and I was always the last one to run when I was playing footy. The footy team couldn't start training until everyone had run around the oval and I was always the last one. And the captain was sort of like this really fit dude, and he would sort of— it was a bit patronising but really nice. Like, everyone done it, and he would sort of jog on this, like, come on, mate, you can do it. Everyone's just sort of like eye rolling, just being like, man, this is—

Tommy: does he have a podcast now?

Josh: Yeah, he was winning.

Tommy: Is he being a chap in the room right now?

Josh: He's a bodybuilder now, actually. Uh, but the— yeah, how do you go with team dynamics? Is it something that's just naturally you enjoy?

Bianca: Yeah, I think it definitely is natural, but I think you also see the importance of it and how, like, I know I'm much better when I'm around great people, like whether it's that add to your vibe or the positive energy that they give you if you might be having a bad day. I could not imagine being an individual athlete or playing tennis or golf. Tennis, like poor Nick Kyrgios, we know he's got a lot of issues, but he doesn't understand what it's like to have teammates there who pull you into line before the general public get the opportunity to. And I do think that it'd be really tough for any individual athlete and even kind of using that team element when you go on to something like The Block, that's so kind of foreign for me. The first thing we did was make sure that we had all of our trades were similar age to us, like were good people, we got to know them before the show. We really wanted to surround ourselves with those people that we knew would help us because it was gonna be a really shit experience if we just went in there with people who we didn't know or didn't wanna put effort and time into. You were the leader.

Tommy: Of the cult. No, you're the leader of the team that you were playing with. How does the team element come into that when you're, I mean, you're leading the team versus just being a part of the team. You still are. Is it a different dynamic to just being a player?

Bianca: Yeah, and some people love it and some people hate it. It almost made me play better being the leader because I enjoyed putting time into other people. Like I loved seeing the youngest kids do really well. 'Cause when I first started playing, the oldest players or the captains gave me nothing. Like didn't even care whether I was playing well or not. It was almost like I was threatened by anyone who was coming up. So I always remember how they made me feel. And so it was always at the forefront of my mind that no matter who we had in our team, no matter how good they were, that you didn't ever wanna make them feel how I felt when I was younger. And it made me play better 'cause you're so out of your own head 'cause you're thinking, okay, how's she going? Is she going all right? Yep, she's playing well, great. Gotta encourage her, gotta keep her up, gotta keep her positive 'cause I know she might be struggling. So you're constantly thinking about other people and then you just have to play.

Josh: I think that's the key even with my stuff is I do well when I'm the leader. I'm not good at being told what to do.

Tommy: Is there benefits in going through being told what to do? Like I guess you being the player and also the leader player.

Bianca: Yeah, but I think it depends if you see success or not. Like if you're told what to do and it never works out, you never kind of understand or wanna believe in it. Whereas if you see you're doing it and you see it works, and then you kind of carry it on as you get older and older.

Josh: I just remember a PT saying, yelling at me, "Do you want the abs?" And I just like yelled back at him and said, "You don't even fucking have abs." And so I feel like when you're coming from that sort of place, like I feel like in those moments you have the option of sort of be like taking that energy in a really positive way and being like, "Yeah, I want the abs." But I just could never, I could never sort of bow my head down and let that sort of happen.

Bianca: Do you reckon you can be, there's so much about role modeling, I reckon. Do you reckon you can be a fat, this is probably so inappropriate. A fat PT.

Tommy: I reckon it's on you a lot when I was, and I remember being the class that I was in when I did it with probably 20 other people. I reckon 5% of them went on to actually be personal trainers. But I remember just being in the room and I was young, 17 at the time, looking around and just thinking, God, they are not PTs. But then I remember seeing some ones that were overweight. So I guess it's depending on where you're coming in. And are you going to be just someone who has a lot of knowledge in their brain? Then you probably could be one that's overweight. But if you're wanting to condition people for competition, then maybe you need to have proven it. It's like the business coach that has no business chops. Yeah. Never scaled a business. Yeah. And they're teaching people how to scale business.

Josh: Yeah, that's what I mean. Maybe like, I think I'd probably be more worried about like the fat dietitian because at least like— Doctors, there's a lot of fat doctors. Yeah, well, I mean, that's, it's almost like, especially I feel like this happens in the US, you see these like films about diabetes and stuff like that, and then you see the experts come on screen. I think it's a hard gig for the person who, like, because there feels like there's a bit of a misalignment, doesn't it? Yeah, yeah, like what they're saying versus what they're sort of, yeah, how they're projecting themselves.

Bianca: I reckon there's a lot of dietitians out there that have come from eating disorders or things that have kind of got them passionate about that field, but they're healthy obviously when they're practicing. I think that's okay because you've at least pulled yourself out of—

Josh: You've gone through the journey. That's why like so many psychologists are a bit fucked up, bit tweaked. They've all had their sort of—

Tommy: Well, you're the leader of the team, the girls, and then you obviously had the people above you the coaches? Was there, did you ever get a bit of that, "Don't tell me what to do." Not really, it depends.

Bianca: I definitely, and I don't know if this is right or wrong, but I definitely had a lot more respect for coaches that I knew had been players. Respect's probably the wrong word, but that you just gravitated to what they said if they've lived and breathed and felt what you were going through at the time. And Simone McInnes, who's the coach of the Vixens now, and I had her, and she was a gun Australian player. So I was almost intimidated by her the minute she'd try and tell me things to do. I'd be like, oh God, oh, I played bad in front of her. And you just had this different feeling to a coach who probably usually comes through like a teaching background and might've played netball, but not necessarily at the highest level. You kind of struggle to see how they see it from your point of view.

Josh: Yeah, it's really interesting. I wonder, because I've been, Thinking a lot about the difference between sort of mentorships and coaching and sort of coaching, not necessarily within the sporting context, but sort of in sort of more sort of life or business. And someone's telling us the other day, I think even maybe Peter Shepherd, who we've had on previously, talking about, you know, coaching is about asking questions and getting the person to come up with their own answers. What was some of the, mechanisms you learned as a leader that you've taken on through The Block, through business?

Bianca: Probably getting to know the people that you're working with. So even if it's spending 2 minutes, you know, speaking to the girls on their own about what's going on in their world, what they're studying, kind of understanding them as people, not just as a netballer. That to me, I always felt much better about it when people did it to me and knew me as a person. And so I would try and do that. And I think that's And that's kind of helped me in that, you know, a lot of our tradies, for example, might've done something on the weekend or something they were passionate about, they were going off and they were excited to do. And then so the first time we'd see them on a Monday morning, we'd be like, how was it? Tell us about it, show us photos.

Josh: How was the rodeo?

Bianca: Yeah, you just, it's things that excites other people. They just come out of their shell when you trigger that emotion in them that you're interested in, that you care. And so, yeah, I definitely tried to do that as a captain and I've played much better for coaches that tried to do that to me as well.

Josh: Do you need to be liked as a leader?—

Bianca: Oh, I don't think so. By the end, I—— Do you?— Well, I think to some degree, probably yes. But there were definitely players that didn't like me. But ultimately, as I was getting older and more experienced, all I cared about was that they would respect that I put the team first. 'Cause sometimes decisions don't suit everyone. And that's what a leader has to make those decisions and calls, but only if it's the right thing for the team, not for me as such. So that's hard. It's hard to be selfless in an environment like that. But that's what I would always say was number one. And then if that pissed some girls off, then so be it. I'd try and kind of mend the relationship, but there's not much I could do about it if they didn't respect me for putting the team first.

Tommy: Have you got thick skin, do you think?

Bianca: Yeah, I think I developed it definitely over time and just learned not to worry about shit I can't control. Like if a coach hated me, like one of the Aussie coaches dropped me at one stage and she just was off me. You know when you're not a favourite and you just know you can't change your mind, no matter how you play, you know she's just done with me. And so I just had to learn to let that go. And it took me ages. It took speaking to people like Craig Harper, who would always be someone I'd go to, where he'd just try and kind of coach me through that. Just let her go. Like you can't even change her mind. So you've just got to go back to the level below, play as well as you can, kind of your time will come again when you can go back up. Up, and it happened when that coach retired and the new one came in, and I was like, yes, just kick them out.

Josh: Here we go. What was the crossroads like when you were— so 18, things were going big for you from a netball point of view. What was the other options? Um, I didn't really have any.

Bianca: Well, I went to uni and did a teaching degree.

Josh: Yeah, but that wasn't like— like a PE teacher?

Bianca: PE science. That's my qualification.

Josh: I know my first 20 elements, which is probably the most sciencey thing I know. Was that plan B?

Tommy: Was it all like?

Bianca: Well, no, 'cause I was always gonna do both. 'Cause I didn't realise that netball was gonna be 100% my full-time job. So I just thought I would do both for as long as I could, but I only ended up teaching part-time for a couple of years and then have never done it since, so.

Josh: Did you ever, did you have moments of dealing with shithead kids and just being like, how the fuck am I here when I'm like top of my game? Not playing for Australia.

Bianca: Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Josh: Is there a little bit of that? Like it is an amazing achievement. I'm at the top of my fucking game and here I am subbing in for these little assholes who won't do what they're told.

Bianca: Well, it was more the teachers that I found. The kids, I love the naughty kids 'cause they were the ones with personalities. Like they were the ones that like would make me laugh. And 'cause I was teaching as a 21-year-old and a lot of the girls I was teaching with like 17, 18 'cause they were in year 12. And so it was very odd to be in that environment, but I love the naughty ones. And then it was the staff who I'd be going, "Oh, I've gotta go to Jamaica for 3 weeks with the Aussie team." And the staff would bitch and moan behind my back. And I'd just be like, "You know what?

Josh: I can't deal with this." It's another small world, isn't it? Schools are hilarious like that.

Bianca: Oh yeah, politics.

Tommy: I'm like, "Please, I don't need to be part of this." Ego and competitiveness, do you think they go hand in hand? Like, you know, business, I guess money's the thing that really pulls out egos. But I guess when you're up against a bunch of people Ego can help thrust you forward in some respects.

Josh: It's a confidence thing.

Bianca: Yeah, everyone has it. That's right. It's just how much it controls you, I think. In the sport world, how do you find it? Yeah, everyone has it. Everyone, I think the smart people use it to their advantage and tone it down when it's obviously becoming a disadvantage. It's like you kind of learn how to control it. But the competitiveness, I think it's gotta be inbuilt in you to be an athlete in the first place. Yeah. I don't think I could.

Tommy: I couldn't be one. An athlete? No.

Josh: No, either could I. It's got nothing to do with our mental state and more to do with our sporting abilities.

Bianca: The minute I finished playing, I've not gone back on the netball court. I've got no interest in playing netball again. As soon as I retired, that competitiveness just disappeared. Interesting. And that's what I wasn't expecting. And people want to compete with me now and I'm like, oh, I can't be bothered.

Josh: Where do they compete with you?

Bianca: Well, whether it might be at F45, they want to challenge me or— Because they know you can. 'Cause they know I've been fit, so they wanna try and smash me. 'Cause they're like, oh, you used to be an athlete.

Tommy: It's gonna be their bubble. They get to work, guys, I smashed Bianca Chatfield today at the gym.

Bianca: No worries that she's old now and can't run. And then they kept saying that to us on The Block actually. They were like, come on, you two are really competitive. And we're like, yeah, but we're not experts in this area. We're competitive within ourselves to get the best out of ourselves, blah, blah, blah. But we're certainly not wanting to like, tell a builder over there that we're way better than him, then we're gonna beat him because he's the expert and we're not.

Tommy: Have you seen any of The Block back yet?

Bianca: No, well, they showed us the first episode while we were filming and that's it.

Tommy: If you were to like write yourself as like a character you're writing for the Herald Sun, what have they painted you as? 'Cause we know how crafty we can be editing videos. What are you? And is it noticeable that they've sort of painted you in a light?

Bianca: I reckon every week's really quite different, but we're definitely like the two sporty girls, like best friends, like have a bit of fun, always kind of the happy positive ones, yet are trying to be quite savvy on the side. So that's how it kind of plays out for us. But I don't really know how it's gonna be edited. So we're certainly not the villains, but it doesn't mean we don't get into conflict with people. Like we certainly get into conflict with people, but we tried as hard as we can to not be a bitch.

Josh: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Was it what you expected?

Bianca: Probably like work ethic and that side of things, yes. Although it pushed me more than I probably ever thought. The lack of sleep is the hardest thing to deal with.

Josh: I know we talk about this so much. If Josh doesn't get his 8 hours, 'cause he's grumpy. Really? Yeah, I need 8 hours. It's really sad, isn't it?

Bianca: No, I'm with you if you can get it. We go Friday, sometimes we went all Friday night, no sleep. Were you effective though?

Josh: This is the thing that I wonder, like there's this diminishing returns that I find that happens where I'm like, I'm awake right now and it feels a bit tokenistic 'cause I'm doing nothing productive.

Tommy: Josh, maybe in real life, reality TV, it's great. Yeah, yeah. Keep them awake, get them crazy. That's the whole thing.

Josh: I know that with like Married at First Sight and stuff, I had a friend do that. No, they, they, um, a friend was telling me how she was one of the bridesmaids and they basically get them pissed, but then they also like hold them off for a long period of it. Like, they just— the producers have these techniques just to really get you pissed off when your buzz is gone after you've been drunk and then you're tired, you just want to go home.

Tommy: Then you'd be real crabby. Did you—

Josh: are there tactics like that?

Bianca: Well, not, not really.

Josh: So the —You got machinery, you don't wanna necessarily be drunk and tired with a chainsaw or whatever you're using.

Bianca: —No, there's not much drinking that goes on at all. Like it's very much that we're treated like adults. Like we're given a car, we can drive wherever we want. Like you don't have to be on site if you don't wanna be. We stay there, we obviously live there, but you have your mobile phone on you 24/7. Like you can communicate with whoever you want to in the real world. We would drive home on a Sunday, do our washing 'cause we're from Melbourne. So yeah, there's little things like that where it's very different, I think, to other reality shows. Like apparently on MasterChef, the contestants get their phone for 2 10-minute phone calls a week. That's all they're allowed their phones for. That's outrageous, isn't it? Yeah, I know, that's what I think. I'm like, why would you do that? But I think The Block is good, but I haven't been on any other ones, so I don't know.

Josh: And so how much are they actually recording? Like, do you get a sense that anytime you're on location, they're recording audio and they're sort of, or do you feel like a start and stop type of thing?

Bianca: No, no, so they, as soon as they wake up in the morning, wake you up about 6 AM. So they wake you up? Yeah, camera crew, boom mic.

Josh: This is like North Korea type of shit.

Tommy: Just like, and I'd like someone to come wake me up in the morning.

Bianca: Yeah, with a camera in your face.

Josh: Minus the camera. Scott Cam is Kim Jong-un. It's got that vibe. And so yeah, what's the deal? So you wake up with cameras and stuff. Would you have a face of, did you sleep with makeup on or you just didn't give a fuck?

Bianca: I just didn't care in the end.

Josh: —in the end? So it was a lot of interviews.

Bianca: No, no, like I'd wake up before the cameras and we were quite often up and about before they came into the room. And then by the end you just can't move. So you're like, I'm staying here until I have to get up. But then as soon as you actually get up, then they physically put a mic on you and you've got that mic on you probably till about 11 o'clock at night until you go to bed. So you're always being recorded. There's car cams in the cars. So you're always recorded when you're in the cars.

Josh: Any awkward like toilet situations? I remember—

Bianca: I would always unplug to go to the toilet. Yeah, good idea. Everyone would though. I don't know if that's 'cause I've got experience working in the media that I'm like, everyone's listening, like unplug.

Josh: I know, I remember when I was, I worked at the fire brigade in the media department and I was looking through training footage and a guy was wearing a helmet cam. This was early days of helmet cams and he'd forgotten about it and went to the toilet. And I just, it was that very quick, like scrubbing through the footage, like whoa, whoa.

Bianca: I know the poor editors that have to edit all that footage. There's like 220 hours a week of footage they get. And they've got to edit it into 4 hours.

Josh: Do you actually spend much time hanging out and chatting with the crew or are they sort of separated?

Bianca: No, we do. We did quite a bit. If anything, you'd be painting and the crew would be walking around and I'd be having a chat to them the whole time and they'd be like, "Shut up, Bianca. We can't just have you talking to us on camera all the time." But no, it was like a family. Like, The Block is like this family of the whole crew work on every series. They've been there for 10 years. They all really love the show and want it to be successful. Successful. So yeah, I don't know, they care about us too. Like there's a lot of times where they were quite worried about us or they would make sure that we were eating or they'll make sure that we didn't drive the car if we hadn't had enough sleep. Like they were just very protective and I really liked that about it. How bizarre is reality television?

Josh: Well, the funny thing is that within the radio industry, it's sort of a lot of people sort of complain and moan about the idea that all these up and coming radio people Yeah. You know, Tommy did Shepparton for 2 years out in regional radio.

Tommy: Got my phone for 10 minutes every 2 days.

Josh: And all the, you know, for a number of years it's quite common for, you know, metro radio stations to pick you up, you know, pick up reality stars because you already have a bunch of brand equity. Channel 9's chucked a bunch of money. Have you been thinking about how you're actually going to leverage the opportunity And is it something that the producers will coach you through or help you through? Or do you feel like there's support in that way?

Bianca: Not really. Like there's probably like two completely different things 'cause the show have their own objectives. And if you wanna be on it, you've gotta kind of do whatever they want you to do. But for me, like I've done bits of radio too. I was on this EON Sports station and I was doing brekkie radio on that. And that lasted 6 months until they stopped paying me. Oh, that was with Tara.

Tommy: Yes, with Tara. My wife's good friends with Tara.

Bianca: Yes. So I was doing that and like love the radio world, do a bit of media with on Channel 7 actually, different station on House of Wellness with Chemist Warehouse. So I go and present storeys on fitness and health, whether it be about kids or, so I kind of love that part of my job and I would like to do more of that. I just used to get so annoyed that everyone would put you in like the netball category. Like they're like, oh, you're just a netballer. Or, you know, how can you, like I'd be talking about AFL and rugby and everything on radio, which I loved, but yet people very much much put you in this netball thing. So I'm hoping that out of the block, people just see you as Bianca and not as Bianca the netballer.

Josh: It feels like a good opportunity for me to bring up rebranding. I mention this every single show we have. So I've actively had a rebrand, personal rebrand, new glasses, clothing, all that sort of thing. You see, I do feel great. Tommy, you know, I've had a bunch of mates, especially mates who you've been friends with for a while, they pick up on it. It's like, what do you think you're doing? You're changing your look. Do you think— What are you trying to do, mate?

Tommy: Something feels off? Yeah, something's a bit off.

Josh: What do you try? You've been a bit tryhard. Do you think, have you ever had the desire to do a bit of a rebrand? And when you left netball and things like that, have you actively sort of drawn a line in the sand and said, I want to be seen as something else?

Bianca: Probably was retiring is when I had a bit of a, I had your first year, any athlete says this, any footballer will say your first year out after retiring, you like work your ass off 'cause you've got all these opportunities. Everyone comes at you like, yeah, we want you to do this, do this, do this. And I was doing the commentary for the netball on Channel 10 and I'm travelling around all weekend. And I just said to myself, what am I doing? I gave up netball to get a life back and to get weekends back. Yet I'm travelling every weekend, calling the netball and watching more netball than I did when I played. And it was probably at that moment that I was like, okay, as much as it's easy for me to get work in the netball space, I really wanna branch out from that and go and experience this big bad world of all these other stuff, whether it be sport or like the leadership part, which I'm obviously passionate about from my experiences through sport. So it was probably that moment then where I was like, right, I'm gonna have to say no deliberately to jobs, even though it might cost me for a little while, but branch out into this other area that I will know will give me many more opportunities if I just hang in there.

Josh: Do you remember the specific step, the first step into that? New world?

Bianca: I think it was just simply saying no to— it was about saying no to Melbourne Vixens, about going back and working there and helping them in the leadership space. It was about saying no to netball commentary opportunities. I was just like, I gotta get out of here. I've got to be a different person to what everyone knows me in the netball world.

Josh: For me, it was saying no to cargo pants, which is sort of really slightly similar.

Tommy: Yeah. And those shirts, they're Just Buy, Just Jeans?

Josh: Oh yeah, I've had a few. Best and Less, I used to— well, 'cause when I was a— not to bring it back to me being a fat kid, but I will.

Bianca: Does this come up every podcast? Yeah, absolutely.

Tommy: It's actually a therapy session. It's a therapy session.

Josh: It's the cheapest way we can do it. No, but I remember watching Queer Eye for the Straight Guy and they talked about vertical being very slimming, vertical stripes. Oh yes, yeah. So I was sort of like a 13-year-old going to parties in sort of business, a business shirt. Sort of style.

Bianca: I was looking fabulous.

Tommy: As you can tell, Josh is a thinker. Yeah. Very analytic. Well, he's analytic on himself. I think it's an awareness of where he is and what he's doing. What are you like? Are you someone that reflects in the moment or down the track?

Bianca: No, I don't know. That's tricky. Like I had a similar experience with the Stripes, but it was more, I knew when I was out there on court 'Cause when you're playing for Australia, you're in this tiny little gold dress. Like gold is not great for anybody. It's not slimming. Is it like metallic gold? No, it was just like a yellow really.

Josh: It's yellow. Terrible gold. You're playing it up calling it gold. Yes, 'cause I'm trying to be respectful. I don't remember it being gold.

Bianca: Green and gold, you know, our colours and all of that. But there was a moment where fake tan started to become quite fashionable. And so you knew when you would watch the games back on TV, you'd be like, hang on, when I've got fake tan on, I look so much fitter. And I look much better wearing yellow. So I remember that moment that from then on, every single game I played, I was fake tanned up to the max.

Tommy: Is this weird? I look at like soccer players and AFL footy players and I think, how the fuck have these guys lucked out? Half of them are really good looking. They're really good at sport. They got lots of money. This is bullshit.

Josh: I wonder what comes first. Maybe they were all picked on the teams.

Bianca: Go back and see their like photos when they were drafted and they've all got like acne skin and they all look like these tiny little teenage kids. And then all of a sudden they all get like a dose of Roaccutane and sort of add some money to that.

Tommy: And just start reflecting. Is it something you're conscious about? Like, are you thinking, okay, eyes on me now? Like, did that get to your head? 'Cause I could imagine it would for some.

Bianca: It became an addiction for us in the team all the time.

Tommy: The spray tans? The spray tans.

Bianca: Really? Like honestly, like to the point where—

Josh: You had a tent in the back or whatever.

Bianca: Yeah, well, we would travel like overseas with the Aussie team, like whether it be a Comm Games or a World Champs. We'd have spray tanners come into the hotel and spray us before a test match.

Josh: It's like you got to pick budget-wise between having an osteo or having a spray tan.

Bianca: And some of the girls got like, they were qualified in tanning. I don't know what that qualification involves, but they would bring the spray gun and we'd like wreck the bathrooms in the hotels because we'd stand in the shower and they'd spray us and it'd go everywhere. And we're like, oh, we're leaving tomorrow, we'll be fine. Is any of this action on the No, I was doing a little tan job on my own, just making sure that I, 'cause also Carla, who I'm doing with my friend, she's got beautiful dark skin. So I look albino next to her. So I had to kind of make sure that I at least didn't look too pale and pasty.

Josh: What's that, what's like com games like? Like what's the vibes in those sort of environments in regards to like community, like when it comes to, Basically what I wanna know is, you know, like the Olympics, they talk about the village, it's a big sex fest and all that sort of thing.

Tommy: I've heard that, the village. Do they hand out condoms? Yeah.

Josh: Something like that? Like all these like big sporting events and stuff, like what is the vibe like? Do people like, do you have friends from all the different countries?

Tommy: Just before you speak, there's a bunch of good looking athletes in a village, I could only imagine what goes down.

Bianca: Well, yeah, it is like that, it is. 'cause you're finally a part of a bigger team than just your team, and that's all you're usually used to. So you get in there and like in the massive dining hall that's got every single cuisine that you could want, it's not healthy food, it's just whatever's there. And you know, you have Usain Bolt just sitting over at the table next to you. Like it's the most ridiculous world. And the condoms, they don't hand out as such, but in like the medical team offices, there's all these like big bowls of them that people can just grab if they want to. The thing for netball though is we were always, our event went from day one and we were the last event before the closing ceremony all the time. So the swimmers would race for the first couple of days, they were done, they would just party.

Josh: And they would gain like 20 kilos. Yeah, they would.

Bianca: And then they'd retire and then they'd get fat and then there were all sorts of disasters. But yeah, so I felt like as netball, as much as it was great to win a gold medal and get to the last game, we missed out on a lot of partying 'cause we only got one night of it. Whereas most people got at least 5 or 6.

Josh: Were you involved in the coverage of the Gold Coast stuff?

Bianca: No, I was in the Block bubble. I didn't even get to watch it. So, a lot of the girls were texting me saying what was going on, but yeah, we weren't really able to watch it.

Josh: 'Cause I actually went to the Gold Coast. Not at the same time though. It wasn't for the Comm Games, it was during the Comm Games, but it was because it was quiet. And so I just like, it was such an interesting vibe. What do you mean it was quiet? Well, so my mate had an apartment in Surfers Paradise or whatever. And he said, "Oh man, come up, there's like no one here." And so I went up and it was like they had traffic, people sort of directing traffic, like, you know, with the big sort of red sticks or whatever. And there's literally no one crossing the road. It was like a really, and so you'd go into restaurants and I was speaking to this dude who had a Persian restaurant who was like, you know, this was, he was like ready for like a really, big, you know, all the businesses were told this was gonna be, you know, a really big event and it hadn't been more quiet.

Tommy: And some people lost money because they actually didn't get bookings, people left at that time, like locals got out of there. But so were there crowds at the events?

Josh: Well, the events were all filled up, like the actual events were all full, like I couldn't even get into because it was all like a last-minute thing, there was very few actual events, so I didn't go to any of events, but on the street they had really good like live shows and stuff, music performances and all that sort of thing, which was really cool. But it was really quiet. It felt like it was one of those, you know, when it feels like they've over-invested in something and it like looks amazing and you're like, this would be awesome if there was just like a few hundred thousand more people.

Tommy: Where was yours? The one that you competed in?

Bianca: Oh, I played in Glasgow and I also played in Melbourne. In 2006. So the best part about Melbourne was one, 'cause you're here, but it's like the community aspect of it where all the volunteers and you'll walk around the streets now and people still wear their volunteer outfits or they'll have a backpack or they'll have something on from the 2006 games.

Tommy: Those people are probably the same ones that wear the Qantas jammies around.

Bianca: Yeah, that's right. Exactly, but I do love seeing that, that so many people got into it, whether they love sport or not. They just wanted to be a part of it.

Josh: If you were to rebrand the Comm Games, what would you do?

Bianca: You love your brand, don't you?

Josh: Yeah, no, but I just think that maybe this year there was definitely, you know, the vibe could have done some more, like from what I heard, people were like a little bit disappointed. What do you think?

Bianca: Why don't we just make the Olympics and the Comm Games, just combine all the sports. So all the sports go across the same and just have one big event every 4 years.

Josh: Yeah, that makes a lot of sense.

Bianca: So put netball in the Olympics, You put some of the other sports that aren't in there, bang. The Olympics are crazy.

Josh: I went to the London Olympics. I didn't actually go to any events, but I was working at the radio station at the time for FIFA and Jules and was the digital content dude. So I was filming. And it's the craziness around the Olympics is how strict they are on the rights and stuff like that. Like you can't mention the Olympics, you can't like, especially in this digital age, it's gotta be pretty hard.

Tommy: Well, like bike races, you can't even film.

Josh: Yeah, well, we had a guy on Cycling Maven who's this cycling dude and he did a big Kickstarter campaign to go to a cycling event and do some coverage. And he didn't have any media accreditation, so it ended up being a vlog of just sort of him, it was almost like Gogglebox, you know? He was just sort of like going. Talking about his bike. Which is exactly what his community wanted. Wanted, but was obviously for people who are expecting some form. But those rights are old, aren't they?

Bianca: How they sign on to the broadcast deals, because they, yeah, they're no way suited to today's day and age where even the athletes, we can put across whatever we want to put across on our socials. And with Comm Games, you're restricted. Like, I had, like, some of the sponsors that I had, I wasn't allowed to wear. Like, I had Puma for like 10 years, but when I went to Comm Games, I wasn't allowed to wear their shoes, and I had to Deodora or whoever the sponsor was. And you're thinking, really? Like, how's that?

Josh: And it's so annoying because your sponsors have put in all the years. Yeah, pay you money. They've done all that throughout the thing. It's like the equivalent of us, like, you know, one day being big and having a sponsor throughout the whole thing. And then on the big grand, whatever, episode 1000 of the daily talk show, when we actually have people listening, could you imagine? Yeah, not being able to, that would be painful.

Bianca: But anyway, I mean, we can't fix everything at once, can we?

Josh: Have you done the whole corporate speaking circuit thing?

Bianca: I do do it, but I do it more from a leadership point of view. So going into talking to businesses around things that we've been talking about, like, you know, how important it is to build relationships and real relationships with your staff and, you know, getting rid of the hierarchy that's in there and getting people to buy in. So I do a lot of that. I'd rather do stuff that's meaningful than just go on there and go, I played netball one day.

Tommy: Can you actually see that you can take things that were from your sporting career into things like business.

Bianca: Absolutely, yeah, definitely. And I've got this real passion for athlete kind of well-being too. So, you know, and that's no different to a normal person's well-being, that no matter what organisation you're in, you've gotta, it's, you've gotta be mindful of it and people's mental health and how you can deal with that and how you can support people who are struggling with things like that. So yeah, everything that happens in the athlete world is is just the same as what happens in the normal world.

Josh: How do you reconcile like— The thing that I've been struggling with of late is everyone's just making everything up? You know, this— What can it be? No, like in the sense that there's a lot of people even that statement.

Bianca: Is that the vibe you get from me?

Josh: No, no, but I think that there's that thing where it's because you are no bullshit and all that sorta thing. Do you think that people like to speak in matter-of-fact terms? Like this is the way, this is the only way. How have you sort of worked with that, with being a no bullshit type of person? You know, how do you sort of form, how have you sort of formed, you know, your—

Bianca: Like your own values. Yeah. Oh, I don't know. I think it just evolves over time and you do get influenced by people along the way and you either give it a go and it doesn't work for you or you don't believe that person in the first place. But you know, I think it's about being able to talk about it with people that you trust too. So again, surrounding yourselves with those great people where you can say, okay, I'm thinking this, I'm doing this, is this right, does this add up, is this where I wanna go? And having them be honest with you, and that's another thing you get from being an athlete, is you learn pretty quickly that you love feedback and you want feedback, and the harsher it is, almost the better it is. And you come out into normal world and people don't like giving you feedback. People don't like sitting you down and going, okay, you need to communicate better, you need to do this better.

Tommy: Were you thirsty for it after you came out of the sporting world?

Bianca: We're all, we get it, it scares you in the sporting world, but then you get used to it, and then you realise that no one's comfortable doing it in the outside world. Cloud world.

Josh: How do you tease it out of people? How do you tease real feedback that's not just sort of niceties but stuff that you can actually implement?

Bianca: Yeah, I think it's, it's just, it's, it's a process. You can't just sit down in a meeting and go, right, because like I learn differently to how you learn differently.

Josh: That's literally how I do it. The first question I ask someone when they listen to the podcast, I say, tell me why it's shit. Like, really, I want to know, like, what am I doing wrong? Yeah. And I want you to like in this moment just slam me.

Bianca: And then people go, oh no, it's really good.

Josh: Yeah, exactly.

Tommy: I've watched A lot of people struggle with that answer and not everyone, I don't think, maybe not everyone's up for having those conversations or giving the feedback.

Bianca: Or trying to do it in a way where just give me 2 things you think I should, I can do better and 2 things that you loved about it. Like sometimes it's just breaking it down like that.

Josh: Where I treat it more like a roast, like I might just roast me. Yeah, and people are like, oh no, because they're worried that I'll cry, which I will.

Bianca: One thing that we had to do as a team is that we'd all sit around in a circle, leading team style, like everyone knows leading teams in the sporting world. So you'd sit on a chair out the front, every single person in your team would tell you what you need to keep doing, start doing, and stop doing. Wow, that's a great idea. And you'd sit there and you'd be like shaking. And I'd also had to go and do it on myself. So I'd already had done it on myself, what I thought I needed to keep doing, start doing, stop doing, and then your team do it to you. Ultimately, it all comes out to be pretty similar to what you already wrote down, like you already know it.

Josh: What was the stop doing for you?

Bianca: Do you remember? Me was stop, so when I was under pressure and when I was worried or struggling, I would go really quiet. Whereas on the court, I was always like the defender at the back that was directing play and leading everyone from the back end. So when I went quiet, they're all a bit like, "Get out of your shell, hurry up. You need, like, if you're quiet, you're holding us all back." So that was my kind of, I needed to stop doing that. When I was being worried, I had to be able to get myself out of it before I shut up.

Tommy: 'Cause it was detrimental to the team. I understand, what's been more rewarding part of your life? The sporting times, now, as you got out and did the rebrand? Did the rebrand. I don't know.

Bianca: I don't know. It's a hard question to answer. Probably, I mean, I've learned a hell of a lot through sport and I wouldn't be in the position I am now without sport. But yeah, I just think that I, I'd like to think that I keep evolving and keep learning keep kind of pushing myself. So hopefully the best times are still to come, but I don't really know that.

Josh: It feels like there is a, especially with The Block, it feels like a time in your life where things could change, which is weird. It seems weird to be like putting a reality show in such a high weight of someone's life. However, we have seen, I've seen so many times, you think about, you know, Chrissy Swan, some of the best media personalities in Australia, have started on reality TV and not just within a media context, but within business or whatever it is. Have you sort of thought about what those different directions are? You know, if we get X amount of cash, I'm gonna put it in here, I wanna do this, or I wanna speak to this brand.

Bianca: Sort of. So Carla and I, the honest, the main reason we applied is one, I bloody love renovating and I couldn't afford to do it on my own, like doing my own house. So I was like, I'd rather use their money and do theirs. And also we were just both bored. Like, we're so used to the adrenaline rush of sport. We both retired in the same year and we've just kind of been cruising along for the last couple of years and we're like, we just want that adrenaline rush again. And that's exactly what The Block was. I don't know what happens next. Like, if we make money, that's kind of a bonus, but I just hope that people and my profile changes from just being a netballer to somebody else that can— I'm happy to keep doing what I do, just kind of on a more amplified level. And so are they done?

Josh: So are the apartments done or what's this? So it starts now and then what happens in your life?

Bianca: In life, yeah, we just kind of go back, do a lot of PR now as it's being put to air.

Josh: And then at the very final bit, then there's the— So everything's live towards the end.

Bianca: So the open for inspections, we've got to go back where all the public get to come through the property. It's crazy that day.

Tommy: Yeah, it's crazy. Thousands of people go to the property.

Bianca: I think there's like 10,000, 20,000 people come through Elston Week properties. And then the auction is a couple of weeks later. And that's all live too, like we find out a result I probably won't sleep that night 'cause I'll be so scared about what happens next.

Tommy: And then they film you the next day.

Bianca: Film us the next day. And then you've got the auction and then goes to air on the Sunday. Interesting.

Tommy: So you put out today on your Insta that you are on The Block. Yeah. It's weird 'cause probably most of your mates probably know.

Bianca: Yeah, and I was busted a few times because for the first time in our lives, there was paparazzi just hanging out the front. So they would be like clicking all the time. So it was in the Herald Sun when we first announced it. Started filming that I was on it, which the show were like, we don't care who talks about it. We just won't agree or we just won't say who our cast is until—

Tommy: We're just not gonna say yes or no.

Bianca: Yeah, so then today is the first day they're like, yes, this is our cast.

Tommy: And so what's that been like for you?

Bianca: Yeah, my phone's been going crazy from people who, I mean, obviously close friends knew and so they've been along the ride with us, but just people that are like, oh, hey B, how you going? Like big fans of the band.

Josh: On the block that are acquaintances that you haven't said like, yeah.

Bianca: And I'm like, oh yeah, I was good last week too, but thanks for asking now. But that's okay. I'm, I'm happy if people love the show, and especially if like netball people love it, that they get to see us in a different world.

Josh: Are you going to have a bit of a watching routine? Are you gonna— so like, have you got plans of how you're gonna, gonna have a viewing party or something?

Bianca: So, because it's boring watching it on your own, and we don't know what happens in the other in other apartments. So unless contestants tell us, producers aren't allowed to tell us what happens in other apartments. So when we watch it, it's the first time we're seeing what happens, 'cause we only really know like the major stuff that actually comes into ours. But yeah, so that's where it's gonna be fascinating. And so Carla and I, we don't live together. So we were like, we're gonna have to watch it every Sunday night just so that we can kind of experience it together. Whereas all the married couples, they're just living at home and it's easy.

Tommy: And to be able to take photos of what the Gatwick looked like before, like some of the rooms.

Bianca: Yeah, yeah, yeah, absolutely.

Josh: This is the only reason we brought you here, was just for the, for the photos. Well, with Josh and I, we timed this well, having Bianca on the day they announced it. Hashtag exclusive.

Tommy: This is, I mean, that's how outlandish you guys are.

Josh: This is very unlike the Daily Talk Show. I'd like to thank all the producers on the show, every single one of them, all the team here. We couldn't do it without you.

Bianca: You'd love to be a producer on that show, wouldn't you? Yeah, it would be good fun.

Tommy: No, the leader, if he's a part of it, if he's getting told what to do, no way.

Josh: Well, I think it's interesting. The one thing that I find fascinating is the storeys we tell ourselves. And so, you know, for me, I've created this like little narrative around what I would like, who I've been and all that sort of thing. Do you find that you do that a lot? Do you think about your life beginning, middle and end? This is what, you know, when you get old, what you're gonna do, or are you sort of a bit of a day-to-day?

Bianca: Day to day, I sort of like, I'm very ambitious, but I'm very also day to day, like I'm not too much of an over-planner.

Josh: Yeah, so what are you gonna actually do while you're, so with The Block going to air?

Bianca: Well, so I still have like, so I do some consulting at Collingwood Footy Club. So I do that in the leadership space and player welfare there. I still do work on House of Wellness TV on Channel 7. So yeah, I still do lots of bits and pieces now. And just see what happens come auction day.

Tommy: And you were talking that you want people to sort of see you more than a netballer. Yeah. What is it? What do you want people to see? I know it's a hard question of going, who are you?

Josh: Tell us your brand. Tell us your personal brand.

Tommy: Yeah. I mean, it sounds like it's something you put a bit of thought into.

Bianca: Yeah. Well, I just think it's not having the tag of that's all you've done is you've played netball. Like I think, you know, for me, like I'm quite a career-driven person. I've written a book, I've worked in the leadership space, I run my own business and I work in the media. So I want people to see me as Bianca who does all of that, not as Bianca the netballer who does all of that. I don't know if that makes sense, but it makes sense in my head. No, it does.

Tommy: No, it does. It makes sense. A whole person. I had one video go really well for me, O-Bike, where I was fishing O-Bikes out of the river. I'm now the O-Bike guy. So it's not as accomplished as a professional netballer, but you know.

Bianca: Do you know who else loves their O-Bikes? Bikes. Who? Lucky. Lucky always is posting pictures.

Tommy: Interesting. Of them up trees.

Josh: Yes, and in the river. And yeah, Tommy loves these.

Tommy: I'll send my video through. Yeah, thanks for chatting.

Josh: It's like super interesting to hear, you know, a little bit more into your mind and stuff like that. We should get you back on, you know, once we're, uh, once it's all done, once the block's all over, and you'll be like, Bianca, you said you weren't going to be the bitch. Yeah, no, we should, we should get you back. Yeah, we'll do it like way after. We'll do it in like, wait, when's the actual auctions happening?

Bianca: End of October. End of September.

Josh: Fuck, October. That's exactly—

Bianca: Are you going to be back from your holiday? Are you going to miss the whole thing?

Josh: Yeah, I know, but I can just be there. You can watch it on catch-up. I can be there when you're like collecting your cheque and stuff like that. Hopefully it's a big one. I'm going to need to borrow $5 grand. We're in a bit of debt after that trip. Thanks Bianca. Thank you.