"0:03
It's a daily Talk Show Episode 312.

0:05
Watch. Welcome Jules land

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hit 312 Have you done this nearly every day every day,

0:12
every week, every weekday night you were on last time Episode 159.

0:16
God that was only last week, how many?

0:19
Three, five away.

0:20
I feel like I actually haven't had a conversation. I mean, the best thing about this podcast is that you can actually sit down with somebody Yeah, and go through a lot of stuff. A lot of content. It's not normal. It's not a normal friendship. I've seen you since that episode quite a few times. But we haven't actually had much of a chat know

0:38
people will know Jules Lund is the founder of tribe and you're being popping up in my LinkedIn newsfeed. Good based on

0:47
engagement pod the girls over there there so I've got two of the tribe chain here. I've got Lisa target, who's a UK GM over from London and guys, is one of our superstars from the London office as well and they've been laughing because when I posted that on LinkedIn I said to the whole time get amongst it engage book pod so they liking it commenting so that the algorithm you know these Josh I

1:09
get text messages from Josh saying, Can you please jump on LinkedIn to lock my post? Yeah,

1:13
I have a I have an account for my tower thumb, like an Instagram account. And tome actually gets into engagement sometimes on my stuff and have a conversation.

1:23
Great. I forgot about your tie. Thumbs. That is, it's quite disgusting. What is Bry? Think about that.

1:29
That's not ideal, but it does sort of it works with my hands sort of does it?

1:33
And

1:37
so the purpose is that works with a foot because

1:44
if I the core strength, but no So how long have you been back in Melbourne? Two days?

1:49
Well, if it was going by your email signature, you've been away for the last eight months.

1:54
Yeah, yeah, I've I've now set that up. email signature is a standard now it says I'm a white because gets rid of all the Nazis. How hard was it for you to get through it?

2:03
I'd never know when you hear that. I'm texting you.

2:09
And you text me back. I'm like, Fuck, it's either. I've punished you and woke you up in the middle of the night and

2:14
I want you to feel awkward. I want you to feel like you're annoying me because guess what, Tommy?

2:18
I am annoying. I have been for the last 10 years you

2:21
get any pushback from using the autoresponder?

2:24
Yeah, I've had a few people called me out think that I think I'm a VIP. Yeah, it's a bit arrogant because it basically says, Hi, I'm overseas working. Basically, I'll get back to you when I can. Yeah. And I get back to everyone that I care about very quickly, but uh, buys me a few days, I think. And then on my voice message, I get hit up on this one as being pretty arrogant, which is I don't listen to voice messages in text. How do you feel about I think

2:49
Jeff Jarrett, who's been on he? He's a legitimate he says, I will not listen to this email this.

3:00
They probably would say

3:03
How long were you in New York?

3:06
Well, I did three weeks. I just all you would love SXSW is when

3:10
I went to

3:12
my Lord. So who else loves SXSW? Jason done death. He's always there.

3:20
Well, it was I went to Austin for six nights there. I don't think I even scraped the surface of it. So it's a creative festival. For those who don't know, it's sort of it's where marketing world tech world music film all collide in Austin, Texas and takes over the whole town. But it's just great people. People like us creative, innovative, excited. Want to celebrate life. It's not like can lions, which is sort of like an advertising. It's the lottery die. In South of France. A lot of expensive money on yachts. This is the opposite austin texas barbecue

3:55
I was at I was having a breakfast and lunch and dinner and that would do for breakfast. I would have like a free brownie. Free brownies. I got

4:04
to about the sixth time when Jesus I'd kill for some cutlery.

4:09
Like I think

4:09
I was at a food trucks and it was wasn't such a thing as a polite. I don't think I saw a flight and I just thought everything's makes it Yeah.

4:17
Makes you You're looking good that

4:20
your hand up my leg? No, I will not. It's a nice dense leg. So I feel like I feel like these rod for you with tribe. You can see where it's at. I reckon I could tell what stage of the business you're at, based on how you just talking with me? Yeah, you seem really happy at the moment. You seem like she's going well.

4:40
Tell me I tell you what you've seen me. I think you've even recorded me. So I've had some bad days, right? Yeah. And just so happens that it coincides with Tommy wanting some really inspiring video. So he puts a camera many guys talk to me about entrepreneurship. I said, Don't fucking do it.

4:58
I still talk to you. And then

4:59
I just

5:00
go into this diatribe of like this is hell. And right this is so this is going backward about 14 months ago and easily. And I'm like, this is how and so then we just went let's just do a video that's really roll and honest. And so if it all goes to shit, we can bring the video out. And if it doesn't, then it's an honest representation of you know that the tough could be it could be the next fire festival for the documentary. So as

5:21
always in the back, always in the back of your mind. Right. You've got Billy vibes.

5:28
Thank you Good at pulling people in

5:29
Billy's very, very entrepreneurial.

5:31
He was.

5:35
He's in jail.

5:36
Yeah. I love I love that. Because you're right. I am good luck. You guys enrolling people, right? You've got a new idea. And you guys, this is the this is the most committed. You've been to any one of your ideas ever.

5:47
Yeah, absolutely.

5:48
Like you guys have an idea for a month, and you're excitable. And then you enroll everyone and then

5:55
the next ID and they've just invested in the first

5:58
Yeah, it's annoying baby, you've done? Same thing with Dr. Yep. is every time you go to a different market, I was reading that the UK office has outperformed the Australian office.

6:10
Yeah, that's laser over there. They can take credit for that. So there's about 10 or 11 of the team over there. And it's super impressive. You have

6:17
to get people to subscribe to that feel like a new idea every time when it's doing the new market? Or does it feel like

6:23
does a taste something goes extraordinary that. So we have just the news is broken today through TechCrunch, which is the leading tech publication globally. So it's a really, it's even just a significant thing being on TechCrunch and having it announced. And so we're moving we've just raised $10.5 million. And we've set up our offices in New York City. And, and we're about to you know, we're about to have a crack at the US after the success of the UK. But what's extraordinary is I'm sending out these videos of us story, you know, what is our story? Because jai jai? Absolutely right? We have to start again. Luckily, I've been saying the same crap for four years, so much so that there's a video of me in 2017, the described tribe, and it's the video I've put in the article because we haven't changed it. I love that.

7:18
Well, the the pitch video we made to get the original funding is not much different. Yep.

7:24
But the good thing too is if you create a lot of content, it's like Gary Vee, he produces enough content that you can say just about anything and then just pull on the one that works.

7:32
Yeah. Yeah. The thing with Gary Vee, he's actually there's a, there was a YouTube competitor back in the day called Videla.

7:40
Okay, and he was

7:41
he sounds like Exactly.

7:43
Like somebody she came back from

7:47
the US. He was very much like all in on Videla. But it's amazing how he was able to change things. I love

7:54
the December LinkedIn prediction post. Yeah, because no one fucking goes on 12 months ago, you would clearly so far off. Yeah, like you can just say anything. And by the next year, you just predict the next thing. And if it comes off you cheer. But if it doesn't no one even know

8:13
that Tom will be doing that video. And you were a bit morbid. Yeah, what was? Was America on the cards at that point, I think, okay, you'd launch the office,

8:23
surviving was on the cards. Look, the reality is, as a, as I've described to you guys, before, it's it's, you know, you're in survival mode as a startup. So you raise the money, and then the money every day gets less. Yeah, right. And so you have to then use that money with enough impact that the by the time the money runs out, you've said to people, the last people that gave us this money, this is what we've done with it, it's so good that if you give us money for the next year or two, then this is what we're going to do to yours. So in that small window of that, that that original amount of money, if you haven't grown, no one's going to give you anymore. Yeah. And so we've just been you just going that cycle. And so at the moment, we've raised some money, we're now excited because you know, people give us that money to spend. And we've got an enormous amount of traction. So we're optimistic that that amount of money we can do something really significant with and in this part of our journey. For years on.

9:23
We have invested in technology, which means for four years, we have strangely been fighting with one arm behind our back time. Because when you build tech, the idea is you're not going there and help the tech. Whereas if you're an agency that had an opportunity to make 100 grand with influences, you just start emailing people, you get busy, everyone rolls his sleeves up, and you just make it happen, you get the money. Whereas in tech, you're actually trying to allow the the platform to do all of that work. And so sadly, it takes an enormous amount of investment, like, you know, probably, you know, million we've spent on our development. And and it takes an enormous amount of time. And so what you want to be able to do is you want to be able to predict the future. So you need to be able to go, I'm going to build these in concrete, because that's what it feels like I'm going to invest all this money, by the time we've finished it, the market but not better not have moved otherwise with stuff. And so when I say to you, that video hasn't moved in two years, or three years, that's such a great endorsement, that we are able to think about the fundamentals of what we're building for and know that there's nuances that shift, but be ahead of the market and future proof ourselves. And so at the moment for years on, it looks like our technology is finally catching up. It's starting to overtake competitors. And it's super exciting. And so it sort of feels like it begins a little bit. Now, we've built this thing for scale that anyone can jump online and say, I want content from influences that, you know, they can either publish to their followers, which is word of mouth marketing at scale, or actually, I'm just using these impulses create content for my social advertising on my billboards, which is sort of like you turning your customers into your creative department. And so that now at this point is really exciting globally. And brands have caught up to that concept, even though we've been visualizing it for a few years. And so hopefully it's the perfect storm.

11:21
So what you are used to what come and watch you. I'm just bored of seeing you say the same thing. And I just watched the videos that I've made previously for you. But you were what I love these you were almost making some of these predictions or you were coining phrases or trying to identifying areas what has come off from what you were sort of projecting. Yep. And what hasn't.

11:46
Joshua, you'd agree that every time you have a prediction, you naturally go to GoDaddy and buy a domain.

11:51
Yeah.

11:55
I

11:56
lay on sugar and we had on the show the other day show dot com is available. It's pretty unique.

12:02
I mean, it's what do you think about sugar? So Leon Jagran? Yeah, he wears really colorful shirts. Yeah. And so I thought of shirt

12:10
shirts to mouthful I may not look you know, it's great until you get the the the the frayed campaign, Eddie's radio station and no one can read it.

12:20
Shed shirts. It's

12:22
got some issues, but yes, absolutely. Yeah. The good. I accidentally bought off the grid, which cost me

12:29
tom.com

12:30
Tony thumb.com. I own Yes. Yeah. Instagram. Not I was

12:33
with it. I was at a cafe the other day and a guy was telling me just how he got. He got the domains of this guy that he worked with, say that guy's name's Matthew Shepard, it just got Matthew shepard.com. And he can put whatever he wants on there. And it's going to get better SEO every time that guy's name is put in. So now he just fucked with him. Because it's gonna come up before he's LinkedIn or anything. Yeah, and someone else owns it. And it's this vulnerability. So now he's just going to extort money out of it.

13:05
If I Josh Janssen calm and bought jewels, Linda calm Yeah. And then they didn't he want to give it to you as I

13:11
bring up the wall. I got absolutely

13:14
like I went to jail for other shit, didn't he? just quietly No, but

13:18
I think

13:18
it was done. Like I just remember like a black background had the this is the it was like a guy. There was there was a guy who had a bunch of bunch of domain names in sort of this big right celebrity

13:34
and then every walking

13:34
everyone down from that, and

13:39
and so he I remember that you would go to the website and there was like, there's something off the internet or I think it was literally that internet authority. But basically it was a dude, he was in Queensland. And he was buying all the

13:51
guy the guy because

13:52
I'll just say What a loser

13:54
Yeah, I got absolutely I got ripped off it's it's one of the most embarrassing stories within tribe of last four years where I just got absolutely get

14:01
Jocelyn calm.

14:03
Now, it wasn't over that it was over a tribe domain, but I just got absolutely stooge. This guy just

14:10
what did he do? I just want to hurt him.

14:13
I hope it was a.com w with well.

14:17
It was

14:17
some random and

14:18
and to be honest, I can't talk about it. But in terms of the domain and say shirts has got shirts, shirts, he's got the license plate for shirts.

14:27
Yeah. So I think it could be good. But I

14:30
think probably to sell

14:32
a missions domain name is Blake calm, because I will constantly be on GoDaddy. And I'll just be like, I just writing people's names. And it came up. And I texted him I said, like this, because normally it doesn't go I've had it before where I've got a good.com I've got filmmaker, CO and a few others. And I've had it before where I got an epic one. And GoDaddy had just sort of been tweaked at the time and it didn't go through. Yeah. And so I'm like Amish like calm was available. And then I am like I straightaway messaged him and said you should completely own this. But the thing is, Hamish has fucking Hamish Blake shots on insert. Like he's the, the opposite of someone who cares about

15:11
domain doesn't equate to success. You can safely say that,

15:14
and it just feels like it.

15:16
Just so friendly. You know, Carly Schmidt so Kelly got, I won't mention it because of the person but she was she had an idea. And like you and I did you just quickly got the domain. And it feels like I've already started my company.

15:28
Like you feel like you've done a big media company.com we have we spoke about it the daily talk show.com

15:34
boss, yeah, you've done really well. So she's got one. And then she gets reached out to and within literally a few weeks. someone buys it for five and a half grand. She She made five and a half grand off like 1195. And so I then spent about five and a half grand. And I haven't even made a living.

15:51
But I then when I went I AR and VR. So I thought I'm going to get ahead of this curve. And I did everything I must have spent until Anna when I had money before the startup, I must just honestly, I must have spent five grand on IR cinemas VR skiing I driving lessons VR porn AR headset, I VR glasses or.com. Yes,

16:16
it's

16:19
run out of money. And I have to get rid of I'm like.

16:22
So these are predictions that haven't come through.

16:24
Okay, there's plenty of those. But in answer to your question, back, back, back when we talked about the timeline, were they certain things, were there certain things that I've conceived that have come off? Generally speaking, from my industry point of view, absolutely. In fact, everything has. Everything has and and, you know, different, it just comes at different times. And thankfully Our team is

16:52
over time has realized that some of the weed stuff that I talk about slowly comes off. And the stuff I'd that doesn't come off. Anyone I've spoken to about that is made, you

17:05
know,

17:07
to feel like you have to evangelize or like say when when you're so into an idea, how do you get people within the business into it? Is it just about because it's almost plays into the persona or the character which is just like when you when you strong on an ID these enthusiasm. But there's also I can go from enthusiasm to maybe Josh is slightly manic right now, and it's not a great idea. How do you how do you sort of?

17:35
Well, this look, I I think and I think anyone who's with me in the moment gets a bit of the manic stuff but I think it drives around forward because the manic usually draws to with fucking god data and like this is do you see if we do that plus the swap could happen. Like we've built the tech for this reason. But if we open this little portal now that we've already got all the technology, we can enter these whole different industry and that in itself, so then I'll just go and if I've had a coffee,

18:04
you can imagine I've just started having black I got an

18:08
ADHD. No, it's actually a nightmare. I've

18:11
I've I've had water instead of water. I have coffee now I'm shaking because I had I bought like a really nice was it cold McMaster thermos, where I put the coffee in? And so I'm drinking like fucking 800 mil during the day when I'm not sleeping now to

18:27
have a shot.

18:30
shot? No, absolutely not.

18:33
I eat too much makes. How

18:35
do you I think for looking dude, what Josh, you're saying? Josh and I are founders of our business. Yeah. And we one of us has an idea. And I know Josh doesn't like trying to sell in anything to me. But you are, you know, in a much bigger operation where you You're the founder, I'd say you visionary of that company? And are you selling into people? This stuff? Like, are you coming in, in your manic state and going this is the way for get on? This horse is

19:04
part of my frustration is it's like, It's so fucking clear. And if you're asking these questions, so like you don't and it's like,

19:11
again, there's a pad that I have people to be in support.

19:16
Here's the key. For four years, everyone that's joined us heard the vision, and all that happens from the areas that that vision gets validated. And that's what I talk about in those moments. And they said for themselves. So, you know, in the early days, when everyone you know, we sat down, say Oh, and on said or get a black book. And you know, let's invite all the celebrities, you know, to download tribe. And it was like, we made these big list and I looked at knowing I reckon any of them could take a good photo beside themselves. They got 200,000 followers because I'm in a while something but I don't think I could take a good photo branded content. And I'll It doesn't matter. It's about the followers. And it's like not, I actually only care about the content. So so we we've made huge, huge, bold decisions based on my experience. And it's been the exact same thing. So in answer your question, TJ I don't, it's not like a new thing every week. It's literally the exact same thing that we've been talking about. The world just hasn't caught up. And we're just building towards that. And the, the what I discuss is

20:21
what I discussed is when things move like Instagram shifts, I go this is moving closer towards our need. And so like Lisa and grace are over there down, you know, because they're in UK time they'll be posting stuff and the first thing I wake up in the morning, I'll see some some huge shift in Instagram, I'll just go it's happening. And that's what I do. It's just it's happening and it's moving. The the funds the technology and smartphones are getting better. The consumer behavior is shifting, it is all just moving towards what I believe is a multi billion dollar category that doesn't even exist yet and we want to own it. When do you celebrate within your business?

21:02
Let's be honest, we celebrate today and we celebrate yesterday so and I

21:05
used to celebrate every Friday with Nando's, but I no longer have invited

21:10
Well, that's because I took the Nando's a card away from cut you off.

21:13
Yeah, they cut

21:14
me off. Turns out they were expecting me to somehow add value to them. By in the way of bigroad celebrity Yeah, but then the C grade. They're not just giving me chicken and occasionally social. Then when I got to dig right, it just wasn't worth

21:32
Yeah. I say you're so far away from any grade right now with your mark technique is

21:38
actually to be honest, it's such a fucking stupid table.

21:42
If this

21:42
was a circle, I'd be looking I don't want to cut you out. I don't want to cut you

21:45
back because I haven't thought about these free road stuff.

21:49
And then you've got this from IKEA. Your

21:50
TV shows land. If there's anyone who can do it. It's you.

21:54
Okay, well, I'm holding the ball.

21:58
I just picked up the mark for those listening. You didn't even describe my visual motion.

22:02
Yeah, he picked up the microphone. Is that worth

22:05
it? Yeah.

22:06
What's this will celebrate.

22:09
You guys talk over each other because I'm blocking you with my head

22:12
back

22:14
celebrating those. I was

22:17
exhausted last night. It was a because I'm part of a marketing scholarship and they were congratulating me because of the price what does

22:22
that mean by the way?

22:24
There's this fantastic organization called the marketing Academy and globally, the UK US and Australia there's people 30 a year become part of this marketing Bootcamp, which would think is about marketing but it's really just this almost self discovery challenges self support each other everyone at this time in our lives who who are ambitious and trying their best get a bit lost in it you know, it's pretty bloody tough. Is this a thing

22:51
where you went away,

22:52
went away for a boot camp for a week and then basically spend the whole year they they get a pool of the greatest minds in the country and I just don't have 90 minutes sessions sitting down with them. It's amazing I should loop you in so you could get some of those people on the show but I probably want

23:08
that email What is it

23:09
it's the fucking day

23:10
we're actually we're upgrading we're about

23:14
the time I come back which might be on Tuesday. So celebrating how to be last night because I said you know what, you should celebrate that and it does remind you so when I'm gonna have a Be it was a mid strength Corona which actually exists. And I sat and watched umbrella Academy and and then today we've got some fun stuff at the office where we the morale is amazing, because, you know, it's been a long time coming to rise this money.

23:38
Yeah. The just just quickly on the discussion around followers and fake followers. Yeah, how is that shifted over the years? I feel like it's dial down a bit. Yeah, people are getting Yeah, outed like I see. I saw in this Facebook page shameless, the girl podcast by two girls who had this massive following anyway,

24:00
tagline is smart women who like dumb stuff

24:03
and so they've built these massive audience and posted this one

24:07
I saw on blogs who like smart so

24:09
this girl went through and didn't orders on about five Melbourne based Australian based influences and literally a broke down you know she just didn't have the offer she did she did order she orders yeah winning shots. Yeah, exactly.

24:26
We we spent three years on technology that just does that by itself thankfully Yeah. Because we got you know, we have 50,000 content creators and they grow every day so every time that someone connects their account to our system, it scans their audience on probably I think it's Brad I different metrics. So it checks obviously historical Spock and followers but also spiking engagement so if it goes one like two likes three likes 1004 likes that

24:54
has ratio between comments and likes if you have 1000 likes and two comments that's flagged by the system and then and even content reverse image search offered appears online so people ripping it from Pinterest but then on entrance it scans you know your

25:11
reverse image searching Josh his thumb and it comes back a foot

25:22
is real stuff he was

25:23
but he's the noise around you. Because I remember when you first that it was like even though it was the last

25:28
day when it peaked. So the greatest marketer on the planet the most awarded is a man by the name of Keith Wade, and Keith Wade is the CM CEO of Unilever, which is you know, I think it's a it's a, it would have to be the first or second biggest advertiser on the planet. So it runs everything from Lyft and iced tea to Magnum ice creams, all the way through to Davin hair care products, you name it. So it's, it's pretty huge. Last year at Ken, he stood up and said, Rod, whenever going invest in influences you buy fake followers, right? Which is lucky because you know, we've done 60 campaigns with those guys by that stage. And they've never worked with anyone fake followers because we've protected them. But the world took that is this forward in the industry, which of course there is I mean, we hired you, JJ member. Yeah,

26:19
yeah. He's coached me.

26:21
Well, I did a Melbourne geek article in 2011 A

26:24
publish the article after we hired him because of the stuff

26:28
it worked. It worked out very well. No, but it was when it was like blowing up where there were saying, These are the most influential people in Melbourne. And the thing that pissed me off is it was like, purely 2011 it was the time where numbers were everything. I was so stupid. So five I got you want to Fiverr I remember in that time, I remember I spent five bucks, got 30,000 followers, but the amount of banks that I've actually deleted that Twitter account because the amount of anxiety Yeah, associated with good people thinking yeah,

27:00
that I'm we could lock you could block the Russia

27:03
ginsburg did he did that he put it into a system to try and do the systems I work you gotta literally manually he blocked every follow up good accidentally. So here to start a new account, or I remember he did an Instagram

27:15
blocking?

27:16
Yeah, there's no So basically, because even when you come into our platform, it scans you four times a day, every day. So everyone attracts goes to followers, right? So we all if you go through, you'll see these accounts with, you know, five posts, it's got a lot of x's in the handle. But what you're going to do is just cleanse your account. And so in our platform, we've blocked 10s of thousands of people that are not willing to cleanse it. But I'm not allowing a brand to pie I sent for something that isn't real. And so we protect them in that way. But I love you as jai jai because it was during that process where I went online to say could this got a social? Yeah, and I don't know whether I missed the blog, or you publish it afterwards. But you fucking got me

27:59
what

28:00
buried the latest at the beginning.

28:02
Because I because I looked at it. It was he had like 30,000 Charlotte, this guy, no champ, these guys unreal.

28:07
And

28:08
we brought him in. And then he challenged this for 12 months.

28:12
Yeah. When you get when you get 10 million bucks. How do you work out? What you can spend it on?

28:19
Well, you know, the frightening parties when you have 70 staff in five CDs. You've got a month runway?

28:26
Exactly.

28:27
Now you burn right, which is how much it costs you to run that every month. And obviously we're bringing in money. But we're certainly not profitable. We're not bringing in more money than we're spending because we're building a fast tech.

28:41
tech company. So so how do we it doesn't it just gives you extra amount of time, but there's not an enormous amount of

28:52
step ups.

28:53
So in other words, we can't go with it. We're just going to high five more senior people from Facebook and Google genomic you office in Manhattan.

29:01
You're expensive. Yeah. Yeah. How do you work out? Because I

29:04
guess you're the biggest building in the whole town.

29:07
Well, we actually did One World Trade Center.

29:10
Now

29:10
all floors. Yeah, yeah. All of them. Now we're on the 85th. And he's absolutely magic. I'm a big fan.

29:16
How many souls out there it for

29:21
you say King Kong, we're freezing up on that pole. Now the the the reality of that is we had a budget and it was for pretty. The budget allowed us a pretty modest place in Midtown in Manhattan. Turns out that the the woman running this

29:40
the floor, went to primary school with me know and she's she loves you know, we we connected back then, you know, I was in class with her sister. And then and she reached out she said, if you guys are coming over here, I want to do everything I can in my power to help you and so she says and I hope this is doesn't get her in trouble. But she says whatever you you're looking at will match that but we'll give you this amazing place and so

30:04
you went to Chinatown found a little shoe box and said exact Can

30:07
you match that was going to cost us 600 bucks. So she's been super generous. So there's been no chance can wait and I have to explain that to investors because we've raised the money they don't want to see these view out there. But it just so happens that we've got generosity in the the Ozzy expat community in New York is so generous and it's such a special thing in the UK there's no rz expat community they are just all these everyone in fact is lyst Uk people in and so in the US though it's a minority and they they sort of help each other out which is really been great.

30:40
Yeah, that's that kind of stuff happens to you that I do.

30:42
Sometimes but you guys to like you caught up with at Buckingham, didn't you? Yes. Am I today? Yes. So I got a Chinese tuxedo. That's where I took Selene who helped us out with the offices of thank you split the bill and

30:54
we both host Malone who was just

30:58
thinking of the fact that I have no idea it was

31:01
wise Tommy taking a photo with the

31:03
man

31:04
with the biggest rap star in the world. Yeah,

31:06
yeah. That was

31:07
that that is that's what happened. I thinking you're good things happen. A key you had a journey there. You know probably I easy go shit nine but a great adventure.

31:20
Yeah, suck on that George land.

31:22
Yeah, we actually bought followers for that one. Well, we bought because we had no profile we bought them to try and just give us

31:28
this is how this gives context of just how much we thought I had clout that these guys had nothing to young blokes are going over to the states doing some some content. And we said, Why don't we? What did you do? You built it on the basis that I was so gutted about my glory days being over that I had a wife and two kids at a going and traveling around the globe? Like I used to be able to do?

31:52
Yes, but using Jules his name in the show. I think you would have had more luck with Who the fuck stole.

31:59
It worked out.

32:00
It wasn't a time it was like no travel because I was doing travel. So there was a bit of like, you know, this is the sort of travel you wish you could do. I think what

32:07
more work than your name was just too drunk goes from Australia confident and cocky or just like can we come into your nightclub? Sure come through the kitchen. What the fuck happened?

32:19
Tell me Stop told me stories which makes me cringe the idea of this

32:23
Imagine if that would true.

32:26
No, but the the idea that he's he said to a vineyard. Like, Hey, can we come and film? We're doing this online show and the reality is that Tommy was rocking out with like a point and shoot. Yeah, one

32:39
really knew. Like, you get me may think there's like YouTube

32:44
like people have built million dollar empires on a point and shoot.

32:50
Yeah, off an iPhone.

32:51
Well, that's

32:52
I mean, you look at Casey Jones said, Yeah, yeah. Like,

32:55
it's, we know, like a big media company. We

33:00
know more than anyone that content isn't restricted by equipment. Having said that, this road panel is amazing.

33:08
Yes. Right. This sound effects.

33:11
Oh, yeah.

33:14
When do you drop that? I don't know. With.

33:18
Here we go. You get into a random one. This one happens. Okay. Here we go.

33:22
Is that your summer?

33:27
We do have we have laughter.

33:31
When you come back on and Rob's gone.

33:36
disappointing sound effect. There

33:37
is no but there is some magic to New York City. Do you think as far as America?

33:41
Yeah.

33:42
Choosing the location? Yeah. And I think I think New York's great. It's the epicenter for brands and marketing. But it

33:48
shit happens in it happens fast. How many leeches from the Australian office are already saying hey, Josie, do you need anyone to go to the office?

33:56
You mean, your employees? We don't have any legislation? My company Really?

34:01
Thank you.

34:03
I would 100. I know that working in Bartow as soon as you find Yeah, hang on, we've got a Mexican office.

34:09
Ironically, two of my great staff members have gone to invite I released working with Cyan.

34:16
I said to me yesterday, literally reading that article was like, if this was seven, eight years ago, I would have been pestering Jules to get into that New York office. Yeah, just what I'll do.

34:27
When I was still naive enough to have hired would have had the point and shoot camera.

34:30
Don't worry sack on this at all.

34:34
What's been the biggest takeaway? How long did you actually spend in New York to get it set up?

34:41
Well, I mean, the irony

34:43
is we were already set up we've been set up since the end of last year. And the reason we're going there is because we don't need Well, that's not the right answer.

34:52
20%

34:55
first time Tommy's ever press the broadcast,

34:58
I got an audio jungle watermark.

35:02
So the way the buttons work, it does look like a test you give monkeys.

35:06
TJ can actually figure this out. It's too It's too easy for me. I'm actually gonna turn that fighter down. Yeah.

35:15
So the 20%. So we're self serve platform. So 20% of all of our brands that jumped online to create a brief and influencer marketing campaign came from North America last year. And 25% of all of our creators download the app came from North America last year, and we had no market presence. It's just that because we, you can start it on the website. Everyone's was like, I want this. So we were thinking possibly going to Asia or, you know, broader Europe,

35:40
because Indonesia is fucking huge, right? Like he is different parts of Asia.

35:45
13 million, is some

35:47
ridiculous, say, is it annoying for the platform? I know, it's good when there's business happening. But is it annoying in terms of like, had you set up your payment? Or little bit?

35:57
It's not annoying, you feel responsible? Because you know, the website says that they can have all these great experience. And then we don't even have anyone supporting them in the right time zones. And so it was just that, so literally, just doing things like payments and taxes and actually getting some support there. None of that really requires us to be in the country. Yeah. And so we sort of just started and we, you know, there's been there was 30 campaigns in there at any one time. It's just that now we want campaigns. You know, we're working with gimlet so you know, the same our last week. So they're putting some briefs in there for the North American there's, there's Unilever brands, so things like this Hershey's, PepsiCo, Abercrombie and Fitch. There's one to burn which is Logitech, those awesome speakers. There's chic and Gillette and so all of those are really good for our creators because their stuff that people already use.

36:49
I was just thinking I could do a Gillette one with my Neck Beard. really turned a little bit of an applause there.

36:57
And applause out, I'll type it. And sorry, a certain button

37:01
that I pushed because you know people yeah, monkey see, monkey? Do you just

37:06
like the visual stuff?

37:08
Yeah, we need to that way.

37:09
Well, yeah, we women. Jules, you just press the yellow button, which is the wrong one on the panel with all the other colors. You

37:17
had to

37:18
do a bit of learning in that regard. When you went from? I mean, you you went radio, TV radio, was it a bit of reset time where you like that people have no idea what's going on?

37:30
Meaning, meaning they went from the time that

37:33
you were underselling the visuals. You all about the visual sorry. Yeah,

37:38
yes, sir. Absolutely. Yeah, I went Yeah, I was I was horrible. And the funny thing is, you know, like, when you have a funny conversation, I can do radio. So when a winning is like, I can do radio, and then they're semi curve is you know, and I hope you getting them on the show. He, he would say, like, we're just going to start with the basics you and Fifi box, we're going to start with the basic and after about, you know, 18 months, we reckon will be about 18 months, like in the pilot, we just had the funniest conversation, you think you nail it, but there actually is huge amounts of nuances in doing radio well, and I forgotten at all, which is annoying, because I'm going to run out of money Pretty soon,

38:17
we're gonna have to get another

38:19
another kick is the Have you actually spent any time looking at the media landscape in the states in regards to radio and TV?

38:28
No, not really. I don't even know what's happening here. I don't know if I described this last time. I think I might have but I have completely unnaturally retreated from old news and current affairs. You know, Why that? Do? We did we remember a little bit? Yeah. So what I do is in my category in my niche, there's more than enough stuff I have to read or podcasts I have to listen to.

38:51
or five is like yours.

38:54
So there's enough of that, that it's filtered. But I don't look at the news and my dad heights hearing this and probably people judge me on it, but I swear by it and I think that I find so I don't I don't watch TV. I don't certainly not the news seller don't have radio, News Radio. I don't have apps. I don't obviously read the paper unless we're in it.

39:16
What apps do you have on your phone right now? If you were to go to the

39:19
black? Do you live in slack?

39:21
Yeah, they were all caught communication. So I've got more but I've should have trimmed them back. So things like Facebook and Twitter not none of those are on there. Even Instagram SXSW co What's that?

39:31
That's like awesome.

39:32
Yes. Now Calm, calm and headspace. You're so fucked up. You need to

39:37
Yeah, it's weird when they're both playing at one or

39:41
two people fucking yelling at me to calm the fuck down.

39:44
You actually Are you a avid user of them?

39:47
Yeah. Well, I I'm a bit amped today. And I actually feel it. Because there's a lot going on. But I haven't meditated and I haven't been great the last few weeks. But what I love about so headspace is the one that I use and spiraling mind is another cracker. That's, that's where I am. Yep. And Australia. But what I like about calm is

40:07
and I in South by Southwest. So Michael Acton, the founder of calm was talking with, ironically with Matthew McConaughey. So Matthew McConaughey, he is doing a bedtime stories, really for adults. And so he goes in there. I love his accent. It is great. And he got up there and talked all about it. And he thought it was a weird idea. But he's really I mean, he gives back to the community and unbelievable wise with his wife but he believes that being mindful is the key he sleeps for your he says fun. He goes I'm a nine and a half hour night. Yes, cuz, you know, like everyone judges me for sleeping. But that's what he knows you sleep a lot.

40:49
Yeah, I could. I'm a nine and a half easy. There's many times that come over to your house. And you're actually upstairs napping.

40:55
Yeah, absolutely. I only did seven hours last night. And I'm rattling so.

41:00
So you say you're amped can you actually still get nine hours on a half hour?

41:04
Well, I'm jet lagged. So I'm waking up at 3am. And I'm checking all the cons from global which is the worst thing you can do with your phone next to you. But then car map. what's ironic, Matthew McConaughey he when he talks about it, I mean obviously it's been really well received and this is a whole new trend that will start to see so Moby is back doing ambient sounds so you know how good Moby tracks were. He's now doing sort of like calm meditation of us playing with the star but badly Makati. There's there's been nothing but rave reviews. The founder was saying Michael except for husbands who are complaining. So like if I have to fucking here. I'm trying to go to sleep. And these Matthew McConaughey whispering

41:44
is you know, go to bed with Matthew McConaughey. I'm more comfortable

41:46
with Bray going to bed with Stephen Fry.

41:49
Yeah, no, he's,

41:51
he's great. He did a whole thing I learned a lot about I think it's 11. De

41:56
he talks about like, you know, Victoria is a hotspot but for the plant lavender.

42:01
We're throwing everywhere.

42:03
That's specifically Yeah, yeah.

42:05
Well, this makes

42:06
sense that so Stephen fries, lullaby. That's what it's called. So there's a whole movement towards that. And I actually think I've been thinking I haven't run a pass my team yet. But I actually think reaching out to the gods because we're in contact with the founder and, and doing a digital detox. And I know it's ironic for us, but it's really important. And I know these guys here on the couch ladies and grace, believe in this as well, that there needs to be responsible usage of social. And we encourage people to use social a lot. And so what we have to do is almost there like a day diet, a digital detox day, once a year or once a weekend a year, where we actually tell everyone is no social posts through the platform, they're going to be pushed on those days of getting before after, and it's a big awareness. But I actually think that doing like a six part series about helping people understand and their addiction

43:02
26 minutes a day, that was the number of people using your app. Yeah, yeah. And so I mean, that's in terms of that metric. Is that good? Do you want more?

43:15
Well, we obviously want more, but Instagram's at about sort of 40 minutes. So just gives you an idea that I use as a power users, but you're going to love this ride. You will love this.

43:24
Opening. That's what we're doing. Now we're touching. He's opening it is rocking an iPhone 70 Plus, based on the still got the home button.

43:33
So this is

43:34
a heat map of the globe shine, everyone that's using our app right now,

43:38
London, is that West? So you know,

43:42
Europe is fly, because obviously that's concentrated, but look at the US. So this is what I mean, the US for those who can't see it. Hi. We've even got a lot of activity in Canada, but it's, you know, Austin, Texas,

43:55
there's been many apps that have been made through doing launching at SXSW. On the battle is

44:03
that Yeah, so you would say that, I think that's

44:05
Texas, their center. smack bang.

44:08
Awesome. So How exciting is that? So that the in terms of engagement, that's what differentiates, different and we could explain this to investors, people say, oh, everyone's doing influence minds like to actually have invested in an app that has that sort of engagement is really unique. But anyway,

44:24
enough about that? How do you ask for the amount of money? And do you have to put your ego aside around early pads?

44:36
Is it is there a bit of begging and vote to feel like you've just got a

44:40
good look, the good news is even though it's exhausting, there's so much value in it. And the value is that you have to really sharpen your offering you when you go because you know that they're asking questions, and each meeting, they have a different lens on it. And so it's just fantastic. It just, I love pressure testing stuff, you know, me I'm analytical. So I'd prefer to obsess over something, get it right and go out. Sadly, tech doesn't work that way. And so there's a sense of tension in me going, Oh, it's not ready. But they allow they help the whole process. There's sharpening and refining and, and, and questioning and scrutinizing. So but but once you've had those conversations, you're hoping that you can then piece together like this round of 10.5 million. we've, we've wanted people in Australia, the UK and America are getting involved. And so that's because they're all their networks. And that's what I mean by that's what I mean by strategic because with vices in there, they've all got powerful people around them. And, and it helps and that and I didn't finish that story about Keith Wade earlier, in terms of the fake followers, but even having him in the UK as a support at the moment. So he was the most critical he was seemed to be the most critical of influencer marketing on the planet because of that statement last year. And it completely transformed the entire category. So everyone hood is not buying fake followers. That means is fake followers. What I didn't hear was that Unilever believes in this so much that we're going to invest in it. But we're just not going to do it with fraudsters. Yeah. And so what happened from there, TJ is that the whole industry is being cleaned up because everyone's panicked and brands have gone, you know what, and luckily, you know, we've built this algorithm that's does that. But since then, after being so critical, or seem to be so critical of influencer marketing, two weeks ago, he was on stage of marketing week live, which is a big event, talking about tribe, you know, and it's huge like that sort of, and that's why I'm excited this point, because after four years, we slowly start to cut through. And we get recognized for what we've been building and the vision,

46:45
when you're chatting to VCs. Have there been any moments where you've completely missed the mark in regards to what they care about? And has it? Did it change how you approached it? Absolutely.

46:57
So they everyone was it was at the knee pads? Yeah.

47:00
Dude, helmet, knee pads, the whole lot.

47:04
Probably

47:04
good at everyone loves rollerblades. If there's something I want to say in a founder, it's enough courage to wear roller blades.

47:12
Publicly sexy, something you would do.

47:14
It's a peacock, imagine it is a peacock. So

47:17
all the time. So I I'm, it's a dangerous territory for me with VCs, because my passion and enthusiasm is really not what they want to hear. They want to hear what the CEO is talking about, which is LTV and CAC and all of these metrics, that I'm not necessarily the number to those things. So so long term value of each customer within our platform. And so it measures that against the cost of acquiring them.

47:45
Yeah. So does it come across as you being naive? Is that what they think?

47:50
as well like it hype

47:51
and naive, because they want hard facts. And I'm talking generally, so I can definitely come across is being a spin style. Like it was just me. Luckily, yeah, I'll do the seasonal but luckily, ants, they're delivering the stack. And so that partnership works really well. But everyone sees it from different lens. So in Asia, they were really hell bent on the metrics in the States. They just love the marketing side and the possibilities because I understand marketing better. And so you just have to know which which strengths you feature more.

48:27
So if you're a company starting out, you're a fan, you get an idea. You act you don't have the years of experience on stage or in front of TV on radio, like Jules lon has, or you don't have an aunt who's a CEO weapon. What do you do

48:44
you play your strengths and you support yourself. So these people that you talk about will probably have greatest strengths and I can ever imagine that we lack and so like everything, you it's a pie shot,

48:56
you know, he was doing a shape of a pie with his hands.

49:00
Very big pie actually.

49:08
Love

49:09
it. Love it.

49:11
So you got to have the right right talent. Lisa is obviously Yes, exactly. heading up the UK efforts to have later on. Can you give us a bit of an intro? About saga we will and then we'll we'll sub you out what what.

49:27
So let's take this Lisa target. She's Australian is you'll find out even though she's running operations in the UK, so she worked for the Daily Mail, here in Australia in sales capacity. And so when she went over to the UK, we were just launching over there and ironically, because of the connection, and she'd done something of success over here, she brought us in over there. But better yet, we were desperate to get some early traction. And she introduced us to some of our friends and got on Selfridges, which is you know, like the more the dive and John's of the UK. And you know, one of my best friends saw and on a gave us a shot him you know, we are knock it out of the park and, and so she had him work for us. And she literally started the office over there in many ways. And so when we started to look for a country manager, at least we're not caught up and she said are you know, maybe I'm interested, I said, Now, you know,

50:18
I pretty much said, I didn't even know what the role entailed. Because I'm once again naive. And it was the best thing because if I said you here would love you, she wouldn't have done it. So she's the sort of person that you decide not not for you, she will say about that. And so we did this massive sort of recruitment and was speaking to everyone from Google and Facebook and everything. And, you know, I think Lisa was 28 at the top right. And it was a mad giving a whole you know, to sum up, she's just so sharp and smart, and passionate, and she'd already proven herself. So it was a real easy one. And she's sort of grown the whole place over there from strength to strength. Awesome. Okay, well, let's get laser.

50:55
That for her? Definitely.

50:58
Can I heckle from afar? I'm worried about

51:00
Yeah, well, we'll just have five minutes with laser and then we'll get you finishing off

51:04
any other headphones because these are a bit sweaty. And I've got

51:06
another really that sweaty. Lisa doesn't even have to wear headphones. I have to wear

51:12
headphones. Well I literally just half a foot away from my I literally just we just bought them. And then we wouldn't have heard the

51:19
sound effects. We won't play any sound effects while laces on bit later. Please come

51:23
back up here.

51:24
I can't remember what

51:26
yellow or yellow. There we go. There we go.

51:29
Welcome. Thank you. I thought it was actually

51:32
going to have

51:33
me on and I absolutely got

51:34
some corrections that I would like

51:38
this job just Firstly, like we're talking about Jules his vision and you know him sort of being in there. And sometimes you feel the full brunt of jewels land. And he's and he's energy. Yeah. What has that been like in terms of the promises he's made? Or the the explanation of the app? And what type of love and then what you've seen happen over the counter us?

52:00
Yeah, look,

52:02
Jules is incredibly energetic. And, you know, with all the work that we've done in the startup community, and that the founders that you say, the ones that are successful, do have a vision that they firmly believe in. And they realize it, you know, essentially what, what Jules does better than most is his manifestation. where he's seen an entire category, he's saying how it should play out and in the right way, and making sure that it's transparent, we do things in a really ethical fashion. He's not about short term wins. And he's, you know, resilience to essentially bear the brunt of an industry going through growing pains. And it's overcrowded. And it's very, very fast growing without pinching any short term wins for that long term success is exactly why I work for the company and why we've been so

52:52
those corrections that you wanted to Oh, yeah,

52:54
yes, I was 26 at the time.

52:59
I'm not 30. Now, I didn't want some extra years.

53:04
But no, that was it. Okay.

53:07
Good. So you feel you? Who have you had to within the UK team in regards to support network? And how have you tried to? Is it your job to emulate culture? Do you think to create a new culture? How do you sort of say that piece?

53:23
Yeah, we were fortunate kind of being, you know, a step away from HQ. So that there's, there's pros and cons of it. And some of the some of the big benefits were we had, we didn't have a blueprint, we could test and learn. And we could almost create offshoot strategies from what was going on in Australia by justifying that the UK was a different market, which enabled us to then start to go, Okay, what what works for the country? What works for the region? And how much of that is true globally? And so we started to pull apart, you know, what a home truths for our product, every market? And what are these, like, local nuances? And, and we didn't have to do that with a lot of red tape. You know, we essentially could you know, how to free Ryan, we didn't know how successful we would be surprised because it is now is it more successful in terms of you usage? and revenue, then Australia?

54:21
Yeah.

54:22
And that the UK market is that we've got a lot more competitors. So you know, Jules often talks about this. They're, they're essentially building and consistently validating our category. And for us, we see that as a massive strength. Anyone that uses a competitive platform and agency in this really early stage, you know, that they're going to test and learn multiple partners. And every time that's an opportunity for us to go in and show them what could be done better, what challenges they had, and they're essentially educated for us, as opposed to probably what's happening in Australia, which is you're constantly having to explain what influencer marketing is some degree by the

54:59
amount of times my mom has asked. So what is Jules is thing, though. I don't know.

55:05
What was the what was the biggest difference between the Australian market and the UK market? And

55:12
we thought the content would be a lot worse because of the daylight. It's not as much sunlight content creators.

55:19
It's nice and soft, though. It's an overcast day. Can

55:22
I do say that for winter photo? Yeah. Is it?

55:25
Is there a lot of rain in England? Or the UK? in London?

55:30
Yeah.

55:31
I say largely because the amount of people that I've said that to their from the UK, they like, it's not as bad as you think.

55:37
I just couldn't justify living there.

55:40
Yeah, I've never seen that many umbrellas in one street.

55:43
Tommy's gonna focus more on just London and geography in general,

55:48
was actually renamed London with you.

56:00
can't spell tribe without an eye. How do you

56:04
spell America without me?

56:07
London?

56:11
what's what's the, what have you learned through the process from a development point of view?

56:17
Well, not so not being with our tech team and our marketing team. Communication is everything for us. And so the coach that we did have to build in the UK was resilient patient, and essentially over communicative. And it it's all about building relationships internally as well. You know, we can't just in a startup, everyone is working at 150% all the time. And not one agenda can really override someone else's. We're all working over hours. We're all tired. We all maybe missed a slack message or an email. To be honest, I don't think it's for Josh tonight. I don't think it would be like that sounds it's I think,

56:58
I think that there's probably there's some competitive nature to it. I think there's, I found when I've worked for businesses that have had different teams and siloed teams, especially, there is the competition of like what they're doing, I think we can do it this way. I think we can go harder, or do you think that that's sort of destructive to the overall dynamic at the company,

57:20
there's this healthy competition, but

57:24
it's also against the world. So I, you know, really, I learned every single day from from the Australian team, and vice versa, you know, one day someone's up, someone's down, it flips, it reverses. And, you know, the UK is not going to be the biggest revenue generator anymore, just on sheer volume. Yeah. So we'll start to look at things like market share, I'm sure. And, you know, start to really, you know, really look at success sort of, in each market a little bit differently, because we're at a more mature stage, but because of the differences in market is it is hard to compare it internally. And you'd be wasting it doing that. You know, for us, we're a very unique product, it's even hard to compare ourselves to competitors a lot of the time. So what we do when we can't work longer, is, you know, we really share and leverage one another's work. And if something's been done in Australia, that we can, you know, just flip and kind of re engineer somehow to tweak for our market, we do it.

58:21
Do you feel personally invested in tribe? I do. Do you think that's a result of the company in its Yeah,

58:28
I guess I sign something, when

58:33
stuff as well, like your, I guess you get going to build this thing from scratch.

58:38
I'm trying to understand how you how you personally get to a point like that working within the business, because I think it's more important than ever for to have complete buy in, because they're not just jobs anymore, you just showing up and taking it off?

58:50
Yeah, it's true. I think one thing that that we speak about a lot in the UK is going to the pub to have a be obvious Yeah, no, is it

59:01
the whole

59:01
idea of having being in a startup at all, and having all the things that, you know, young people or people in, you know, in the in the industry at the moment, want, like flexible working hours, etc, and all the perks, per se, we've got all of that in our control. But really, at the end of the day, even if you have flexible working and unlimited leave, and all these sorts of things that people think are sort of the ticket for a certain company, none of that actually matters if you're not fulfilled by what you're doing. And so we have that, and that's great. But you always find that when people have things like unlimited leave, they often don't take it all, because the choice architecture is changed, you know, they get to choose what they do with their time how invested they want to get, and we spare each other on, you know, we see someone working really hard and kind of doing extra work or thinking differently, inspired you to do something, and we have that mutually inspirational relationship. And that's I think, why as young people, and our teams average age in the UK is something like 2526.

1:00:11
That's exactly what we want, unless

1:00:12
you're asking Jules because he'll say

1:00:15
he's just upset about his own.

1:00:18
But, you know, we have this thing of going, you know, I say, it's like investing in your own MBA, we are learning and we are so fortunate to be able to get across tech marketing sales strategy. And we know at the end of the day, we won't be successful unless we're the ones that have done it. And that level of accountability essentially gives you a blueprint to take into any business, any kind of career that you want, as an individual. And it speaks to entrepreneurship in general. So I think everyone feels personally responsible and really driven by their own journey within tribe. And tribe is just an enabler for that kind of success no matter what you want to do in your role. So that's how you get so invested, because you know exactly how this journey is going to translate into whatever. And fortunately, every year that we put into tribe, and I've been with tribe for two years now.

1:01:11
You know, the equity that tribe builds and tribes name is also built in my name. And the two things aren't mutually exclusive. So

1:01:19
when you excited me? What are you? What are you actually excited about? If you were to look ahead, what because as millennials, we tend to job hop a lot to us, for anyone under 30 is a significant amount of time. What makes you think about staying 34567 years? What does that look like for you? And is it the view from One World Trade Center in New York City? It's actually

1:01:43
not I maybe I'm the only tribe employee that didn't even consider going to New York. And because there's so much more to do in the UK, and when we have built so much positive equity in that market, and there's just so much more to do. So I never even considered that. But looking ahead,

1:02:05
when you talk about like job hopping, something I'm really, really passionate about, because I think you have to look at the reason people do that. And a lot of it is wrapped up in ego is wrapped up in people not understanding themselves, their own motivations, and what drives them. And also people being really lazy and lacking resourcefulness to actually get what they want. You know, I've seen, you know, we've always talked about where a flat structure where startup we don't know, you know, what's going to be unraveled sort of around the next corner. So I can't hire someone and say you're going to lead a team of five in 12 months time. We never make any promises, because that's the quickest way to piss off an employee to be honest. Yeah, you say, but it could be 50. Exactly. If you create it. Yeah. If you create enough business in the UK that we are market leaders, go start tribe, Spain, yeah, you know, like you with everything is just this is this open world of possibility, if you create it, and again, that accountability, and that, that, that feeling of, you know, I can actually do this myself and no one else is going to do it means we don't we don't see any problem with retention or churn. And we've been very fortunate for anyone that, you know, is essentially entrepreneurial in their own right, I thought

1:03:20
you would have seen a fair bit of drop off after the Nando's card went,

1:03:23
but

1:03:25
in the UK, they've got the pace, the pace. Now we're specifically talking about what's on the menu.

1:03:35
Here we got spice. Do you ever buy the P you know the piece you can get them separately as a side not a fan of pays? Really, when I admit anyway,

1:03:43
no one knows who Josie is in the UK, outside of the industry, people and now Jews Jews, his name is synonymous with influence marketing and marketing in the UK, but definitely know and we often show some sizzle reels of your glory days.

1:04:00
It's definitely nine How good is this?

1:04:02
Doesn't get any better than this. Very, very get away. Get away. But to be clear, Jules has 90 pockets in in Australia.

1:04:11
Anyway, we'll we'll get Jules back on. Thank you. Thanks

1:04:15
for that, man. Jules, you've you've managed to find a team that highly engaged investors into the

1:04:26
impressive is least back there. And we've got you know, we've got people like that all through the company. I think about our sales director, semi major up in Sydney is running a team. You know, I think

1:04:37
she's me. She's switched on.

1:04:38
Yeah, so she'd be bad. I think she's a bit scared.

1:04:45
I mean, what's what do you think it is that with it from a hiring point of view? What do you what do you actually look at? What was it about Lisa? Where you like, actually think that you could? Because I think it's a it's a risk. Investing in young at that leadership level? A lot of people aren't doing it.

1:05:02
Yeah, yeah. And to be honest, I say I was executive I meant, you know, like,

1:05:08
you actually kind of fooled the people that you want at the time. But that's the reality of it. And so what you're trying to do is find those that are just about to pop, and I can pop, you've given the opportunity through your company, you're

1:05:22
playing an investment game at your your event. Exactly.

1:05:26
And so and and all it comes down to is learning agility. So I just all i i'm very prejudice around like I, I just love and fascinated by

1:05:40
smart, innovative, irritated people, people who are irritated with life that they get frustrated that God Surely there's a bit of why, and that irritation within their body just allows them to motivate and my innovate.

1:05:59
And I saw

1:06:00
just looking for the things that you don't say in yourself or you looking piss off my that was a real was that although we've turned down the

1:06:07
that is there, but I guess in some regards, I say it is actually say those qualities in what you're doing with the reach and also the it's just like it,

1:06:16
it's

1:06:18
I say, I don't want people the same skills as me. Yeah, but I definitely want people with the same thinking as me. And that is, yeah, as you say, it's just

1:06:27
same as thinking different strength.

1:06:29
Yeah,

1:06:30
exactly. Exactly. But, you know, we've been really lucky and, you know, and it's funny, you talk about millennials and job hopping, like, early on, Oh, I'd get really ghosted if someone left but I just love it now. Like if you know, like I I would be so happy for these people to move on to a role that they felt was a step up.

1:06:49
Like if we

1:06:50
if they felt that hit the ceiling within our company that we're growing

1:06:55
on now so proud of, but sadly a few of them do that. And then I end up going, can we come back? Because

1:07:02
so and you You fucked up? Is that what you said?

1:07:04
Yeah, I don't respond.

1:07:08
I think he's ever say

1:07:11
no, I know a couple of that have left out there from the very beginning, the early Nando's days. And they've personally told me that they came to you and sort of upset and said, I've got this opportunity. And you're like, God,

1:07:23
yeah, well,

1:07:24
you guys, I mean, we've always talked about these. And it's look at my career, you know, I was studying graphic design and then I was doing life coaching, graphic design and then I was doing radio than TV and then radio and then social and oh, I'll probably do travel photography next or do sketching or you know, like all continually move on those things that feel like they excite me and if you don't have that, you really got nothing because the money's in everything. If you're gonna work your ass off, you get money doing whatever the key is doing the things that doesn't feel as much like you're working.

1:07:56
What's the next milestone? And more specifically, what are you anxious about? what's the what's the thing you have to worry about next? We got a good

1:08:07
day we got you last time in the

1:08:10
doldrums. Yeah, exactly. You were in the train you're in a tunnel you go so fast, you can't go back and

1:08:14
so when exciting things happen you probably start to hedge your bets or thinking about where this could fuck up a weirdo

1:08:21
well we've got you know we've got the next 12 to 18 months it's a big swing and we're trying to take a bite out of the Big Apple like it's a massive to do but bird sounds very

1:08:29
media try and I like that

1:08:32
better than just throwing those down his LinkedIn capture

1:08:38
he's a beta testing on the show. I think that's a good one bite out of the Big Apple. Can you like can we actually get a photo of you eating an apple in Times Square? Yeah.

1:08:48
sock on

1:08:51
the so i think i think we've these these are enormous amount of

1:08:59
like if we weren't good shit was we're actually would spending their money on the wrong thing like we are investors want us to be not terrified, debilitated Wi Fi, but it's ambitious, like we've gone. Australia will take that will try and do that in the UK. And then we're going yeah, the biggest capture planet for marketing. I'll take that one. And like this, there must be 1400 competitors over there. Like they're not they're going God we really need another influence American Life. So it's a it's a very ballsy thing to do. So absolutely. As things don't work in the timeline that we needed to it always look like things are going well. But if it's not happening in the timeline that we needed to, then yeah, we start to get towards the end of the runway, and it just drops off like a cliff. So that's nerve wracking, but also just the balance of life. Because if I go down that tunnel again, Rod, like this time I'm I'm now really with meditation, and I got in the ballot for the New York Marathon. So

1:09:58
last marathon. I did.

1:10:01
Yeah, so what happened was, we surprised Jules bike making him run a marathon in London. And I decided I was I was filming and the the one moment George was like, if you can, if I can do this, I want to get a shot of me running along and the London Eye in the background. And unfortunately, I had a rickshaw driver and I was 120 kilos. And he couldn't he couldn't get up the hill.

1:10:25
I was running faster, the least Rick short.

1:10:27
So it was I mean, it was mean all around my radio team guy literally blindfolded, lift the blindfold his trainer on one side and on the other, you're running 42 kilometers, right? You're on the the London Olympic London Marathon circuit that in 12 days they're going to be running for real but today it's just normal traffic and you're going to see how far you can run. Right and they're all laughing at me and I like the night before I'd green chicken Karina? bourbon that morning. No breakfast the furthest side run was nine K.

1:10:58
So I'm seeing our guy hockey guys. So I put my head down and I completed the entire Maryland no training within under five hours and

1:11:06
they came out with an injury was Josh

1:11:08
Oh, yeah. So I actually back well,

1:11:10
the missus he was there for

1:11:12
jaws. I just remember being the

1:11:15
how much was I hiding you there? The mature

1:11:16
hotel. There was a fight that. We mentioned that last time.

1:11:21
You've got ahead of me staring at you as you're taking photos.

1:11:25
And I

1:11:28
can you find that photo?

1:11:29
Well, absolutely. But the reason the big fight was in the tube and because I said we just need some candid photos of you guys like on the tube. And Jules wasn't smiling. And I said, Can you smile a little bit? And he said, Well, that's not candidate. And then so we had this we had we had a fight in the tube for five minutes about what it meant to be candid about. It's not fucking care. I want you to be Don't be candid. I can.

1:11:57
That's like faking sincerity.

1:11:59
So what's the ballot with the New York,

1:12:02
New

1:12:02
York Marathon? So I'm really excited about that, which I don't know where I'll find the time this year. But you guys can imagine that outlet, you know, in thinking is great for my brain. And then I wouldn't mind you know, doing some other projects off the bucket list. But the other things that make me nervous and obviously, you know, like to be a father and a husband and all those things is is tricky with travel. So how do

1:12:21
you balance it though? Because you are free shipping go there fun that we have. Yeah,

1:12:26
you were not having it as much anymore. I'm having with other people now.

1:12:31
JJ always cried. I

1:12:35
mean to be

1:12:38
a man does run,

1:12:39
we should get Mr. 97. He's always got a question. If he doesn't we make him ask, but I got a

1:12:44
question. She was what are you excited for in terms of user generated content? For the next six months? I think there's been like a massive shift towards like honesty and posting. And

1:12:53
yeah, so what

1:12:54
are you excited for? Well, to be honest, our marketplace hasn't been awesome for video content enough. And so there's a huge opportunity there. I don't think the creators and these you know, for us, our marker influences have between 3000 100,000

1:13:09
followers, like the everyday people, right? And yeah, even so I like the people with zero to 3000 followers. I think that content is valuable to brands as well. But it's not that they can't create amazing content sister brands on asking for it. Yeah. And we're not helping the brands asked for the type of video content because when they asked for it, they can't necessarily upload example videos within our platform. So we're shifting all that at the moment and sounds. It sounds

1:13:36
extraordinary think that four years on, you know, you can't upload video, but this is how long it takes to create this thing. What

1:13:42
is it? Is it the heaviness of the video?

1:13:45
Yeah, I lost my done asked about I'm going to say yes, because

1:13:49
sounds about right. It says what? What is the actual industry that you think is doing the best job on this sort of influences, but

1:13:58
I actually think the beauty industry is doing the best stuff of video content because and also things like unboxing. And also just how to tutorials and makeup. I think the way that's I reckon that content is really engaging, and people are getting better and better at it. And I think it can work really well on Instagram, but also things like drone footage all the way through to cinema graphs and stop motion is amazing stuff. TJ is done a bit of Tommy's done a bit of stop motion, he did a chop chop thing for our platform. That wasn't his account. So we actually had to block him. So he hasn't been invited back was Ryan, John's Instagram account. Amazing.

1:14:34
I got all the fake followers past them. Yeah. JACK. Yeah.

1:14:38
No. And so yeah, I'm excited about video content. And as you know, the smartphones are only getting better and better and better. So yes. And also taking that video content. Mr. 97. Yeah. And putting it in digital out of home. So you think of the

1:14:58
fact is that would you say digital out of home? Yeah. Was that man well,

1:15:00
out of home is outdoor idea. So billboards and all the stuff in Westfield shopping centers, and yeah, bus shelters, and now to digital. And so they've gone from printing one thing to now being able to have hundreds and hundreds of things in that screen, which means you now need sort of volumes of content. And so we did this Bacardi one where they got all this content. And then they had 70 pieces of content. And they were the photo featured a hotel or a bar, they put that content within a five mile radius of that bog, I go there with the actual picture. And so they can do this now through digital out of home, which means it's all programmatic. And so as soon as it turned onto that, it's now like, it needs huge amounts of volumes. And they can't go to a billboard, you know, a creative agency agency. And because they need so much of it, and now it's the first time in history, Mr. 97 that people like you can create awesome content, they can sit on a billboard.

1:15:59
It's so exciting saying you talk in front of a group of people you tell people to get out their phones, send through something that hasn't brand involved in the picture. Everyone's got one in their phones, except a Mr. Nice Evan doesn't really take many photos. And then you put them up on billboards, your everyone has the capability.

1:16:16
Yeah, yeah. Is it a cost per minute thing? Just out of curiosity, how they how did they charge out that when we say digital billboard, yeah, what How's that, actually,

1:16:24
at the media side, I'm not sure. But when a content creator submits it, they get paid a flat fee. And then the brand can use that in perpetuity for online or digital out of home. And so if it's being printed, or it's in billboards, you get a lot more money. And so our content creators, keeping in mind that our content creators because they are not publishing all of that content on the social feed, yeah, we just have content campaigns as well. Then they can get like five or six pieces of content, like they can do a photoshoot right on a sunny day and get five or six pieces of content purchased, like it's on on the road phone. Like it's pretty extraordinary. And that's what is really exciting because brands really need that. Customers can do it. But it requires an enormous amount of technology in between and we've spent four years building for that which both sides of the marketplace don't know yet exists.

1:17:16
And it's been well received the content creation from

1:17:19
absolutely on can grow more I mean, the reality is going to Cameron going his 300 pieces of content of your Cadbury cream eggs.

1:17:27
Jai Jai Xmas water

1:17:29
I actually heard we've done we've done cream eggs on the show. Yeah, actually. So

1:17:32
today they from the UK as well.

1:17:35
Yeah. Okay, so giving them 300 pieces of content is exciting for them because they've never had it. But it's also giving them another problem that how do I take those assets and turn them into like a a 12 second instance stories, video. So what we're now doing is playing with actually, you can go and get all these branded content and then we create the ads with radicals and logos, and give them a whole swag bag full of these mobile for social video ads that are designed to convert a brand's going on specific licensing. Like say for instance, you find that they just want the license that gives them across everything are they focusing on digital mostly digital I mean it should be disposable style of content like it should be moving fast now that you can get up more and more

1:18:21
we missed our meeting

1:18:23
yesterday

1:18:26
Yep, is the day is going to be over by the time we finish.

1:18:30
Now I mean, you've got no stamina or any moment we wanted two hours.

1:18:35
Two

1:18:35
hours and then he sent it to me heavily some I said

1:18:37
I can't give you like always there.

1:18:40
You know what's good sometimes actually can listen to a dean, can you watch yourself back on things? Yeah,

1:18:46
yeah. Now

1:18:51
the hardest part is getting the beta and VHS tapes copied over to a USB.

1:18:57
So I go

1:18:58
back to my glory Guys, can we please do this? We're gonna so we can load in our own sound effects. Can we just get one of you? Yeah, I know you're channeling show quantum said. Does it get any better than this?

1:19:12
Yeah, very good. actually imagine though. I think you did a lot more yelling but that

1:19:17
was a long

1:19:20
way off my got yoga.

1:19:23
And it's so I'm in snowboard gear.

1:19:26
The heli the Hell yeah.

1:19:27
But they let you know by the way, how would the helicopter say where we're zooming out now would they have a walkie talkie and probably page me

1:19:36
now I got I've got I got it right right

1:19:37
three to

1:19:39
stick around because after the break can train around tree heads to family friendly. He

1:19:47
do bring up the river river area thing. Absolutely no job

1:19:53
at the deli talk show.

1:19:55
It's a long it's a very long story. It's a daily talk show. Jules. Thanks for coming on the show how long until you leave too.

1:20:02
stressed again.

1:20:04
Get me back with

1:20:06
you in Melbourne now for a bit. Okay, so you can turn off your email signature. He's in town and probably

1:20:13
daily talk show Hi, at the daily talk show.com if you want to send us an email, otherwise, we'll see you tomorrow. See you guys I
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