Unknown Speaker 0:03
The Daily Talk Show Episode 716 Georgie boy here, going through all the interviews from the 24 hour livestream. And we're up to Michelle Battersby, who is the CMO at Cape cleaner, and the former APAC marketing director at Bumble. This is a really interesting chat. I think you're gonna enjoy this one.

Josh Janssen 0:22
Michelle Battersby. Michelle, welcome to the show.

Unknown Speaker 0:30
Before

Josh Janssen 0:31
So, you were saying you've got your acoustic guitar ready? What are you what are you going to be before?

Unknown Speaker 0:36
Yeah, I'll come up with a song by the end of the show.

Josh Janssen 0:43
So for people who don't know you, you were at Bumble for ages you were sort of doing amazing stuff, especially in Melbourne. I just feel like there was so many events and things happening. And now you're the next big brand witches. How's things going? You know, so for you?

Unknown Speaker 1:06
Well I'm from Sydney so I moved to Melbourne in November to start my new role at Cape cleaner. I thought it was gonna be a blast you know Melbourne has a great Kolkata amazing restaurants bars and now I'm finding myself stuck indoors unable to make any new friends so who it is an interesting time but very grateful to be working for keep it cleaner that can help people at the moment whilst everyone is stuck inside. So you've got random phrases

Unknown Speaker 1:37
think Melbourne phrases.

Josh Janssen 1:43
Guy Michelle. Sorry. No, no, no, no No housemates. We're just, we're in Melbourne and we're always looking for mates. Do you want it?

Unknown Speaker 1:56
Absolutely. I really need some friends. So wants to see All over. Yeah, I'm very available.

Josh Janssen 2:03
We got zoom as well. Anyway, so sorry

Tommy 2:07
Josh. Josh likes to use these opportunities to book out he's next catch up with his new friends so I had to I was gonna have to when I said friends, Michelle, what's your what's your schedule like at the moment with what's happened from you know, ISO and Coronavirus. I know that you have seen you in at the office in South Melbourne what what's changed in your world and the cape cleaner world.

Unknown Speaker 2:36
A lots changed. We've obviously had to adapt to the current climate and be really considerate of that. This is my seventh week working from home. So the whole team has been working from home which means that were online a lot. You definitely have to be extra diligent with how you communicate things and just make sure you're checking in with everyone. So it is easy peasy. Change in terms of how we're working and then in terms of what my day to day looks like it's really just about how we can keep targeting people within their homes. So we launched a virtual gym and our co founders have been running the live workouts for free on Wednesdays and Fridays for over a month now which has been great and that's been key focus of the house.

Josh Janssen 3:26
I thought I thought I'd talk too much so I was gonna give TJ the stage. I've always got questions

Tommy 3:30
but the idea is one for one we do what you're doing a 24 hour livestream stream so being normally feel silence

Josh Janssen 3:39
and I was like you know what, I'm just gonna feel it I'm feeling it. I know t Jays got something and that's what happens. What's sort of what's your exercise regime at the moment like being an ISO

Unknown Speaker 3:53
I'm a pretty bad example, but I I focus a lot on cooking. That's my family. favourite part as opposed to playing a half, I love all of the recipes and I've been doing that just to distract myself. I feel like it's a hobby that you can definitely build on at the moment. But of course I'm joining the live workouts and velocities has been a go to for me, because I, you know, you don't have to break a sweat if you don't want to, but it's great to still turn up and get yourself moving, which is also so important. If you are just indoors all day I'm finding myself getting a bit of cabin fever.

Tommy 4:30
Michelle, what have you learned about coming from a brand like Bumble which I don't know who owns it, there's not a face behind it, other than I picture a B when I think of Bumble when you go to kick and you got the lower you know, Laura Henshaw, Steph clay Smith, I think of those girls, and I think about their brands that I know I connect with him, what have you learned about brands that have someone behind it and then brands that are standalone like Bumble.

Unknown Speaker 4:58
So the owner of Bumble actually He's an incredible woman, she co founded Tinder. And she ended up leaving 10. Tinder as part of a sexual harassment case, which is public knowledge. But that's why on Bumble women make the first move. So there actually is quite a big profile behind that brand over in the US. And then I, it was kind of my job to localise it over here. So I have actually dealt with that kind of a face before but just never in the same country. And obviously, that is one of the great benefits of now working at a bit cleaner. And the biggest thing that really stood out to me when joining was just the strength of the community that Steph and Laura have really cultivated and worked so hard to nurture. And that's one of the most incredible things about Laura and Steph is they just engage in that community every day, which is so unique for two owners of an app to really show such care about them. people that use the product. So I really admire and respect Steph and Laura for that. Because you know, running a company is a busy job in itself, let alone managing, you know, we've got a Facebook community it keep it clean, and now it's nearly 35,000 people, and it is incredibly active. So they're great at really showing that care. And I think, yeah, that's a really unique thing about the two of them.

Josh Janssen 6:25
I feel like you were a big part of Bumble in regards to that sort of, sort of front facing stuff. Was it hard leaving Did you feel like from an identity perspective, you have to do like any personal work?

Unknown Speaker 6:39
Yeah, I think I do have an identity crisis. When I left. I went silent on all of my social media channels for a while actually, and it was quite hard to deal with because I've really found myself quite embedded in the Bumble brand. So it wasn't hard transition in that respect, but I'm still getting to do you know, a lot, you know, the same sorts of things that keep it clean. I think what's made it a little challenging for me is that I'm very used to running at a million miles an hour. And, you know, we obviously had some big plans to do with keep it cleaner when I joined. And we've now had to change all of that due to what's happening in the world. So it's more just a personal struggle for me, I'm slowing down, which this time in society has definitely made. A lot of people have to do and I think it's just a personal you know, it's a personal opinion kind of on how you how you deal with that. But yeah, I'm, I'm fine. I've got my identity back now. And now, identity.

Tommy 7:51
Was the learning of identity though in that is there any sort of retrospectives where you're like, maybe I put too much here or you know, was thinking too much about this area? What's your thought?

Unknown Speaker 8:04
Yeah, that is a very, very great point. I think even now we've what's going on in the world, it really brings in some added perspective. I flogged myself at Bumble and I loved doing that at the time, and I needed to do that at the time. But looking back on it now, I probably should have prioritised myself, my personal life and my health better than I had. And I think that's one of the best things about working to keep it clean and now is that I'm working for a company that really values mental and physical health and your well being and it's just so ingrained in the company. So that's really helped with that, but I think just yeah, I probably just invest so much of myself in that one brand and looking back on it now. I probably could have been a bit easier on myself. From time to time, and that would have helped with the identity crisis as well. I think I mean,

Tommy 9:05
yeah. Just a follow up for you jump in judge I do you think it's required, though, because you did such an awesome job you could look at is like, that's the way needed to be done, because that's the way I did it. Is there another perspective to that is that there is multiple ways or did you need to do that painful process of, you know, what you what you did to achieve that great result?

Unknown Speaker 9:31
I think it's an interesting one, because in a start up, it is a lot like a race against the clock, like you've got to grow and you've got to grow quickly. And I think that that's a mentality that a lot of the early start is bringing to those companies. You really do have to dedicate a lot of your time to it and prove it's going to work and do it quickly, especially in tech. Otherwise, you may miss the moment. So so I think with Bumble, yes, I do need to do that. But also on a personal level, I just find I work more efficiently, you know, when I do kind of live and breathe the brand. So that helped even just on a personal level with my own performance. And now I'm lucky because I can come in to keep it clean at a different stage where it actually is already an established brand. And now I can really focus on how we grow and scale that. So it's a bit of a different requirement for me now.

Josh Janssen 10:38
I guess company culture and I feel like you're a high performer like obviously, you're doing crazy hours and working all the time. How do you deal with having colleagues or employees and setting expectations around what you expect?

Unknown Speaker 10:55
Yeah, so I would never hold anyone to the sign standards that I hold myself to, I'd probably have no one that we want to work for me. I think what I really try to set a positive example, like I put boundaries in place, I put this on my Instagram the other day, you know, if I'm working at 10pm, I would never send an email to anyone in my team at that time, because, you know, they're not in the role that I am in, and I don't expect them to be online or responsive at those times, you know, I will set triggers. So it sends to them at you know, 9am a day or

Unknown Speaker 11:34
reflects

Unknown Speaker 11:36
really, really the right girl. Um, but I think that again, like all of, you know, kick is still a startup. And I think that startups do attract, you know, driven, fast paced type people because that's the kind of culture that does exist in those kinds of companies. So there will be people who will just naturally Want to dedicate a lot of their time to it? And I think as well you know, when you have a powerful brand, with a great mission that's doing great things, like keep it cleaner, then it's much easier to also give that extra time to it because you actually enjoy it.

Tommy 12:15
I think it's been a real reframing around bums on seats in offices, especially with everyone getting shut down at home, what's what's it internal at kick with getting stuff done and the situation you're in, we've all been dealt.

Unknown Speaker 12:30
Yeah, I do think you need to be really considerate of different people's working style. And I also think there are so many things that are going on within the home as well, you know, everyone will be affected by this moment differently. So it's important for all managers and leaders to be considerate of what their teams may be dealing with, at home as well. And maybe they don't have a home environment that is conducive to high productivity. So I think you just have to be mindful of that. But I also think there's some great benefits in this moment. Right now, we just hired someone new to our team who will be based in New Castle, because we've really seen that you can operate quite well, virtually, and that maybe you don't need to see people in the office every day to get stuff done. And I don't think we would have all been as open to that if we hadn't have proven it to ourselves within this moment now. So I think that's one of the great things that a lot of these businesses might be realising firsthand at the moment

Josh Janssen 13:34
with the rebrand going from Bumble making the shift, I like Ray brands and I also like the transitions between roles like of them. I love stories of you know, people blowing up or whatever and you know, crack it and leaving their office or getting walked out that type of thing. What was the what's the conversation when you are such a pivotal part of a brand I can imagine they would sort of be pretty upset to see so you go, how do you sort of have the conversation and soften the blow on such a big decision?

Unknown Speaker 14:08
Yeah, there was no Mic drop me like speeding off my car. Last foiling like I want, as I learned, it was I did go about it really considerately. And I wanted to do that I cared. And I still do care so much about Bumble. You know, I was the first employee in Australia and had to launch it in this country. So I felt so attached to it and the team. So I went straight to Whitney, the C. Over in the US, and I told her about it, and I gave her the opportunity. Um, you know, I wanted to let her know it was open for discuss in a bit, but um, you know, I had a few big conversations with her. But what made it easier was She really did me in it at the end. But I ended up working a five month notice period and finishing out some big projects for them just so I could leave them in the best position possible. And I think that as a younger person, I definitely do do like the mic drop. See you later stuff a few times. And yeah, but it's just better to go about considerately like you come into a company trying to make a good impression on people and that's how you should act to leading a company as well.

Tommy 15:38
Look, I think if you cross a bridge and then burn it down, you can't get back to the other side. So it's probably the best thing not to burn down a bridge. That's why Yeah, bridges.

Unknown Speaker 15:47
Right, like let's burn some bridges.

Tommy 15:56
Just going to say saves, can we put that five month clause on yours? Employment plays I mean, that can go away the way I feel Michelle, I

Josh Janssen 16:03
think having someone that gives five months in artists I've seen, like where it's like really great, and you pass it on and then there's the other side, which is just like dragging a lot of times of Ruin account. Yeah, a lot of a lot of time to finish it up, right.

Unknown Speaker 16:20
I guess, you know, I was really lucky because they always really trusted me. I think they know, I was not going to tear it to the ground. And I love the things I got to do at the end, you know, like the last thing I did was work on the Melbourne Cup and that's such a, you know, a huge moment for a company. So I'm very public as well, so it's never gonna stop that one off.

Tommy 16:47
Michelle, what do you think? Putting your marketing hat on, I guess it's always on. Not that you're wearing a hat now but in for a brand that doesn't have a powerhouse community. Behind us, like the kick girls, and the business you're in, what do you think this sort of got like one area to invest in your market one area to invest your marketing efforts in, when you don't have that when you don't have a community yet.

Unknown Speaker 17:17
I think you can't do anything without a great product. I don't know if that's just the obvious, you know, cliche response, but you will never get a good community anyway, if you don't have a decent product to offer them. I think everyone says, product is king. And you can have a great product without it, you know, making any difference in the world as well. And you'll still get this cult following if it's an amazing product. So I think just nailing the offering is the best is the best thing to start with. And then you can go about the community that comes with it.

Josh Janssen 17:55
So you're talking Michelle about the fact that things obviously change Keep it cleaner with all the COVID stuff was, like, you guys gonna be doing a lot of events. So where was that big impact?

Unknown Speaker 18:08
Yeah, we were going to be doing a lot of events and activations within Australia. And we were also looking at international expansion. So we did have a few things kind of already on the calendar for overseas. So obviously pulled the plug on all of that. But I do think it's been a good time for us to really reassess and regroup. And a great time to just bring the team together. You know, a few new team members at the moment and it is a small company. So it's a good chance for us to reset and really get all of our strategy in place before we you know, kick off again.

Tommy 18:49
I guess it's time for businesses to also look at the product offering and look at their offering and, and spend the time there because I know that when you're when you're flying and you're trying to build out the team We need more people. That can be a real distraction. Do you think there is a disadvantage to growing fast? In a business, Michelle? And if so, what do you think it is?

Unknown Speaker 19:12
Yeah, I think that you, I mean, that probably comes back to reactiveness. A little bit as well, I think that sometimes you can be so distracted by what's going on around you, or what your competitors are doing that you might make some quick decisions to try and keep up, but they might not actually be the best decisions for your brand. So even just going back to what you were saying before, you know, without giving away too much, we have been using this time to look at our product and how we can make the user experience even better. But again, you know, there's only so much you can slow down, especially within those first few years in the startup space. But I think it's just about things that I'm staying laser focused on what your goal is, and you Not letting anything come into that lane to distract you from that

Josh Janssen 20:04
you've at keep it clean. It is like a few pillars. There's obviously sort of the digital product. But I panic bought a bunch of the portables to buy them all in the first two days. And the problem is I think there's an odd number or whatever. So my girlfriend and I are always like arguing who gets the third ball. But what's what's the what's the deal when it comes to? Like, I'm curious about the COVID-19 stuff like how does how does supply chain and stuff from a food perspective? Has there been any interesting stuff with there but also the challenges of having such differing sort of parts of the business?

Unknown Speaker 20:47
Yeah, so I honestly am not the go to person for grocery and can't speak from experience about how that's paying because we have a separate grocery ting who manage all of that they sit within Now office but it is a separate you know department and kind of structure over there. But of course you know this has been impacted them enormously particularly because of all of the panic buying and you know stock coming from places outside of Australia. But yeah I don't proactively work on the grocery side so I can't share as much knowledge as I'd like to there.

Tommy 21:27
Josh, I saw no you wanted the discount right for the balls.

Josh Janssen 21:34
To be honest, the exercising bid I'm with you, Michelle. Like the food The food is

Tommy 21:42
amazing. The kitchen right Josh? What do you what do you have the word the words pivots, opportunity, very, very common at the moment, Michelle? Those words being used, I mean, within your vocab in what you're doing. Are you looking for that? Or are you just sort of going nuts? We've got the opportunity, let's not get distracted.

Unknown Speaker 22:12
Um, we the only thing you know, that we've really done to hardly positively help people at the moment is the virtual gym. So that was asked, really leaning into the COVID-19 situation, having a look internally and thinking, what can we do here to help people that was the pure basis for that. And we've had thousands of people on those lives every week, and we'd love being able to do that. It's obviously completely free, open to anyone. So that means it's really accessible and you can keep moving within your home and just get a bit of a taste for what paper cleaner is like without actually having to subscribe, which I think is really important at the moment because so many people are being impacted financially. And that's the worst The one thing that we did to acknowledge this time, which I think is really important, and then in the background, we've stayed focused on what we have coming up after this. So yeah, that's really the the key change for us at the moment.

Tommy 23:17
I love it, because it's almost like looking for where can we bring more value in this time? I think a lot of people might mistake the opportunity with where can where's the opportunity for us? It's a bit like inward focused versus outwards, and it sounds like, yeah, that was for you guys.

Unknown Speaker 23:34
Yeah, the virtual gym. You know, it was definitely, if anything, it makes you think, you know, are we going to lose people doing this because we're putting so much free content out there. But I don't think that that's what's important at the moment. That's not the right way to be thinking about this. So it really did come from a place of wanting to do good and I think it does say so much about Laura and Steph because you know, they've been getting there. time every week two or three times a week and that just says so much about them as well. Which yeah I love

Josh Janssen 24:10
what's your screen time been like since banging I say

Unknown Speaker 24:14
oh my god I've actually yeah I guess I think I said to someone Am I going blind because I was dying coloured differently

Unknown Speaker 24:24
than I do any of this

Unknown Speaker 24:28
Shannon Shannon

Unknown Speaker 24:29
in the comments saying that Michelle and bill on my favourite on Tick Tock so

Unknown Speaker 24:35
oh my god yeah I have been doing some tech talks with my boyfriend but he is a way better dancer than me. So every time I put them up it's with a little bit of hesitation because I just looks so bad compared to him.

Unknown Speaker 24:51
He talks a good little side hobby at the moment.

Josh Janssen 24:55
I am bill I did a I did a panic. I'm doing a lot of panic stuff like One of them was head shave, which is an absolute disaster. Oh, it's Yeah. It started it's Yeah. Anyway, he's got a very nice head. What does he sort of do? How does it what's the what's the maintenance is there sort of when you do the scalp health products help health What? Help Help Michelle.

Unknown Speaker 25:23
Lucky she's had quite a nice day. But he moisturises he's a whole like face. Like if he was putting on face moisturiser, his face stops like back here. So he so he extends it all the way. But he's shy, he shaves it all all the time but um, he was actually going to try to grow out. He does still have some growth around here. Use the ISO here moment was going to be growing out the sides and die by platinum. But it does look so horrific that I will put a stop to that.

Josh Janssen 26:01
They would have loved it but I mean, is he going is the name of the game when you are bold to have it shiny or is it? Okay,

Unknown Speaker 26:10
yeah. And you've really got to put a lot of sun cream on it and I mean you've got me on so you're protected but yeah he all will head can get very sunburn sometimes, so always make sure that you've got lots of sun cream on and just keep it really moisturise. I think he shaves it every second day

Josh Janssen 26:29
really any like guy Do you get any breakouts or anything with using so much moisturiser? I was worried about that with moisturiser you know?

Unknown Speaker 26:36
He was walking he has good skin now. I'll let you know what brand he's using. And you should try that one. Yeah, definitely.

Unknown Speaker 26:46
Any he mean we could do a whole episode

Josh Janssen 26:51
of you. Does he get an itchy head?

Unknown Speaker 26:54
I don't think so.

Josh Janssen 26:57
Does he wear beanies much?

Unknown Speaker 26:59
Yeah, loves him. Loves love. You know, when we first met it was always hats on because I think he was in a little bit of denial about the inevitable that he was going to be bald. Um, but but now he's embraced it, you know, he he sells taps and jumpers that say all

Josh Janssen 27:19
really he's really lent it you can go that way with it can't you just sort of really lean in? I

Tommy 27:29
mean you need to create a Instagram account for your head Josh

Josh Janssen 27:34
like tota underscore toe

Unknown Speaker 27:37
follow him but oh

Unknown Speaker 27:39
my god

Unknown Speaker 27:41
yeah, yes both sides

Unknown Speaker 27:44
Megan Fox has one

Josh Janssen 27:48
so yeah, I mean, so was there a point where he shaved his head and then grew up back because the thing that seems to be happening is everyone's like Ah, it will grow back quick, which I find offensive because my Maybe this is like my rebrand and so like maybe I don't want it to grow back

Unknown Speaker 28:05
I think if it's thinning out like you just go to you just take the plunge so bill it came down to a photo I can still say the photo in my mind he was like it was like from one of those games and it was running with purple and he had been like flattening down the little bit of hair that he had left but obviously playing in the game and it all popped up and it's just the worst of us so after that photo that it was all shaping up.

Josh Janssen 28:35
Was it emotional? Do you remember that? Remember the actual the whole shaving experts like you and him in the shower so they're doing it?

Unknown Speaker 28:43
Yeah, we've actually got photos of me just shaving it all off. He was fine because everyone then just said how much better he looked bald. So it's worked for him.

Tommy 28:55
Beauty regimes in, in ISO I mean, it's a they're a beauty business. After just shave his head could be seen as a breakdown but what's your go to?

Josh Janssen 29:05
In a skin? for your skin? Yeah, in the comments. So yeah, you give us a breakdown would be nice.

Unknown Speaker 29:12
Oh, okay. Um, so I usually am really lazy with my skin but I was getting the slow breakouts. So I invested in a well when I say invest, one of them was $13. So I got a really good vitamin C serum, which is from lower Jose, I don't know if I'm saying that correctly. And then another good serum put over the top of that which is from the ordinary that was only $13. I feel like that's the one everyone wants to know about.

Tommy 29:44
us to get those those. Hey, just Michelle, what's something you're looking forward to on the other side of ISO personally not workwise something that that you're just craving or looking forward to?

Unknown Speaker 29:58
Oh, I just can't wait to go out for dinner. No, I feel like I'll never say no to plans ever again. I just want to go out for a nice meal drink a little too much and then go out.

Josh Janssen 30:09
I reckon that will change I reckon like you'll regret saying that like it nearly nights will just be like she'll go to any event we I mean what's your go to restaurant in Melbourne? What do you what do you normally like to go to?

Unknown Speaker 30:27
Oh, I said this to someone yesterday but I'd only just started going to France law which people had told me was like cool a cool place to go to in Melbourne You know, I'm really trying to fit in so I want to do you know what?

Unknown Speaker 30:41
A bit from one place that one was Francoise

Unknown Speaker 30:45
on track right

Unknown Speaker 30:46
track, right? Okay.

Tommy 30:48
Yep, French, French it's got awesome steaks, snails. It's where I had my first smile. It's Yeah, that we should do it. We should that you know you know, We should all

Josh Janssen 31:07
be on a French cuisine. Like it's not it's not my favourite. I would

Tommy 31:15
like fries Dude, I would go

Josh Janssen 31:18
I'd go Mexican tie like this probably there's a bigger list before What is it? Was it just the experience? Or do you actually like the food more than sort of your average food

Unknown Speaker 31:30
it's just that I've been there twice and both times that I went there just turned into a really good night so I feel like it's a great place to start if you're looking for a good time. That's really what it comes down to. And the food and just the atmosphere is amazing. And I just yeah, I'm just dying to go out 15 out with a limited friend to you know, the friends that I do have all you guys now.

Unknown Speaker 31:57
Limited friendship group today.

Josh Janssen 32:01
And so are you a traveller? Do you like travelling?

Unknown Speaker 32:06
Yeah, that's definitely one thing that I am missing it when I was working at Bumble, I was travelling so I was actually capturing over 100 flights a year. I worked out and I was going overseas all the time. I feel fortunate that I'd already gone to Sri Lanka earlier this year, just before lockdown happened. So I'm happy that I got that under my belt because that will help me kind of hang tight for a while. But I definitely am missing travelling. I think this is the longest I've been in one spot for it would have to be at least four years. So I Yeah, I definitely that's where the cabin fever is coming from, I think but I also know in the back of my mind that everything at keep it cleaner is going to begin to happen, you know, as fast as I've seen it happen in the past. So I know Won't be long before there's travel again. Well, if I am allowed to

Tommy 33:06
what do you what are you grateful for at the moment just in in this new world that we're living in?

Unknown Speaker 33:12
Oh, the strangest things like even I'm even like looking outside now and it's a bad day. I feel like I don't think like that anymore because I just want to be out in it. Do you know what I mean? I'm getting outside like the littlest things that I never even used to think of and take for granted. I'm grateful that we're all learning that at the moment, I think it's gonna make us all better people. I can say us all now, you know, telling our kids I don't know if you guys have kids, I don't but about this time, and we were trapped in doors, and just, you know, help them to appreciate those sorts of things.

Tommy 33:49
Yeah, it's I mean, he's crazy. It's so crazy. I mean, my grandfather was in the prisoner of war like he was in the generation World War Two, but I mean, he was an older grandpa. My generation. So this is this is our equivalent of something with Uber re roll

Unknown Speaker 34:05
for Uber rates. Netflix

Josh Janssen 34:12
is the Uber rates guy doesn't actually go up but Lyft and I have to go down. But other than that alertly I had to get Francoise delivered in the snow no snow Do you eat the snails cold or hot? Hot

Unknown Speaker 34:31
in college so like that would just be like, pick one up straight.

Josh Janssen 34:34
Yeah. It's a good point. But maybe it's like sushi. You know, like the good stuff. The good snacks or whatever. You can do it.

Unknown Speaker 34:43
Yeah. No, definitely bomb. And it's just cooking. Amazing. isn't like a garlic butter. I can't quite remember that there isn't that just makes it. Okay.

Tommy 34:56
Yeah, it's always interesting. Like you realise the next day that it

Josh Janssen 34:59
changes JJ expand your boundaries. Well the thing is rather like I like lots of different foods I ate French food in France. How more open Can I get out? But I had a crepe underneath the Eiffel Tower. I mean if bending your boundaries, it costs an absolute bomb. It was like I think 25 euros for a crime. And we nearly got God

Tommy 35:25
you pay you'd pay that 25 euros once again with

Josh Janssen 35:28
being inside. Exactly.

Tommy 35:31
Or have a shell shell thank you so much for coming on the show. It's it's a it's our 24 hour episode. So we're really appreciative that you were able to make it on you've been in the green room and and we haven't said anything that's too defamatory after already going for nearly six hours. So we really appreciate

Unknown Speaker 35:50
it. Thank you so much for having me. Good luck with the rest of the show.

Josh Janssen 35:55
Thanks, Michelle. It could go either way. And so what it will go it will go the way

Unknown Speaker 35:59
it will Yeah